Ph Going Down, Everything Else Staying The Same

[AlitaConejita]

Hi all,
I'm on day 18/19 of a fish less cycle and getting frustrated.
I did a water baseline on day 0/1:
pH: 7.6, ammonia: 0, nitrites: 0, nitrates: 0

I used Dr.Tim's ammonia for fish less cycles. The bottle says to add 1 drop per gallon but I ended up having to use 4 drops per gallon to get the ammonia between 2ppm and 4 ppm. That's why my cycle days are weird, I dosed the tank multiple times on the first day but didn't get to the required ppm, I let the water sit over night and the next morning, after confirming the ammonia was less than 2ppm, I did another dose to get it above 2 ppm.

I followed the pinned directions and when I check the water on days 3ish and 7ish, nothing had changed (pH 7.6, ammonia about 3 ppm, nitrite 0, nitrate 0). On day 8ish I added another gallon of water to make up for water evaporation. I tested the parameters before adding the water and an hour or so after adding the water. Both times the nitrate test came out a little orange but not enough to be categorized on the API color scale as notably above zero, the other tests stayed the same as on days 3&7.

I've been testing every other day since, sometimes the nitrate test comes out a bit orange and sometimes it stays totally yellow, so I'm guessing that test is not very reliable.

On day 12ish, the ammonia was below 1ppm, but nitrite still a clear blue (0) so re dosed the ammonia back to 2-4ppm. (All other test stayed the same). I started testing daily at this point and I've noticed the pH slowly going down. It is now at about 7.2. Nitrites/Nitrates still 0. The ammonia looks a little lighter green but still between 2 and 4 ppm. The water has evaporated enough that I could add another gallon.

I have a sponge filter working in the tank since day 1, and I added a heater on day 15. Prior to day 15, the water was in the low 70s F, now the water is at 80 F. All the water I've used has been dechlorinated using reptisafe.

Should I worry about the pH going down? Should I add more water again? When can I expect to finally see some nitrite?

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Yes you should. Dr Tim's ammonium chloride is designed to produce 2 ppm of of NH3-N using 1 drop/gal. A lot of folks have problems with discrepancies between the dosing and the testing. I have used this product for a while and am just used to it. I use it to feed my biofarm tank and just squirt a bunch in- not a thing I would ever suggest anybody else do. I have a hunch there may be issues either with the strength of the product or how it shows up on certain tests. I can not figure out the science behind why based on the product and it's ingredients
 
I would simply use 1.5 drops/gal and no more and not worry about how high the ammonia reads to start. Assume it is higher than the test shows, You are getting readings for ammonia dropping but the lack of the one for nitrite is not good. There is basically only one place dropping ammonia goes, to nitrite. And it becomes more ppm of nitrite than the number of ppm it was as ammonia.
 
Too much nitrite in a tank can actually read 0 on a tank. Too much ammonia as well as the cycling process will drop pH. Finally, the ammonia folks cycle with is ammonium hydroxide which is very acid, the ammonium chloride is more acid. Adding too much could be a pH dropper for that reason as well.
 
Finally, since you have 0 nitrate in your tap, your readings there are probably false. As you noted those kits are awful. In addition, they work by turning nitrate to nitrite and measuring that.
 
There are a couple of things I can suggest. One is to make sure your nitrites are not actually off the charts. This can read 0 on the tests. Doing this requires one dilute the water sample, To get accurate results it is best to use distilled or RO/DI water. Distilled is readily and cheaply available at super markets and many pharmacy stores. If you are interested in doing this, PM me if you don't know how. Based on the results of this testing I would suggest what to do.
 
The other solution is to reset the tank by doing a really huge water change. Dose the dechlor at the normal rate and wait 24 hours if it is one that also detoxifies ammonia (no wait needed if it doesn't do this). Then redose ammonia. But this is where you have two choices. One is to use Dr. Tim's ammonium chloride at 1.5 drops/gal. and do not worry about how it tests as at the lower action levels suggested the tests seem to go fine. The other is to use a different ammonia and use the ammonia dosing chart here. The ones suggested are all ammonium hydroxide and seem not to have issues with testing. Ace hardware janitorial strength Ammonia should work. Its 10% strength. Use the ammonia calculator in the site and don' forget to reduce the supposed tank volume by 10-15% to account for the glass and the decor. The desired dose is for 3 ppm.

 

[macphyter]

The other solution is to reset the tank by doing a really huge water change. Dose the dechlor at the normal rate and wait 24 hours if it is one that also detoxifies ammonia (no wait needed if it doesn't do this). Then redose ammonia. But this is where you have two choices. One is to use Dr. Tim's ammonium chloride at 1.5 drops/gal. and do not worry about how it tests as at the lower action levels suggested the tests seem to go fine. The other is to use a different ammonia and use the ammonia dosing chart here. The ones suggested are all ammonium hydroxide and seem not to have issues with testing. Ace hardware janitorial strength Ammonia should work. Its 10% strength. Use the ammonia calculator in the site and don' forget to reduce the supposed tank volume by 10-15% to account for the glass and the decor. The desired dose is for 3 ppm.

 
Question-  what happens if you use dechlor which detoxifies ammonia and you DON'T wait 24 hours?  I've been using Aqueon water conditioner, under the assumption that it doesn't detoxify ammonia.  I've been adding it to my tap water, and letting it sit for a couple hours before using it.  Just now I looked at the bottle, and at the bottom of the fine print is the statement that it "detoxifies ammonia".   Could this be the reason that I've been having so much trouble getting my tank cycled?
 
In any case, I'll be going back to the pet store to pick up some Prime to use instead.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Prime does too. And they all claim it wont slow a cycle and they are incorrect. Most will tell you it dissipates after 24 hours, some don't. You gain no real edge switching from what you have to Prime, imo.
 
I recommend you follow one of the suggestions I offered above

 

[daizeUK]

I used Dr.Tim's ammonia for fish less cycles. The bottle says to add 1 drop per gallon but I ended up having to use 4 drops per gallon to get the ammonia between 2ppm and 4 ppm.

 
Just so you know, I had the same problem with Dr Tim's ammonium chloride and the API ammonia test.  I wasn't sure which to believe!  I decided to trust Dr Tim's directions and ignore the API reading because I was afraid of adding too much ammonia (as we know too much ammonia can slow or stall a cycle).  My cycle completed successfully in two weeks so I would recommend doing the same for your future doses.  Your readings sound typical of a cycle where too much ammonia has been added.