Mopani Bog Wood

[lilfishie]

Same 5teady, mines been in a week now and no change

 

[gemzie78]

i made the mistake of not even washing mine lol i had to do loads of water changes afterwards.

 

[minxfishy]

Yeah I know the fish wont mind the tannins, I would prefer to actually be able to see them though Not that I even know what to put in it yet

 

[Gilli]

Bought mine off of Ebay from someone who had already soaked it and had a plant rooted on it - it looks fantstic and no brown water!!

 

[TheMerovingian]

the bog wood you all have and are boiling? did you but them in a shop?

 

[5teady_2012]

I get my all my tank wood from my most hated store grrrr p@h

But their wood is good and cheap hehe

 

[TheMerovingian]

so even if you get the wood for a shop, you still have to boil it

 

[5teady_2012]

so even if you get the wood for a shop, you still have to boil it

From a shop***

I just run mine under hot water for a while, whilst rubbing it with my hands (sounds bit rude that lol)

 

[minxfishy]

And this is what happens to a tannin soaked tank AFTER a 95% water change

 

[Miss Wiggle]

its worth saying, as i do no end of times, this brown stuff is actually good for your fish, even better if you have inverts. the colour reduces as you continue to do your weekly water changes. so if you are worried it may harm your stock, don't! if its the colour you don't like, consider if you really want to reduce the quality of the water you have in the tank. if you do, a small filter filled with carbon will do a good job of clearing the water, remember to change the carbon every other day, minimum. but if you can, its best to leave it.

Slightly confused, what good effects do tannine's have on fish in egneral as you have said?

while it's clear that it does no harm, i've never heard before that it is significantly beneficial, the way you've said that saying you reducing the quality of water by removing tannines kind of makes it sound like they have some sort of magical properties which they really dont.

yes wood will sometimes drop the pH down which some fish will like, but some fish would hate that so you can't blanket say that it's good for fish......

 

[raptorrex]

its worth saying, as i do no end of times, this brown stuff is actually good for your fish, even better if you have inverts. the colour reduces as you continue to do your weekly water changes. so if you are worried it may harm your stock, don't! if its the colour you don't like, consider if you really want to reduce the quality of the water you have in the tank. if you do, a small filter filled with carbon will do a good job of clearing the water, remember to change the carbon every other day, minimum. but if you can, its best to leave it.

Slightly confused, what good effects do tannine's have on fish in egneral as you have said?

while it's clear that it does no harm, i've never heard before that it is significantly beneficial, the way you've said that saying you reducing the quality of water by removing tannines kind of makes it sound like they have some sort of magical properties which they really dont.

yes wood will sometimes drop the pH down which some fish will like, but some fish would hate that so you can't blanket say that it's good for fish......

perhaps the title tannins is at fault. true tannic acid is only a small part of what we all call tannin staining. humic acid, natural oils and some vitamins are amongst the things in what we call tannins. i am afraid you will have to hunt down the relevant information, as it seems not yet to be published in a single bit of research, and draw your own conclusions. the most difficult thing is finding, exactly, what these bits of wood do leach.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

its worth saying, as i do no end of times, this brown stuff is actually good for your fish, even better if you have inverts. the colour reduces as you continue to do your weekly water changes. so if you are worried it may harm your stock, don't! if its the colour you don't like, consider if you really want to reduce the quality of the water you have in the tank. if you do, a small filter filled with carbon will do a good job of clearing the water, remember to change the carbon every other day, minimum. but if you can, its best to leave it.

Slightly confused, what good effects do tannine's have on fish in egneral as you have said?

while it's clear that it does no harm, i've never heard before that it is significantly beneficial, the way you've said that saying you reducing the quality of water by removing tannines kind of makes it sound like they have some sort of magical properties which they really dont.

yes wood will sometimes drop the pH down which some fish will like, but some fish would hate that so you can't blanket say that it's good for fish......

perhaps the title tannins is at fault. true tannic acid is only a small part of what we all call tannin staining. humic acid, natural oils and some vitamins are amongst the things in what we call tannins. i am afraid you will have to hunt down the relevant information, as it seems not yet to be published in a single bit of research, and draw your own conclusions. the most difficult thing is finding, exactly, what these bits of wood do leach.

so basically what you're saying is you have no evidence to support your claims.........

sorry but if you make a point and someone counters it, just saying to them 'research it yourself but there's not really any info on it' does not cut the mustard. Hardly a persuasive argument

 

[raptorrex]

so basically what you're saying is you have no evidence to support your claims.........

sorry but if you make a point and someone counters it, just saying to them 'research it yourself but there's not really any info on it' does not cut the mustard. Hardly a persuasive argument

by the same token, you have provided no evedence that my comments are incorrect. i fail to see any difference.
I did at least look into the matter. as there is no proper published information on the subject, at least not in one place. all the information deals with one item or group of leached products, but it is out there, all that is left is your own research, with a dash of common sense. you will note, in this thread, i am not alone in stating tannins are good for stock.
So, none of the items in what we call tannins, with the exception of very hight levels of tannic acid, are dangerous to fish. ( i am interested if anyone can come up with one, it may well change my stance). most would normally be expected to be present in many rivers, and indeed lakes, though not in tap water. many could and would be used by fish in the normal cource of their lives. add this to a large number of fish and invert keepers, who think, through belief or experience, the same. it all adds up to a compelling argument.

 

[ALW]

Bogwood will still leak tannins out, despite the steps taken it can be reduced significantly, the tannin acid, brown-yellow in colour, will continue to be released by the bogwood, which gives the aquarium an Amazonian effect (good if you have any particular fish species requiring this, e.g. Cardinal Tetra). Activated carbon will remove the colour produced by the wood, and regular water changes also help. Tannins are beneficial for the fish, the leaching of organic compounds such as tannins into the water causes a brown colouration and increased acidity, also causing the softening of hard water.

EDIT: I would boil it for a day then add it to the tank. I wouldnt leave it leach out the tannins, i would only boil it to kill anything that could be harmfull to th fish.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

so basically what you're saying is you have no evidence to support your claims.........

sorry but if you make a point and someone counters it, just saying to them 'research it yourself but there's not really any info on it' does not cut the mustard. Hardly a persuasive argument

by the same token, you have provided no evedence that my comments are incorrect. i fail to see any difference.
I did at least look into the matter. as there is no proper published information on the subject, at least not in one place. all the information deals with one item or group of leached products, but it is out there, all that is left is your own research, with a dash of common sense. you will note, in this thread, i am not alone in stating tannins are good for stock.
So, none of the items in what we call tannins, with the exception of very hight levels of tannic acid, are dangerous to fish. ( i am interested if anyone can come up with one, it may well change my stance). most would normally be expected to be present in many rivers, and indeed lakes, though not in tap water. many could and would be used by fish in the normal cource of their lives. add this to a large number of fish and invert keepers, who think, through belief or experience, the same. it all adds up to a compelling argument.

i've re-read the topic to make sure i didn't miss anything.

no one else has stated that tannines are good for fish. others have said that the tannines don't harm the fish, but that's not the same as them actually doing them some benefit as you have stated.

the accepted knowledge is that tannine's don't do any harm (in some circumstances adding wood may help by reducing pH but that's obviously going to depend on a number of variables and is not made/accepted as a blanket statement that it improves your water quality as you have stated). You have made a statement which goes against the accepted practices and wisdom, if you're going to do this you need to provide some evidence to back up your claims.

your second paragraph explains why tannines are not bad for fish, that's absolutely fine and i don't dispute it. even if you have no scientific papers etc to back it up please would you explain the principal of why you think tannines are good.