Tall Low Tech Plants?

[cowgirluntamed]

I have a 20 gallon high tank and am looking for some taller low tech plants that can go in the back. I've tried some crypt retrospiralis but it doesn't seem to be growing as fast (if at all now really) as I would like. Would regular jungle val be too tall for this tank? I've tried the corkscrew val in it and it didn't grow well. I wasn't sure if the regular val would be more hardy or not. I have some crypt wendtii that is doing well. It even made a baby! I think my dwarf sag might be slowly growing. I'm wanting to try pygmy chain sword for a foreground and either wisteria or Brazilian pennywort for a floating plant. Right now I am battling different algae and cyanobacteria. So I have to be careful. I also want to get Malaysian trumpet snails soon. I had to order an intake sponge kit though that is supposed to be here some time today. I figured after that snails first...then if I can get the cyanobacteria under control...and hair algae...(then it's just green spot and a bit of brush algae.) Oh, I also have anubias nangi that is doing well. I think the cyanobacteria killed off my nice Nana...oh well.

I have tried reducing the intensity and duration of light. Now it's time for a few other tactics. Other than getting snails to hopefully help with reducing organics...taking out some of the dying plants....cleaning filter well....i need to keep up with water changes especially because I haven't. And I'm switching fish foods. Turns out my seachem nutridiet tropical flakes had a bit too many fillers. So I'm switching to omega one tropical flakes. Maybe this can reduce organics too. (Twice a week I also give my tetras either hikari freeze dried daphnia, bloodworms, tubifex worms, or spirulina brine shrimp.) Oh...and I will start a new thread about the algae and cyanobacteria so I can do a bit of a journal on what I do to see if things work or not. So anybody that needs help can look at what I'm doing. That will be a bit later today. Mostly I need plant ideas! Lol

 

[Byron]

Responding on the plant question.  Jungle Vall I would not recommend; the leaves can attain over 3 feet, and pruning to keep them shorter usually kills the plant.  The corkscrew Vall would not quite reach the surface of a 20g but close, though you had no luck with this one.  Maybe your water is soft?  Or light is insufficient.
 
Given what has worked for you, Java Fern is one to try; attach it to a chunk of rock or wood, then you can place it where you like.  This plant is good in front of filter returns as it does not mind current (many plants do).  Slow growing, but once established tends to do well.  The common Amazon sword might work; it can get huge, but I have had this plant grow close to the surface in my smaller tanks and remain there for some time.
 
Byron.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Nope, I've got moderately hard water. I think the corkscrew val actually likes more light. It was growing runners in my 5 gallon without tannins at one point until hair algae almost killed it. But it won't grow in the 20 where there is a lot of tannins from my driftwood. I actually have tried Java fern(I believe it was the windeluv version) before and it didn't do real well. I had a different light though and I think I killed some of it by smothering the rhizome in some Malaysian driftwood....but maybe I could try some again. I suppose it would be worth a shot.

Would the ruffled amazon sword be ok? The seller I've bought good plants from before has this as well as the regular. I kind of like the ruffled look. Lol. (They also have the regular Java fern, the windeluv, and the trident Java fern. Would any of these be ok or should I just stick with the regular?)

I think I might look to see if there are any other anubias species that might fit in the back as well. They do grow well. I also want to add more crypt wendtii close together and get them to grow taller like I did in my five gallon. Lol. They look awesome that way.

One more question...would the wisteria be a good choice for a floating plant in the 20 gallon or would the roots get too long for it? Thanks for the help again Byron!

 

[Byron]

Wisteria (Hygrophila difformis) can be left to float.  It is noted for massive root systems, but fish like these.  Needs good light.
 
Ruffled sword is presumably Echinodorus major.  I have three of these in my 70g.  I found them about the same for lighting as the common sword, Echinodorus grisebachii (or E. bleherae under the old name).
 
The common Java Fern seems a bit more resilient, in my experience.  Like less light, or under floating plants.  I let is do what it wanted in my 33g for over a year, and it became massive.  The three photos below show the same clump, in (1) June 2012, (2) Feb 2015, and (3) Feb 2016.  I then pulled it apart, and have bits in three different tanks, now beginning to spread.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Wow! All the way across the tank! Amazing! I think I will stick to the regular to try the Java fern again. I'm not sure which sword I will go with yet but at least I have a choice on those two. I still may wait a bit to see if I can get this algae and cyanobacteria under control. I just got done cleaning the tank and filter good, Put in the intake sponge which....is laying in the sand...oh well...lol. and I drilled a bunch of holes in my spray bar to see if it helped reduce the flow a bit. Might have worked. Anyway, thanks again! I think I have a cool vision of what I want it to look like. Hopefully the plants will cooperate!

 

[NickAu]

I love Blue Stricta( Hygrophila corymbosa ) stuff grows like a weed in my tanks.
 
 
Floating Water sprite is also great this stuff grows huge in no time I have it in all my tanks and have no problems with algae .

 

[StevenF]

I wouldn't buy new plants until you determine why your plants are not growing or why they are growing so slowly.  Snails probably won't resolve the situation until you get good plant growth.
 

 
 
I have tried reducing the intensity and duration of light.

What type of light do you have .  If your light is not adequate to begin with reducing the light might hurt the plants more than the the algae making the situation worse.  Determine what your lumen per square inch rating is if it is low increase the lighting.  See this article http/fotohobbist.com/blog/aquarium-lighting-for-planted-aquariums/#more-136
 

 
 
i need to keep up with water changes especially because I haven't. And I'm switching fish foods. Turns out my seachem nutridiet tropical flakes had a bit too many fillers. 

 
if your plants are not growing and your water changes are not sufficient you could get a buildup of phosphate in the water.   While plants need phosphate too much can inhibit plant growth.  Some plants will be effected more than others more than others.  Algae love high phosphate water.

