White Growth On Head

[wxman04]

Hi, my oranda has a white cottony tuft of growth on his head, coming from the folds in the wren. This appeared overnight as a lump above his eye and the white tuft protruding out of it. The tuft grows incredibly fast - about 1/2 inch in 12 hours. It broke off and now has regrown again since yesterday. My first thought was a tumour, but then seeing the tuft growing, I think it may be a fungus.

The oranda, Fred, seems to be just as happy as ever. He eats and swims normally. Has anyone seen this before, and how should I treat it? If a fungus, should I treat the entire tank or isolate Fred in a quarantine treatment? My other goldies (not orandas) are unaffected.

Water quality - nitrates and nitrites were slightly elevated, but not in danger range. Ph is around 7.6. Water temp is near 80F, as it's summer in Texas. I'm doing a 40% water change today by vacuum. I usually do a 20-30% change every 2 weeks.

I have added a live plant (amazon sword) for the first time about 2 weeks ago, and added a log ornament last week. The tank (55 gallon) and 5 fancy goldfish are about 8-9 months old.

Here's some pictures of the tuft:

First noticed it in the morning yesterday:


Second regrowth of tuft this morning:



Any ideas what to do? Thanks!!

 

[jollysue]

The tank temp is a little high for goldies. I use frozen gel pack in the summer to cool my goldie tank outside. Fresno gets hot too in the summer.

I really can's be sure, but it sounds virulent. I would treat the tank. The heat may be a factor in stressing the fish and lowereing the immune resistance. There are no tolerable levels of NitrIte. It sould be zero level.

I would at the least treat with a combo of MelaFix and PimaFix. If that seems to help but not cleart it up, I would move to a combo of Maroxy and Maracyn or even Maroxy, Maracyn, and Maracyn 2. If it is a fungus, fungus is usually associated with a bacterial infection too. The bactyerial is usually primary and the fungal opportunistic. I actually sounds like Columnaris. although I have only seen the fungal growth fall off in extreme cases when it was cured and the dead area fell off.

 

[wxman04]

Thanks for the reply. I'm not sure what it is exactly. I can't find any similar pictures of it on the net anywhere. Though I have read orandas can be prone to infections in the wren. The tuft grew to about an inch long today and has broken off again (or the other fish nipped it off). I bought some maracyn, so I'll start treating the entire tank with that. I should use maroxy as well or wait a few days and see how this does? I didn't see the first two meds you mentioned at the store.

This wouldn't hurt the other fish any? All I have for use as a quarantine tank is a 2 gallon bucket, so I think treating the whole tank would be a better option?

As for the nitrites, I was using a little 6 in 1 strip. Couldn't really tell if the color was changed or not on the strip, but it didn't appear to be significant if it was. The water change should help, I assume, if it's high?

Thanks, I appreciate any advice you all give. This is my first experience with any sort of problem in the tank. Fred is my favorite too, so I want him well!!

 

[wxman04]

Another thing I should note, the red streaks in the tail fins (seen in the first pic) seem to be new as well. At least, I hadn't noticed it recently. Not sure if it's normal color progression or a vascular problem. I did start a new diet of hikari oranda gold pellets and Omega One shrimp pellets as an occasional treat about a week ago....

 

[jollysue]

Test strips are notoriously inaccurate. Take some water to the local pet/fish store and ask them to test it for you.

Try to bring the temp down in the tank if you can. Mine is out doors in 100 plus weather and floating cooler pac once a day keeps it from getting high. I started doing this last summer when the tank was reaching 90. It has kept the tanks cool. Stressed fish are a desease waiting to happen

MelaFix and PimaFix are natural anti biotic anti fungals. I hardly ever use them anymore.

Maroxy is an antifungal.

I do not really know what the fuzzy lump is. It could be parasitic I suppose, but I am not sure. I am more inclined to a bacterial infection with a fungal secondary infection with the dropping off thing having to do with the wren's particular character.

The red streaks, if they look like they are following the vein lines, are septicema--also bacterial. There are two kinds of bacterial infections--positive and negative gram. Maracyn and Maracyn 2 will address a broad spectrum--both positive and negative--infections. Once there is a "skin" (for want of a better word) break then a fungal infection may set in.

I choose Mardel combinations because they do not have a negative impact on the biological filtration and they are safe to use in combination, but they are expensive. That is another reason for treatment in a hospital tank--cheaper--plus it separates the sick fish.

Most infections are caused by always present bacteria and fungals that are opportunistic and take advantage of a weakened or stressed fish. Obviously the wren is an ideal spot for the nasty critters.

The anti bacterials will also take care of the septicema. Onset of a septic infection is generally good evidence that the infection has taken hold and is advanced. It is good you started with the stronger meds. You could go to the pond/cold water forum and see if any goldie enthusiasts can help more specifically. You can also pm darkangel. She is a longtimer with goldie experience.

