Mature Media Cycle Question Again

[Fish_Girl]

Sorry for asking yet another question I promise all the questions should be over in the next week or so once the tank is set up and running

Basically I will be using mature media to cycle a 6 Gal tank that I am getting tomorrow. I planned to still do a fishless cycle using bottled ammonia, just hoping the cycle would be shorter. However I am having trouble finding the ammonia-have asked in every boots chemist I have came across! I will be making a trip to a large Boots store and Homebase tomorrow to check both, but if I cant find it I wondered how safe it would be to cycle the tank using my frogs?

I only have my two african dwarf frogs at the moment, and as soon as the tank is ready I was planning to get a Betta to go with them. But once I have the new tank set up, is it ok to stick the mature media and the frogs in? I know it can be done, but I just dont want to cause too much stress for them.

Also if I do cycle the tank with the frogs in it, should I be putting plants in straight away?

What other differences other then the obvious are there between a fish in and a fishless cycle? Would I need to be doing daily water changes or anything like that? Or just testing the water every day and doing changes where necessary? I will be keeping the old tank set up so that if anything starts to go wrong with the new one I can put the frogs back into it.

Im hoping it's as easy as setting the tank up, adding the plants, the frogs and the mature media and everything going smoothly, but I think thats wishful thinking!

 

[KittyKat]

Basically I will be using mature media to cycle a 6 Gal tank that I am getting tomorrow. I planned to still do a fishless cycle using bottled ammonia, just hoping the cycle would be shorter. However I am having trouble finding the ammonia-have asked in every boots chemist I have came across! I will be making a trip to a large Boots store and Homebase tomorrow to check both, but if I cant find it I wondered how safe it would be to cycle the tank using my frogs?

http/www.boots.com/en/Boots-Household-ammonia-500ml_923908/ : you need to order it online and collect it in the shop. Last I heard, Boots no longer stock it in shops.

Cycling with live animals can be done, but is not recommended.

Also if I do cycle the tank with the frogs in it, should I be putting plants in straight away?

Yes, ones which are unlikely to die on you or melt. So, for example, floating plants should work. Plants use up ammonium and nitrate, so they are always beneficial. But ammonia + light lead to algae, so I recommend that you avoid live plants for fish-less cycles.

What other differences other then the obvious are there between a fish in and a fishless cycle? Would I need to be doing daily water changes or anything like that? Or just testing the water every day and doing changes where necessary? I will be keeping the old tank set up so that if anything starts to go wrong with the new one I can put the frogs back into it.

The daily water changes are what I consider an obvious difference because ammonia and nitrite are harmful to live animals. Keeping the old filter running without a source of ammonia in the water won't work: the bacteria will die back quickly.

If you are completely breaking down the old tank, why don't you just move *everything* to the new tank, including the old filter, and run both filters in parallel for 6 weeks or move all old media to the new filter?

 

[Fish_Girl]

Thanks for the reply When you say the obvious difference is daily water changes, do you mean I will need to do daily water changes with doing a fish in cycle?

I should have been more clear with my thread because the media in the new filter will be completely mature media. At the moment we have a horrible under gravel filter so we obviously can't use media from our own filter and also wont be moving it to the new tank, but my father in law has a big tank that has been set up for years and he will be giving us enough mature media to have only mature media in the new filter, there will be no new uncycled media in it. Hope that makes sense now lol will that make a big difference then if wanting to add the frogs straight away? And also with regards to adding live plants straight away?

I know that when you cycle you are cycling the filter, not the tank. Thats why I thought I might get away with safely adding the frogs straight away. Please someone correct me if I'm wrong! If so then I will be happy to do a fishless cycle once I find some ammonia.

 

[KittyKat]

Thanks for the reply When you say the obvious difference is daily water changes, do you mean I will need to do daily water changes with doing a fish in cycle?

Yes, most likely you will need to do daily of bi-daily water changes if you do a fish-in cycle.

I should have been more clear with my thread because the media in the new filter will be completely mature media. At the moment we have a horrible under gravel filter so we obviously can't use media from our own filter and also wont be moving it to the new tank, but my father in law has a big tank that has been set up for years and he will be giving us enough mature media to have only mature media in the new filter, there will be no new uncycled media in it. Hope that makes sense now lol will that make a big difference then if wanting to add the frogs straight away? And also with regards to adding live plants straight away?

Then you might be fine. It depends on your fathers stocking and filter, etc. And before you tell me what it is, I still wouldn't be able to guess if it's fine or not, you will only be able to guess with experience.

I recommend frogs + plants (fish in) or nothing (fishless).

 

[Fish_Girl]

So I looked in homebase for the ammonia, found a bottle and got really excited, checked for ingredients but wasn't sure so I shook it and opened to see if it foamed. Now it didn't quite foam but it did fiz and have bubbles so I decided not to get it. And boy did it smell strong, practically made my eyes water! Does all household ammonia smell so strong?

I then went to Boots hoping they would have some being a fairly big store but I got the usual "we used to sell it" line. So I may try ordering some to my local store, but I'm edging more towards using 100% mature media in the new filter and adding the frogs and plants and keeping a close eye on what happens with testing and water changes, especially with having the option of transferring the frogs straight back to their old tank if I don't like how things are going. Still have a few days to decide though so any further opinions by others are welcome

 

[KittyKat]

So I looked in homebase for the ammonia, found a bottle and got really excited, checked for ingredients but wasn't sure so I shook it and opened to see if it foamed. Now it didn't quite foam but it did fiz and have bubbles so I decided not to get it. And boy did it smell strong, practically made my eyes water! Does all household ammonia smell so strong?

Yes, and don't sniff it because it can do nasty stuff to you too, not just the fish Ingredients should be ammonia and water, nothing else.

I then went to Boots hoping they would have some being a fairly big store but I got the usual "we used to sell it" line. So I may try ordering some to my local store, but I'm edging more towards using 100% mature media in the new filter and adding the frogs and plants and keeping a close eye on what happens with testing and water changes, especially with having the option of transferring the frogs straight back to their old tank if I don't like how things are going. Still have a few days to decide though so any further opinions by others are welcome

1.79 is less than you paid for the frogs, right? You can use it to test how much ammonia the fully seeded filter is processing (depending on your dad's stocking, it could be not enough), in which case it should only take a couple of days for the bacteria to multiply It also doesn't go off, so you'd be prepared in case you ever need to feed your filter for some reason or if someone needs educating about how to not kill their fish… or if you really want to clean some gravestones (my DIY store sells ammonia as a cleaning agent for gravestones).

 

[the_lock_man]

So I looked in homebase for the ammonia, found a bottle and got really excited, checked for ingredients but wasn't sure so I shook it and opened to see if it foamed. Now it didn't quite foam but it did fiz and have bubbles so I decided not to get it. And boy did it smell strong, practically made my eyes water! Does all household ammonia smell so strong?

The Homebase stuff is fine, it's what I used - when you shake it, there are a few bubbles, which soon go. Unsuitable ammonia would really foam, like if you shook something with washing-up liquid. But fair play for not taking the risk.