Lots Of Advice Needed

[emmie]

Hello,

I've come here because I am looking for a LOT of advice about keeping freshwater fish for an idea I have recently had,

I have a large wall/gap 12ft long, 2ft wide and 8ft tall which I would love to make into a massive paludarium,

I'd like it to be more water than land, On the land part I am planning on keeping an arboreal snake from Papuan new guinea islands in there but I'd love for the water to be like a rainforest pond with native fish/aquatic life native such as shrimp/snails ect... to PNG, I am hoping to plant it all natural, I know the land part and what will be required for that its just the water bit that I need to do a lot of research on and get plenty of advice.
I'd love to have a couple of large fish in there as well as sholes of smaller fish but again I'm unsure of what I could keep in the water area which will be roughly 8ft long, 2ft wide and 4ft deep no sure what that is in gallons/litres though,

I will need advice on every aspect of keeping freshwater fish and planting and what types of plants to use ect...

For the land it will be heated to have a 32-25'C temp' gradient so the heat will effect the temps of the water but I'm not sure how much by, and I'll be using a 5.0 UV bulb so I'm not sure how that will effect it?

Obviously this is going to be a long term plan and a very costly one...But I want to get everything perfect for the health and happiness of the animals.

I know I'm asking an awful lot but any help will be greatly apprechiated!

Thank you!

 

[festo]

Won't the snake eat the fish?

 

[Smells a bit fishy]

Ok, so how much water is actually going in? 8'x2'x4'?

I do hope this is on a ground floor also as that's alot of weight to put on an upper floor. (just double checking)

 

[Smells a bit fishy]

You could put a number of fish snails and shrimp in that size tank, but I'm not sure what would be able to fend off any amphibians that you put in with them. So for that I would say don't put too many in and lots of hidey holes so hopefully the fish can escape, as they will more than likely be their natural prey, so expect a few losses I'm afraid to say

 

[KittyKat]

That sounds like quite a project! I look forward to following it, although I can't help much with the biotope fish and plants..

 

[emmie]

Won't the snake eat the fish?

No.

Ok, so how much water is actually going in? 8'x2'x4'?

I do hope this is on a ground floor also as that's alot of weight to put on an upper floor. (just double checking)

Someone worked it out to around 1800litres,

You could put a number of fish snails and shrimp in that size tank, but I'm not sure what would be able to fend off any amphibians that you put in with them. So for that I would say don't put too many in and lots of hidey holes so hopefully the fish can escape, as they will more than likely be their natural prey, so expect a few losses I'm afraid to say

I would like it to be like a mini eco-system, so I am expecting to lose a few animals.
Most amphibians tend to eat bugs though rather than fish to be honest. As long as all the animals are well fed but not over fed and have plenty of room it should help prevent them eating one another as much.

That sounds like quite a project! I look forward to following it, although I can't help much with the biotope fish and plants..

Thank you!

 

[Smells a bit fishy]

Sounds like a brilliant project. Sounds as though you have it all set out

I just wanted to check where it was because I would hate for you to have your project collapse through the roof with all that weight.

Ok one last thing, make sure you cycle the tank there's a fishless guide intge beginners section of these forums

 

[Miles_hot]

using the calculator in the begineer's section at the top of this forum the tank works out at: 1812 Litres which is 479 US Gallons. That's going to be a monster system Please keep us up to date as it sounds fantastic.

Miles

 

[emmie]

I've read all the beginners section and all the information on planting, now my head hurts lol!
Talk about throwing myself in the deep end but I think it will be worth it, if it all works out.

I'm really confused on what filter would be best? Because its such a large volume of water and because I will be planting it.
Also heating the water? Again the land will have a 32'C-25'C temp' gradient so I'm not sure how much it will heat the water or if it wont?

Now for cycling again because my minds set on planting it, the information given here suggests not to do fishless cycling when wanting to plant the tank...

Also with lighting regarding plants, I am planning on using 5.0 UV tubes so I'm unsure how this will effect the aquatic plants?
Will the aquatic plants need their own lighting?

and I haven't even started on the species of fish yet!

 

[Miles_hot]

I can't help on the cycling question other than to observe that "silent" cycling is normally advised as being for non beginners but I don't know why.

In terms of heating the water I would put a (or some) heaters in line with the pump if pumps. These will have themostates so will only heat the water if the land doesn't do the job...

Miles

 

[KittyKat]

I'm really confused on what filter would be best? Because its such a large volume of water and because I will be planting it.

For that volume of water, a sump is the best option. This is way out of consumer filter range and a custom filter that big costs a fortune and a half.

Now for cycling again because my minds set on planting it, the information given here suggests not to do fishless cycling when wanting to plant the tank...

I really do need to have a look at exactly what is says.. but I am of the opinion that a fish-less cycled aquarium can be planted without a problem and I very much encourage it.

On the other hand, I also think that fish-less cycling an aquarium that large is futile. What size fish were you thinking of? If small fish and shrimp, then you are better off just planting and adding say.. 10-30 1" fish per week. They will produce so little ammonia that you it will never register on the tests. In effect, you will be silent cycling.

Also with lighting regarding plants, I am planning on using 5.0 UV tubes so I'm unsure how this will effect the aquatic plants?
Will the aquatic plants need their own lighting?

You will probably need a metal halide over that, to give it enough light but I don't know how that will affect the rest of the animals.. or go for low-light plants and use some spotlights which are aimed only at the water.

I can't help on the cycling question other than to observe that "silent" cycling is normally advised as being for non beginners but I don't know why.

Because there is a high risk if the plants die. A prerequisite for silent cycling is being able to keep aquatic plants alive. Also, the risk is higher, the smaller the aquarium, which is what beginners often have.

In terms of heating the water I would put a (or some) heaters in line with the pump if pumps. These will have themostates so will only heat the water if the land doesn't do the job...

A couple of heaters in the sump should work.

 

[Jenste]

What species of amphibian are you planning on keeping? Having multiple different species in a single enclosure means you have to find a way to properly meet all of their unique needs fully.

Also, different species of amphibian cannot be mixed and setting up a system knowing that some of its inhabitants are going to be eaten is not making an ecosystem - - in nature yes, there are predators and there are prey - but there are natural hiding and living spaces that simply cannot be replicated in this small of a system.

I suggest choosing one type of system for one species, and making an amazing enclosure that can be utilized to the fullest by that one species. You will find it more enjoyable and so will the creatures you are caring for.

I see that as having an amazing amphibian, such as tree frogs, enclosure - you could really make it stunning.

 

[Miles_hot]

Out of interest KK how would you heat 1000 litres of water without a sump?

 

[Rynofasho]

There are some other online forums where people have taken on massive paludarium projects with great success. This one here and this one here both come to mind.

I cant be of much help either, but I'd say that for filtration, I'd probably go with two FX5s. They're good for 400 gallons each and adjustable so you can always find the 'sweet' spot.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

This sounds like an awesome project, but if I were you I would really seek out a professional expert in creating this sort of thing (maybe contact a local zoo or aquarium for a person that they would recommend for this). One thing can be sure, it is going to cost a lot of money. But, another thing is also true, in things like this, it is definitely far better to get it done right the first time, to eliminate all the potential pitfalls that can come along if unprepared, and will end up costing even more money in the long run.


I ask that you please post all throughout the process, including a full montage of pics during all stages of development. One thing that you are going to want is a record of everything, especially if you are laying out this type of cash for it. Best wishes with it! It sounds like it will be absolutely AWESOME!