Plants Melting, Holes In The Leaves, Twisted Growth After Substrate Ch

[snazy]

Yes, the balance is gone out of the window it seems. The anubias used to be flourishing and I had to trim quite a few leaves melting yesterday. I've decreased the light to 6 hours and I decreased the surface movement to what is the minimum in any tank I've kept, worried about the fish slightly but they seem ok so far. I trimmed the bad growth and I'll see how it goes. I did dose easylife micro ferts in case something else is lacking, though the soil should contain a full range of micro ferts. The old gravel was well established and even the swords used to be going better than in my other liquid CO2/micro/macro ferts tank. I wouldn't have bothered changing to soil/sand but only for the corys. And at the moment, the fish don't like it, specifically my pygmy corys. They've been hiding since. I can barely see them and they used to be so outgoing. It's amazing what changing the substrate can do to a tank. I thought I'd see a massive improvement, but naah. I don't even like the black substrate/black background combo really. Looks artificial. Hope algae doesn't hit it as well.

 

[SO19Firearms]

I'd certainly concede to anyone who can give me a reason as to why the nutrients being increased isn't causing the problem,

It took me a while to get my head around that until I realised you're right. lol
I think you absolutely can mess around trying to find balance, using some of the macro nutrients to limit growth etc but unless you know what you're doing or even better doing it to find out what will happen then it's not generally a good idea.
Where a tank is different lies in the available CO2 and you get to control the lighting (As you already mentioned, we tend not to be CO2 limited IRL, although if you add high light to a grow tent and inject CO2...you'll see the increase too)

To keep it simple I think you should always make sure you have enough ferts - this rules out deficiency. After that you need to make sure you enough CO2 - "Enough CO2" is determined by the amount of light you have...keep it low and you'll have enough CO2...

I recieved a PM the day before yesterday on a different forum, two quotes that stuck out the most -

I think folks spend way too much time on ferts generally. Amano thinks the same thing, and ADG does also, most top folks actually end up coming to the same/similar conclusions over time. It's the intermediate folks that know enough to cause issues that are the problem

They too, will learn, in due time.
[....]
I stopped focusing on ferts. Soil, light, CO2 mostly.

Personally, I listen to him. He knows a bit

 

[eaglesaquarium]

I agree, he does. I've followed his work a few different places, and makes some outrageously awesome tanks!


The last quote is the one that I find most interesting... specifically, the inclusion of the word "soil". Isn't that the root cause of what we're discussing? Wasn't it the change in the substrate (soil) that's causing the issue?

I agree that lighting is the biggest factor, as it is in terrestrial growing. You can't grow tomatoes in winter, because there just isn't enough light. Similarly, there are certain aquatics plants that don't do well in low light. Equally, there are plants that do far better in low light.


I guess the question is: Would dosing Excel (or any other carbon source) or cutting the lights be equally comparable solutions (not including cost) to the problem?


I'm still fairly new to the planted aquarium, and am trying to learn as much as possible, so don't be afraid to get as technical as necessary or to tell me I'm flat wrong. I can take it! ;-P

 

[snazy]

The plants keep melting, it's very fast, like a complete meltdown and is now affecting the entire plants so I am not sure it's just a CO2 issue. Is it possible something else to cause that and not just CO2 because it looks rather strange? I thought CO2 limits the growth rate in most cases? I haven't seen holes in the leaves from a CO2 problem prior to this but is the twisted new growth caused by that too I wonder? The way it's going now it looks the plants are literally melting, not just holes.
I've often moved the hydrophilla across 4 tanks, 3 of which including this one don't get CO2 and it grew like crazy regardless but this tank has a major issue it seems. I am afraid everything will die off or at least melt to the bottom. The anubias is holding on mostly for now, but the hydrophilla and the swords ain't doing good at all.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Are there diseases that the plants could be susceptible to?

 

[snazy]

Are there diseases that the plants could be susceptible to?

I don't know really

 

[eaglesaquarium]

I understand your frustration! I'm just thinking that terrestrial plants have their new growth affected by disease - fungus and the like... Maybe there was something like that in the new substrate and your tank gave it a chance to develop.

 

[snazy]

Who knows what's in that soil really.... Soil needs months to settle under water in some cases so it may eventually get going. All I know it was supposed to be better even for a low tech tank but in my case so far it's not going good. I'll give it a chance, maybe once the plants melt they'll adapt and grow. It takes ages though. I have no intention to add CO2 in a tank with plants that never need CO2 normally. It's not heavily planted either.