 
 
Other than getting snails to hopefully help with reducing organics...taking out some of the dying plants....cleaning filter well

Snails will eat up dead plants and excess food.  however the organics many people blame as the cause of algae growth are organic molecules dissolved in water such as tannins.  Snails will not remove these.  Bacteria, algae and plants are the only things that can consume dissolved organics.  also keep in mind that as far as I know, no one makes a cheap test kit for organics.  Meaning if someone blames organics as the cause of a algae bloom they are not basing that on scientific evidence and we don't even know if he had excess organics.  i am not saying that the claim that organics cause algae is wrong.  What I am saying is that it might be something else.  The only way anyone has for testing for organics is to fill a glass with tank water and another with tap water and compare color and clarity.  
 
From my personal experience nutrient deficiencies are a major cause of slow plant growth.  Just missing one nutrient in the water could cause slow growth or even kill the plant.  Are you using any fertilizer?  If so which fertilizer and does it cover all the  macro and trace nutrients listed in this wikipedia article? https/en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_nutrition  If you don't fertilize or your fertilizer doesn't cover all macro and micro nutrients you likely have a nutrient deficiency that is causing the slow growth.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

I love Blue Stricta( Hygrophila corymbosa ) stuff grows like a weed in my tanks.
 
 
Floating Water sprite is also great this stuff grows huge in no time I have it in all my tanks and have no problems with algae .

Thanks Nick, I'll look it up.



To StevenF--

I don't plan on getting plants quite yet as I want to see if I can get things balanced with what I have at the moment. I want to get the mts anyway though. I think they would be more beneficial and help spread things through the sand than not having any at all.

My light is the fluval aquasky LED. I had it at full white light intensity and knocked that down a couple of notches. As well as putting full intensity on the red and blue lights with only a tiny bit of green. I came to this following some of Byron's advice in experimenting with intensity and duration. He doesn't have experience with this light but mentioned the red and blue was maybe used more than green I think(or at least that was my conclusion). Mostly I am just experimenting and trying to see what works right now.

Yes, I was wondering if the lack of water changes is a big initiator of my algae and the plants not growing. When I first put these plants in here I added some flourish root tabs(2 only where these crypt retrospiralis were) and was trying to use the aqueon liquid plant food. I ended up with bba. Still dealing with that some. So I stopped using that and I think its slowed down but due to lack of water changes I think that could be why it's hanging on and why I have the other stuff as well. (I have not used any other fertilizer since I stopped using the aqueon except for those 2 original root tabs that are in there.)

I'm not blaming organics in and of itself...lol. I know there are a ton of factors and each system is different. I do have tannins in the water. Oh and I'm on well water as well, moderately hard.

So right now I'm just trying to figure out what works and what plants I can have some hopeful success with if I can get the balance right. I definitely don't want to put plants in there if this cyanobacteria and a bit of hair algae keeps coming back. The green spot is at least in the glass, the bba is mostly in the back and on the spray bar. I'm going to post later this morning when lights come on a sort of journal on my journey to deal with this balance issue. (Got the tank cleaned good today and I did a before vid and I wanted to do an after vid after things settled down a bit.) Maybe we can discuss more on that there when I get it up and running.

 

[NickAu]

Blue Stricta is in the back on the right side of the tank

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Thanks Nick! Looks awesome!

 

[NickAu]

Heres my secret to green healthy plants, I do nothing for them, I do not use fertilizer, I do not vacuum the substrate, I just change 50% of the water once a week. I feed my Betta, Shrimp, Bn Pleco and Assassin snails they  poop and that feeds the plants. I use Indian Almond Leaf however I do not remove the old leaves I just let them rot in the tank, If a plant sheds a leaf or 2 I do not bother to remove them they are left to rot in the tank also.
 
I have even stopped testing the water as Ammonia Nitrite and Nitrate are always zero.
 
Once a month I put in about 10 Trumpet or Rams Horn snails gives the Assassins something to hunt, and sometimes I squash a Ramshorn for my Betta to eat.
 
Heres the filter I use,
https/www.amazon.com/Elite-A902-Double-Sponge-Filter/dp/B0002AQH00
 
and this light
http/www.ebay.com.au/itm/Aquarium-LED-Light-2Mode-Bright-Freshwater-Fish-Tank-White-Blue-Light-AU-Stock-/231736957242?var=&hash=item35f499593a:m:m3SQHcLOYe91ueGYpyYepQg

 

[cowgirluntamed]

That's what I would like to get to Nick. To not have to do anything with any of it except water changes! I know the tetras would be happier. They hate me messing around in the tank. Lol. Or even being near it really....anyway, thanks for the ideas!

 

[StevenF]

 
 
Heres my secret to green healthy plants, I do nothing for them, I do not use fertilizer, I do not vacuum the substrate, I just change 50% of the water once a week.

What works for you may not work for others.  Some people have very soft water from the utility or have to use DO or distilled water.  If you don't fertilize your plants will die.  Others may have soft or hard water but are lacking some key trace nutrients  and the resulting slow plant growth will give algae an advantage.  
 
Water utilitiies are under no obligation to deliver water ideal for plants.  In many cases the water from the tap is very soft rain water or increasingly RO.  Even well water may have very low PH (5 or so due to CO2), high nitrates, high phosphates, or simply lacks trace nutrients.  In other cases well water may be too hard for fish and in fact may not even be safe to drink.  In some cases the tap water comes from a large river with a lot of marshes, and forests along the banks.  If you are lucky to have river or marsh water, this water probably has almost all the nutrients you need.
 
So in a lot of cases it is just luck that some people have ideal water out of the tap for plants.  For many others that is not the case.