Trying to learn about Pygmy sunfish - struggling to find info!

[OliveFish05]

Hi! I was just wondering what people here know about Pygmy sunfish. I am looking online, but a lot of the things I am reading say “water hardness isn’t very important to these fish, they’re fine in anything“ which just doesn’t sound like it should be right... I am also having a hard time finding anything about their personality and temperament. Links to reputable articles on their care are greatly appreciated!

 

[ClownLurch]

Seriouslyfish.com. ?
You may need to search from google as their internal search facility bizarrely sometimes doesn’t bring up fish who are listed on their site.

 

[OliveFish05]

Just wanted to get this thread back up there where it can be seen more easily... the biggest things I am trying to figure out are if Pygmy sunfish can do well in soft water with Pygmy Cories!

 

[GaryE]

I've kept Ellasoma, two species. Why the Latin? There are two very different pygmy sunfish groups, which behave differently, look differently and need different conditions. The Ellasoma group is the one more often seen, and I have had E okeefenokee, and evergladei.
I caught the okeefenokee myself, by lifting rotting logs in a few cm of water and jamming a net under, scraping along the wood. I ten sorted through the mud and debris in the net, and removed pygmy sunfish, Heterandria formosa ("least killifish" livebearers - a fish you don't realize you want, but that you should buy if you see it) and ghost shrimp. In the open water around, also shallow, there were bluefin killies, sailfin mollies and Gambusia affinis. It was a lovely place.
The story has a point!
They like darkness, and they like to hide. I found them so beautiful it was worthwhile keeping them even if I didn't see them every time I looked for them. Kept in the open, their colours faded, but in jungle-like tanks, they were fantastic things.
They never adjusted to non live food. They did well on live freshly hatched brine shrimp and daphnia, plus the micro-organisms they got from the wood and plants. Right there, you see why something so pretty is so rare. They tended to react to movement in their food, and would let prepared food float by and rot. They are micro-predators tuned to movement, although I have heard of people getting them to eat specialty foods that didn't move. I had them for 2 generations and I never succeeded in that. I was hoping the tank raised ones I had from breeding them would be easier, but they weren't. They were also all males, which stopped my plans to keep them going both times.

 

[OliveFish05]

Wow, that is awesome! The type I have available to me are ellasoma gilberti. I have a 20 gallon densely planted tank with about 10 Pygmy Cories, it is soft water, 5 dgh with ph 7.5. I am looking for something small and unique that would work well with my Pygmy Cories.

 

[OliveFish05]

I am definitely open to least killifish if those are an option instead!

 

[ClownLurch]

I am definitely open to least killifish if those are an option instead!

So you should be as they’re the worlds coolest fish.

Theyre not the most attractive fish, or the most active but their furtive strolling around their tank makes me laugh. Mine are in a species only tank and have been for a long time but they still seem to be peeping around corners to check I’df there’s any predators about. It’s what has kept a small fish alive as a species I suppose.
Ive a bunch in a 60L tank acquired from five different breeders. I’ve no idea how many are in there now but there’s plenty of fry. I don’t know how much breeding or fry survival would happen in a community tank.

 

[GaryE]

So you should be as they’re the worlds coolest fish.

Theyre not the most attractive fish, or the most active but their furtive strolling around their tank makes me laugh. Mine are in a species only tank and have been for a long time but they still seem to be peeping around corners to check I’df there’s any predators about. It’s what has kept a small fish alive as a species I suppose.
Ive a bunch in a 60L tank acquired from five different breeders. I’ve no idea how many are in there now but there’s plenty of fry. I don’t know how much breeding or fry survival would happen in a community tank.

They are NOT the coolest. But for such a colourless fish, they are really close to the coolest livebearer, at least. I have no idea why I ended up liking them so much, but I did.

E. gilberti is a fish I would get in a heartbeat, but they probably would thrive more in a single species tank. For reference, when I went fishing in Florida, it was colder there than when I left my home in Canada. The water was at 10c, and the air just above zero celsius in a very unseasonal, freakish cold snap. I never put a heater with my Elassoma, but allowed their tank to roll with the natural seasons in my then basement. They wouldn't breed in cooler conditions, but I will never forget how brilliantly coloured the first male okeefenokee was when I saw it my net. It was breathtaking (or maybe the sun by late afternoon meant I could no longer see my breath there).

I had the H formosa in water bottles in my hotel room to be able to later bag and bring them home, and they actually dropped fry 24 hours after capture.

 

[OliveFish05]

E. gilberti is a fish I would get in a heartbeat, but they probably would thrive more in a single species tank

Hmmm. Even pygmy cories would likely be a detriment to them? That is a shame. Are they shy and skittish?

 

[GaryE]

Very shy. Imagine being that size in a river. What a nerve wracking life!
The Ellasoma I caught were on the borders of a large, rather wide river, with big predators in the deeper water and millions of birds.

 

[OliveFish05]

Very shy. Imagine being that size in a river. What a nerve wracking life!
The Ellasoma I caught were on the borders of a large, rather wide river, with big predators in the deeper water and millions of birds.

Oh I bet. So what about the Pygmy cories would be stressful for the sunfish? I am trying to understand better. In my experience the Pygmy cories are not especially active, they kind wiggle around the back edges of the tank, and occasionally come to the surface for air. They’re definitely smaller than the Ellasoma gilberti. Would a pleco be compatible? I have a bristlenose currently that I am able to move to a family members 75 gallon

 

[WhistlingBadger]

Here's a video about them. It seems that many North American freshwater fish are quite adaptable with water hardness and pH. Sounds like these might be no exception.

 

[WhistlingBadger]

This guy also says they completely ignore other species.

 

[OliveFish05]

I found a forum that focuses on native fish, and a few people seem to suggest that they do well with Pygmy cories

 

[Kolykaf]

Funny I should come across this post right after I entered my Elassoma gilberti bowl in the tank of the month contest…I’m new to keeping them- I just got 2 pairs 6 week ago. One pair have their own 3.5 gallon bowl, the other are in a 20 gallon long with about 3 dozen CPD offspring from last summer’s outdoor tub. Both pairs are doing very well. Males colored up to the nines in a matter of days. As mentioned by other posters, they are quite shy so lots of plants, rocks, driftwood, etc. will make them feel secure. I keep them in soft water (Gh 5, Kh 1). They apparently have a wide temperature range (ideally 60-75F but can tolerate 40-86F). The bowl has no heater (currently around 67F) and the 20 gallon is kept at 74F. They will not touch food that’s not alive. I feed mostly daphnia and black worms. They don’t seem to interact with the CPDs at all. I’ve already got fry in both tanks, but lots more in the bowl (presumably because there are no other fish to predate upon them). They don’t seem to eat their own fry, but from what I read online, they will eat other couples’ fry (and larger juvies will eat smaller). Here is one of my males: