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New tank, new post! Woohoo!!

Discussion in 'Tropical Discussion' started by FishAuntie, May 25, 2019.

  1. FishAuntie

    FishAuntie Fish Fanatic

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    Thanks for the heads up! With any luck I’ll be starting mine within a couple weeks. I’d really love kicking it off! The wait is killer.

    I just put an online order in for some things including the no spill python! Getting quarantine meds as well as a properly sized air pump for the adorable treasure chest bubbler I bought. Also I’ve already picked up some more awesome decor for my tank and the quarantine one: A nice big mountain/coral looking thing, set of pipes, the front half of a pirate ship (to make it look like it’s crashing into the tank), and a hollow tree trunk. I should’ve snapped a picture but life has been crazy!

    Ps: 5/6 betta bulbs doing awesome! The control bulb is the lone fail. Very pleased with them so far.
     
  2. Colin_T

    Colin_T Member

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    Don't buy medications unless your fish are sick and you know what is wrong with them.

    Medications go off over time and if you don't use them, they are poisons sitting around the house doing nothing.

    ----------------------------
    In my opinion, the Python water change system is not the best for fish because it pumps tapwater back into the tank and this can cause chlorine/ chloramine poisoning to fish. Any new tap water should be dechlorinated before it is added to an aquarium containing fish, shrimp or snails.

    The best way to water change fish tanks is with a gravel cleaner. You can connect them to a garden hose and run it out the door onto the lawn. Use a clean hose to fill up a bucket of water, add dechlorinator and aerate it for at least 5 (preferably 30) minutes, and then use that water to fill the tank. If you make up the water before doing the gravel clean, it will be dechlorinated by the time you have drained the tank. You can then use a small water pump and length of hose to pump the water from the bucket into the tank, or if it's a small tank, pick the bucket up and pour it into the aquarium.

    Whilst dechlorinators neutralise chlorine as soon as they come in contact with the chlorine/ chloramine, it can take a few minutes of circulating before the dechlorinator has neutralised all of the chlorine/ chloramine in the water.

    The aeration also helps get the dissolved gasses in the water back to their normal levels. When water is under pressure, the gasses in the water can be forced out. This means the tap water might not have any oxygen, carbon dioxide or nitrogen gas in it. If you use water without any of these gasses in, or the gasses are not in the correct ratios, the fish can die. Aerating the water for 30 minutes helps to get the dissolved gasses back into their correct ratios.
     
  3. ReMz

    ReMz Member

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    I am glad you are so excited and obviously doing a lot of research and planning before setting up your future tank!

    I've have absolutely no problem for many years using a python to drain and fill directly to the tank with dechlorinator. Get the temp right, pour in the water treatment, flip the switch on the faucet. Have done it with 5g tanks up to 125g tanks. No fussing around with buckets. If I had very sensitive fish, I would fill bucket ahead of time.

    On another note, take a look at some of the planted tank journals here in the forums. I started with colorful gravel, fake plants, and tacky decor when I first started.... then quickly became a convert to natural scapes with live plants that bring nature indoors. You may have 20 changes of mind in design before you decide on a plan! Good luck!

    Edit: A side note with the python. I drain the tank with the faucet at max flow. I fill the tank very slowly. Just blasting water in would be a bad plan for chlorine poisoning and disturbing everything in the tank with current. Just a nice, gentle flow. I usually dose dechlor 2x while filling to equal the max recommended dosage. 100% worth buying one. The faucet attachment sucks and will break. Buy the replacement fitting instead of a whole new unit when this happens.
     
    #33 ReMz, Jun 12, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
  4. FishAuntie

    FishAuntie Fish Fanatic

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    Thanks for the heads up guys! One correction - I bought quarantine meds, not emergency ones. I know not everyone likes adding extraneous things during QT time, but I intend to due to the different fish I intend to get, the amount they’ll cost, and knowing my LFS has dealt with a few of the illnesses before.

    My python plan is to use buckets to let the water naturally dechlorinate although obviously I’ll treat it too. The reason is that the tank will be in the living room (carpet). The last thing I want is to haul buckets through it. So I was thinking the buckets would go under the tank stand, be python filled ahead of time, and then use the python to suck out the water when it’s time to change. It might take some tweaking but I figured having a dedicated piece of equipment would help moving the water without disturbing the household & that was really the reason for it. :)
     
  5. PheonixKingZ

    PheonixKingZ Fish Herder
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    That sounds like a good Idea! :)
     
  6. Byron

    Byron Member

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    This is not a good idea, and ironically, more likely to cause fish disease/loss than doing nothing.