Hope this was of some help.

 

[tttnjfttt]

Random thought - is running to Walmart an option? Since it is something unknown, It may be better to isolate the fish, atleast until you have identified what it is and what an appropriate treatment will be.

This is definitely in the weird category, i have absolutely no clue what this is. I've never seen columnaris (cotton wool bacteria) behave like that, same with true fungus. Parasite really doesn't make too much sense either because it keeps breaking off. Unfortunately, those are the three main treatable categories of fish disease.

Is the area around the worm (for lack of a better term) raised up?

On a side note, you do need to treat for septcemia like Jolly sue said.

 

[jollysue]

I have seen dead parts drop off from a columnaris/fungal combo infection. A Cory dorsal that was infected with cotton wool, dropped off at one point when it was only a fuzzy q-tip left. Fortunately the infection was controlled and the Cory survived, although he stopped breathing once druing a salt dip, he recovered--my miracle Pepper--Rocky Balboa.

Anyway, wxman has started a treatment with Maracyn, so that should be completed.

I do highly recommend that you stop in the goldie forum and pm darkangel, before you go any further.

I admit this is pretty much a shot gun approach, but the septecema needed addressing, although MelaFix would most likely has taken care of that depending on the severity.

 

[wxman04]

Thank you all for you input. It's really helped my stress level as much as Fred's!

Update - the white tuft has completely disappeared. It went away a few hours after the maracyn treatment. Fred nor the other fishies show no outward signs of distress so I think he'll be OK?
Before the maracyn, I cleaned the gravel bed really good, changed 40% water and added aquarium salt.

Fred does have a fairly large bumpy lump on the side of his head. That's were the tuft protruded from. Those both appeared overnight 2 days ago. I think the culprit may be the new log ornament I added. There's a space for the fish to hide underneath, but it's a bit of tight squeeze for Fred and he may have scrapped his head on it, which got infected.

The red streak on the tail fin may have always been there. After looking at some old baby pics, I think I saw it faintly but it wasn't very clear so not sure.

Here's some new pics just taken:

Here's the lump on Fred's head. The white tuft came from the middle of it:


Here's a look at the tail streak. It looks the same across all the tail fins:


Does the streak look bacterial?

I'll continue the full maracyn treatment and keep you updated.
Thanks!

 

[jollysue]

It is all good news! Praise the Lord!

Noe from what I can see it does not look like septicema. I'm sorry, I did not blow up the pic in the previous post to see it well. These old eyes need lots of blow upping. :=) Keep an eye on the red, and make sure it does not change in appearance.

Do change the salt out with their water changes, as goldies don't like it --- I believe.

Do keep us updated!

The Hikari Oranda and Goldie food will cause the wren to grow more outrageously, which is what it is suppose to do.

BTW, Fred is a dollface! I love Orandas!

 

[wxman04]

Well, when I got home today, the white tuft has returned. Not near as vigorous looking as before, but it's there. I'll keep up the maracyn and hope for the best.

And thanks jollysue! Fred is a cutie. He gets all the chicks. B)

PS, I hope Fred isn't a Fredericka. I never tried to sex him.

 

[jollysue]

I hear it is possible to do a gender determination on a mature goldie. Something behind the gills.

I know someone in another place who is very adept at diagnosis. I will check for you.

 

[wxman04]

Fred is doing well. No white tuft today and the lump seems to be getting smaller.

When I finish the meds, do I need to change out the water? Other than a normal changeout? The water has gotten a bit cloudy which concerns me some...

 

[jollysue]

Yes. Clean water is the best medicine.

 

[wxman04]

Another update - finished 5 days of maracyn and no change in Fred. He still has a significant lump on his head with the white tuft protruding. It looked like it subsided for a few days, but the tuft is still growing rapidly today. I'm going to start him on Maroxy and maracyn-2. Other than the tuft, he's still swimming and acting normal.

A sad twist to this, 2 days ago one of my other fancy goldies started getting listless, hiding at the bottom and gaping a lot. He's now getting quite bloated and I think some scales are starting to pine cone. his back end looks nearly paralyzed - drooping downward and hardly any tail movement. I don't think he's going to last much longer.

I'm going to do some daily water changes for a while. But, should I treat all the fish now with the meds, or better to isolate Fred? I can't really do the water changes while medicating, can I? I'm afraid the new problem with the other fish could have been caused by a med reaction? Or, more probably, water quality?

 

[jollysue]

It is unlikely that the Maracyn if administered correctly would cause a problem. Bloat and pineconing are the results frequently of internal organ damage, constipation resulting in internal infection, etc. Swim bladder is a frequent Fancy issue. Often it is caused by gulped air or sometimes by rough tank mates like koi or common goldies.