Internal Filters

[SuperColey1]

I have my Fluval3Plus totally submerged with the 'out' spout 1 inch below the surface, but recently I saw a friends tank and he has the same filter but with the 'out' spout level with the surface.

Mine makes the water ripple gently whereas his makes a lot of surface agitation with bubbles going everywhere.

Where do you all put your filters?
What is recommended?
Is either method wrong?
Which is healthier/ better for the fish?

Look forward to your comments / advice.

 

[raptorrex]

I have my Fluval3Plus totally submerged with the 'out' spout 1 inch below the surface, but recently I saw a friends tank and he has the same filter but with the 'out' spout level with the surface.

Mine makes the water ripple gently whereas his makes a lot of surface agitation with bubbles going everywhere.

Where do you all put your filters?
What is recommended?
Is either method wrong?
Which is healthier/ better for the fish?

Look forward to your comments / advice.

if you have the output above the water, it will greatly aid in oxygenation. but other than that both are valid.

 

[methodmza_uk]

At the moment I have the Juwel internal filter, but I point the "out" spout upwards to agitate the water.

I used to have a fluval 2plus and i had it about 1cm below the water. Gave some bubbles but not too many.

 

[SuperColey1]

Another one to add

Do you point yours the length of the tank to agitate the whole surface or just the width to create a 'calm' end and a 'turbulent' end

My Betta often follows the Black Molly he has a crush on to the filter end until he gets blown back across but he never learns. lol

The black molly can swim direct in the flow of the filter on full setting (obviously not directly in front of it, along the glass the opposite side which is approx 12" away) whereas the Betta has to keep away from the flow other wise his fins are like sails and he gets 'blown' away from the area.

 

[dogfood]

I use internal filters that have air injection so I could control the amount of air bubbles created. I usually keep the output slightly below the water level so evaporation doesn't cause it to end up above the water level which causes splashing.

 

[raptorrex]

I use internal filters that have air injection so I could control the amount of air bubbles created. I usually keep the output slightly below the water level so evaporation doesn't cause it to end up above the water level which causes splashing.

bubbles under the the water add very little to oxygenation, so im confused as to this setup, the reason for having the spout above the water is it creates, greater surface area aiding absorption of O2 and the and the dispersal of CO2. bubbles under the water do not generally have time, to give up its O2. being so close to the top, gives it even less chance.

@SuperColey1 i point my outlet down the length of the tank, and upwards.

 

[SuperColey1]

my fluval spout only goes side to side, not upward/downward, so are you saying that you would put it level with the surface?. It's just I was always told the filter should be totally submerged.

Have I been doing wrong all this time?

Also I have some plants, and they need Co2! How do I balance getting oxygen into the water, without losing too much CO2 (without getting a CO2 system)

I run quite a tight budget tank (because I am tight) although I am thinking of investing in some rather expensive Plecs in the future if you know what I mean

 

[raptorrex]

my fluval spout only goes side to side, not upward/downward, so are you saying that you would put it level with the surface?. It's just I was always told the filter should be totally submerged.

Have I been doing wrong all this time?

Also I have some plants, and they need Co2! How do I balance getting oxygen into the water, without losing too much CO2 (without getting a CO2 system)

I run quite a tight budget tank (because I am tight) although I am thinking of investing in some rather expensive Plecs in the future if you know what I mean

well with plants i would keep the spout below the water level. but as i said before there is no rule. both systems are valid.

 

[dogfood]

bubbles under the the water add very little to oxygenation, so im confused as to this setup, the reason for having the spout above the water is it creates, greater surface area aiding absorption of O2 and the and the dispersal of CO2. bubbles under the water do not generally have time, to give up its O2. being so close to the top, gives it even less chance.

What's to be confused about? The filter has built-in air injection so I use it. I don't need to use it but it's there so I can and do. Also I don't know where you get the idea that the spout needs to be above water to be useful. Being about half an inch under the surface creates plenty of surface agitation. In the end whether or not the air injection adds significantly to oxygenation is irrelevent since the agitation is already sufficient.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

so long as there is plenty of surface agitiation, ripples, waves etc on the water surface then you'll be getting enough o2 into your water for the fish for 'everyday' usage. output from different filters and the size and dimensions of the tank they're in will alter weather they need to be above/below the waters surface to achieve this so there's no wrong/right. in short unless your fish are gasping at the surface then it's probably alright, if they're gasping then adjust it until they're not.

other times it will need adjusting are in high temps in summer or when you are medicating.

certain medications and higher temperatures make it harder for the water to absorb o2 so therefore you need to increase the surface agitation as much as possible so as much as possible can get in.

 

[dogfood]

so long as there is plenty of surface agitiation, ripples, waves etc on the water surface then you'll be getting enough o2 into your water for the fish for 'everyday' usage.

Exactly.

 

[raptorrex]

bubbles under the the water add very little to oxygenation, so im confused as to this setup, the reason for having the spout above the water is it creates, greater surface area aiding absorption of O2 and the and the dispersal of CO2. bubbles under the water do not generally have time, to give up its O2. being so close to the top, gives it even less chance.

What's to be confused about? The filter has built-in air injection so I use it. I don't need to use it but it's there so I can and do. Also I don't know where you get the idea that the spout needs to be above water to be useful. Being about half an inch under the surface creates plenty of surface agitation. In the end whether or not the air injection adds significantly to oxygenation is irrelevent since the agitation is already sufficient.

oh boy if your tank does not need air injection, why use it? and if it makes no difference, why use it? and the tenant that having the spout above the water line, is well known and often mentioned, indeed spray bars are common.

as i said both systems are valid. but reducing surface agitation is a must with planted tank, as this leads to loss of CO2, even with an CO2 injection system.

 

[SuperColey1]

Chill out people.

My question has been answered:

I have a planted tank and my water ripples so I am right
My friend has no plants and his water is turbulent so he is right.
Neither of us has fish gasping at the surface. (Mine is quite the opposite with the Betta, Baloon molly and black mollies schooling around the tank top to bottom, like they were all the same family)
My plants are OK apart from the black algae (started doing siesta and it is going v slowly)

So thanks to all and please don't fall out over this.

 

[raptorrex]

Chill out people.

My question has been answered:

I have a planted tank and my water ripples so I am right
My friend has no plants and his water is turbulent so he is right.
Neither of us has fish gasping at the surface. (Mine is quite the opposite with the Betta, Baloon molly and black mollies schooling around the tank top to bottom, like they were all the same family)
My plants are OK apart from the black algae (started doing siesta and it is going v slowly)

So thanks to all and please don't fall out over this.

lol

 

[dogfood]

oh boy if your tank does not need air injection, why use it? and if it makes no difference, why use it?

I use it because I can, do you have a problem with that?

and the tenant that having the spout above the water line, is well known and often mentioned, indeed spray bars are common.

And commonsense says if you can get surface agitation from having the spout below the surface it doesn't need to be above the surface.

as i said both systems are valid. but reducing surface agitation is a must with planted tank, as this leads to loss of CO2, even with an CO2 injection system.

Actually it's not a must. I have a 30 gallon setup with plenty of surface agitation and plants and they are actually growing instead of dying and there is zero algae. The plants don't get anything extra except what's put out by the fish and the light.