    .All fish disease is directly caused by stress. The pathogen must obviously be present, but it is stress that weakens the fish's immune system and weakens the fish generally so that they can not adequately deal with the pathogen. Clean water and minimal stress will do more benefit with new fish.

    Any substance added to the water gets inside the fish, and this causes stress because the fish must react to it. With the fish already in a weakened state (the capture/transport/new environment is severe stress) the last thing you want is to be adding more stress. Introducing the new fish to an established tank (even if the QT) and leaving them alone (aside from water changes and feeding obviously) for a few weeks is the best method.

    Consider that in their habitat, fish do not get any of these medications, yet they avoid the pathogens; if not, they would have died off thousands of years ago and we wouldn't have them now. Clean water is the key, along with a quiet environment. The latter involves numbers of fish in the species (shoaling fish requiring a group, etc), compatible species, and a natural aquascape (providing what the fish "expects" from its environment) is key.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  7. FishAuntie

    FishAuntie Fish Fanatic

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    I understand your point but politely disagree. I read up on the do nothing method and dislike it. Based on what I read preventatives are well worth doing and plenty of credible fish authorities medicate QT fish so it’s not abnormal at all. That’s the route I will take.
     
  8. Colin_T

    Colin_T Member

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    The only medication that should be used on healthy looking fish (that show no signs of disease) while in quarantine, is to deworm them. Treat them with Praziquantel to kill off any tapeworm and gill flukes. And Levamisole to treat any thread/ round worms they are carrying.

    There is absolutely no reason to expose fish to any chemicals or medication unless they have a disease, with the exception of deworming products, which are safe for fish.

    Most fish medications are made from poisonous carcinogenic chemicals.
    eg: Malachite Green (aka Victoria Green), is used to treat external protozoan infections but causes cancer.
    Formaldehyde or Formalin, is used to treat bacteria and fungus, this is used for preserving things like bodies.
    Trichlorphon, is used to kill external parasites, but is a known carcinogen.

    Exposing healthy fish to these types of chemicals is not necessary and can shorten their lives.

    Many years ago everybody was given chest x-rays as part of a screening program. The x-ray machines pumped out huge amounts of x-ray radiation. People were deliberately exposed to these x-rays even though they didn't need to be. X-rays are known to cause cancer and new machines produce significantly less radiation than their earlier counterparts.

    You wouldn't tell every healthy person to have a full body x-ray or cat scan because it is not necessary and can cause them to develop cancer. But you are willing to expose your fish to poisonous chemicals that could shorten their lives.

    If the fish show signs of a disease whilst in quarantine, then treat them. But if they don't show any signs or develop any symptoms, do not expose them to chemicals unnecessarily.
     
  9. ReMz

    ReMz Member

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    I agree and disagree. The fact of the matter is we are subjecting fish to very unnatural living conditions when they are in an aquarium, no matter how hard we try. So preemptive treatment makes sense.

    On the other hand, you really can cause more harm than good by unnecessarily exposing healthy fish to chemicals. I would lean towards having a clean quarantine tank with no added meds.

    I haven't had to medicate a fish in a very long time. Usually clean water, correct temp, and a stress free environment do wonders.
     
  10. FishAuntie

    FishAuntie Fish Fanatic

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    If I had said I was going to do something dangerous I would understand the reaction. But to jump down my throat after I bought something that’s made to be preemptively done is ridiculous. Thank you PheonixKingZ & the others that helped me early on, but I’m moving to a less judgmental forum.
     
  11. Colin_T

    Colin_T Member

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    I'm not trying to judge you, I simply don't like things being exposed to chemicals and treatments if it's not necessary. You wouldn't take anti-biotics if you weren't sick so why put things in a tank with healthy fish.
     
  12. Byron

    Byron Member

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    Interesting how one is criticized for offering sound advice that will without question benefit the fish. Just because someone doesn't happen to agree...I would want to know, just what is that person's level of biological understanding of how fish live/function physiologically? I have gone into this in considerable depth, and the fact that no reputable authority disagrees should tell us something.
     

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