Lockjaw issue in Norman lampeye

[confused_aquarist]

One of the lampeyes suddenly developed lockjaw and attempts to eat but can't.
It seems to have something in its mouth, it looks much like a mouthbrooder.
Somehow I feel this isn't really a disease because it was completely fine in the morning and doesn't swim away from the group.
(Even though I didn't really witness the moment it developed lockjaw so I can't say for sure.)
I wonder what I should do, leave it alone or manually fix?? Is it safe to use anesthetics like clove oil.

 

[anewbie]

Well if it is something stuck like a small piece of substrate it might work it loose over a day or two; if it is actual damage then yea no hope.

 

[GaryE]

I've seen a similar thing with other small fish - a swelling in the throat seems behind it. I have seen some fish go a long time with it, and it doesn't seem communicable in my experience. I've never seen a recovery.

 

[confused_aquarist]

I think I'll just give it another day and then manually operate on it because it really doesn't look sick in any other way.
It was a group of wild-caughts and there was a history of red spot disease among the fry/mouth warts that come and go and also this is one of the 2 individuals that are thinning.
When something goes wrong once problems tend to just drag on and on in the same tank. I'm beginning to suspect some virus that came from the farm-bred ones in the same shop.

I don't know if this will make it more confusing. When I set up the tank initially, this same individual developed mouth wart for 2 days and hang near the filter outlet.
Now some of the fry (~1 year old) have chronic mouth warts, mostly the bigger male fry. The mouth warts come and go, and usually take 2 or 3 months to recover, and tend to become less frequent as the fry mature. I've also lost 2 fry (~1 month old) to pop-eye, back when the tank was less stable. This is a weird tank...

 

[GaryE]

I haven't seen any discussions or texts about mouth warts, but it sounds like a good name for it. Throat warts, maybe. It would be viral and untreatable, but it generally has caused the fish to waste away before it could subside.

I thought about this when I was stuck in a waiting room for a while yesterday. I have seen it on dwarf Cichlids after unsuccessful spawning, a time of high stress. I have seen it on normani, Bororas, guppies, and Epiplatys annulatus. I wonder if it appears in many fish but is more problematic for smaller fish because of the size of the growth?

It seems to affect fish from all regions of the world, but the meeting place for fish and diseases is often farms.

I can't link it to diet or conditions, but I've seen it more on farmed fish, and your idea it could have transferred is likely to me. Fish farms by their business model have to be crowded, especially for less expensive fish, and crowding leads to disease transmission.

 

[confused_aquarist]

I haven't seen any discussions or texts about mouth warts, but it sounds like a good name for it. Throat warts, maybe. It would be viral and untreatable, but it generally has caused the fish to waste away before it could subside.

I thought about this when I was stuck in a waiting room for a while yesterday. I have seen it on dwarf Cichlids after unsuccessful spawning, a time of high stress. I have seen it on normani, Bororas, guppies, and Epiplatys annulatus. I wonder if it appears in many fish but is more problematic for smaller fish because of the size of the growth?

It seems to affect fish from all regions of the world, but the meeting place for fish and diseases is often farms.

I can't link it to diet or conditions, but I've seen it more on farmed fish, and your idea it could have transferred is likely to me. Fish farms by their business model have to be crowded, especially for less expensive fish, and crowding leads to disease transmission.

Yes, it’s observed a lot more often in smaller fish and oftentimes it occurs on the lip. I wonder if inside throat it is the same thing?? I’ve seen jaw lock in a clown killie dying from some acute infection.

In this case I just cannot tell if it’s a swallowed piece of moss or a wart or something, I will examine it, but it will hurt it more if done wrong, sigh, I feel so horrible for it.

 

[GaryE]

Here, it has never been from swallowing. It has always been an internal swelling.

 

[Innesfan]

It seems to affect fish from all regions of the world, but the meeting place for fish and diseases is often farms.

I've seen it on goldfish too.

 

[confused_aquarist]

There was a wart! Oof, I just hope this happens to be one of the fast-recovering ones, it is certainly not going to last for months without food.
It's very interesting how these warts always seem to grow on the same spot, at least when external I have never seen them growing anywhere other than the lower lip.

 

[confused_aquarist]

Update: I could not believe my eyes! It's back to normal this morning. Yesterday, actually the wart was bigger. Possibly it popped but today it's back to its normal business like nothing ever happened.

 

[GaryE]

A wart, or maybe a cyst that broke? That's a rare bit of luck. Outer lip ones have cleared here, but in the throat ones, never.

 

[confused_aquarist]

Update: Unfortunately the issue has come back in the same individual, and this time it seems to be deteriorating fast!
Yesterday morning, the fish was doing all fine, and 2 hours later I find it with mouth wide open. It still has a lot of appetite,
This morning it started to swim tail-down. I think this is not a good sign and when fish do that you know things have gone systemic

I am surprised, because the tank is in even better condition than 2 months ago.
I've had UV unit in this tank, so 2 months ago I thought the disease was triggered by expired UV lamp.
Now the UV lamp is brand new, I have not had any algae for months and phosphate is back down to 0 and plants are growing wonderful.

Probably one reason why chronic diseases are finicky is they come in bouts, early tank mess ups (like expired UV or poor cycling) can have impact on later prognosis.

It will probably not make it, but because it seems to be happy swimming with other tank mates, I think I will hope for natural recovery.

 

[confused_aquarist]

Update to this very interesting disease- it has recovered again!
Last time it took 4 days for the jaw to recover- this time it only took 2 days.

This time, there were some symptoms other than the locked jaw, like swimming tail-down and in circles all day.
Some of the organs also seemed enlarged, cloudy, and blood-shot.

It took 1 day for swimming to recover, 2 days for the jaw to completely recover, and 2 days for the organs to return transparent.
The awkward swimming was probably due to fluid accumulation or enlargement of some organ.
Very mysterious chronic disease.