If I burn my tank will ich & worms survive

[AilyNC]

I've just finished my 4th dose of wormer (NTL Anti-Fluke & Wormer). So that's a month of one a week doses followed by water change 24-48hrs later.

Did these worms come from my fish? Do I need to keep using wormer & is it safe to do so when box says only 4 doses? Active Ingredients: Flubendazole:1000 mg/100 mL

This tank has also had 2 weeks of high temp for ich, ich return with a vengeance & another 2 weeks of high temps. Temp is still high as I wanna be absolutely sure I kill the ICH.

I wanna burn this frackin tank & start over. Most plants have gone to frack from high temp or some issue.

It's got 2 adult Platy, 4 Neon Tetra (that really need rehoming but I feel I have to finish ich treatment first) and 5 2month old Platy fry, 4 one month olds & another 3 1week olds.

Edit to add I think some still have light coloured poop. Frack this tank

 

[Ch4rlie]

Keep it going, you WILL get there, it's hard work I know and thats the curse of ICH, it seems to be neverending but the end will be in sight soon.

Chin up eh!

 

[AilyNC]

Keep it going, you WILL get there, it's hard work I know and thats the curse of ICH, it seems to be neverending but the end will be in sight soon.

Chin up eh!

Do you know can I keep dosing wormer or if maybe it's time to switch to another type? @Colin_T do you think it's ok to keep dosing after 4 weeks. It's Flubendazole:1000 mg/100 mL.

My husband is convinced the high temp tank adds humidity to the room so his patience is wearing. I've assured him I'll drop temp to 24 once ICH issue is over. He was super encouraging of the hobby until the persistent high temp humidity concern.

 

[AilyNC]

@AdoraBelle Dearheart have you had better success with your wormer?

 

[Ch4rlie]

Have you treated the tank with salt as well?

Most parasite don't like salt and mixed with high temps of around 30C if your fish can tolerate that should speed up the life cycle of parasite, the use of whitespot (whitespot is another name for ICH) treatment meds will help as well if follow instructions.

Do you have any substrate in the tank? There is a stage, if I remember right, that most parasite have a substrate dwelling stage so having no substrate will help eliminate these.

But as for the Flubendazole, am afraid I dont actually know much abou this, I used it twice in a tank that had planeria worms and no livestock at the time so that killed the worms (well at least I could not see any more) then I chucked out the substrate and replaced it as I was getting paranoid there will be planeria coming back to life in the substrate when I added my new fishies into that tank! A bit overkill but I was a newbie at the time!
But thats all the experience I've had with Flubendazole to be prefectly honest.
Sorry, not much help with that for you

 

[AilyNC]

I really got grossed out by the worms in the bucket. I have gravel in the tank. Not very deep but I find with the plants & driftwood it's hard to really get a good clean. I clean the the gravel but I'm never sure I'm getting all of it. If I'm keeping this tank my plan is to switch to play sand.

I have King British White Spot Controller medicine but held off as wanted to try defeat this with temp. I'll have a look at the instructions.

I need to pick up some Aquarium salt and try that.

 

[Colin_T]

What are we meant to be looking at in the video?

Has the tank got a coverglass on?
If yes, then tell hubby to pull his head in because the coverglass will prevent humidity in the room. Coverglass will also trap heat and means the heater won't need to work as hard.

What temperature is the tank water, (numbers from a thermometer not the heater)?
If the water temperature is 30C/ 86F and the fish still have white spot, raise it to 32C.

Are you sure the fish have white spot?
Can we get pictures of them?

Do you know can I keep dosing wormer or if maybe it's time to switch to another type? @Colin_T do you think it's ok to keep dosing after 4 weeks. It's Flubendazole:1000 mg/100 mL.

If you have done 4 doses of Flubendazole at weekly intervals, then you do not need to use it anymore unless you get new fish or re-infect your current fish. If you get new fish, put them in quarantine for 4 weeks and treat them for worms while they are in quarantine.

 

[Retired Viking]

Good luck with this, I know it is a real pain to deal with , looks like other members have this well covered. Hang in there

 

[AilyNC]

What are we meant to be looking at in the video?

Has the tank got a coverglass on?
If yes, then tell hubby to pull his head in because the coverglass will prevent humidity in the room. Coverglass will also trap heat and means the heater won't need to work as hard.

What temperature is the tank water, (numbers from a thermometer not the heater)?
If the water temperature is 30C/ 86F and the fish still have white spot, raise it to 32C.

Are you sure the fish have white spot?
Can we get pictures of them?


If you have done 4 doses of Flubendazole at weekly intervals, then you do not need to use it anymore unless you get new fish or re-infect your current fish. If you get new fish, put them in quarantine for 4 weeks and treat them for worms while they are in quarantine.

In the video to right hand side of the bucket are two fine worms. My concern is that they were in the tank after it's finished 4 doses of wormer.

Yes it has a cover. But I think when temp is lower it won't nag at him.

Temp is 30.9C on the thermometer. I can raise to 32C.

 

[AilyNC]

Are you sure the fish have white spot?
Can we get pictures of them?

The spots have all gone currently. It's day 14 of high temp. The last time I lowered temp at day 14 more white spots came back but treatment had been interupted by a power cut. I want to wait a few more days to ensure the ICH is fully gone this time

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

@AdoraBelle Dearheart have you had better success with your wormer?

Oh no hon, i'm so sorry. I see the worms wriggling in the bucket as well You've had one thing after another since starting the hobby, and it's not your fault! It's so unfair.

Yes, the eSHa gdex and eSHa ndx I used cleared my worm problem, flubendazole is meant to work as well though, but I'd also be alarmed by those worms in the bucket! They're bigger than detritus worms. Perhaps the ones you have are resistant to the flubendazole. eSHa ndx is levamisole and the gdex is praziquantel. Levamisole is effective against roundworms like camallanus and the gdex kills flatworms. @NCaquatics has been having problems with flubendazole not killing off worms as well, I wonder whether the med has become less effective, if worms are resistant to it now.

Your substrate is quite large isn't it, difficult to vac properly between treatments. In your shoes, with fish still showing worm symptoms and seeing this... I might tear down the tank... sorta.... bear with me.

Finish the heat treatment first. Fish have already been through so much, and if none are skinny and lethargic yet, we have time to deal with the worms. Can finish off the heat treatment and let them have a few days break, feed them well since they won't be getting all the nutrients from their food because of the worms, and it'll build them up to get through another round of treatment. Frozen and even better, live foods if you can get them are the best for conditioning. Leave a container of standing water outside and you may get mosquito larvae that fish go wild for.

Get the eSHa meds (if you can get them in Ireland?? Delivery to Ireland being so expensive sucks!) Before using them, remove the fish to a bucket with the airpump and covered with a towel to prevent jumping. Then remove all of that large substrate. Leave the plants in the tank either floating or weighed down with plant weights. Either leave the tank bare bottom during treatment, which makes it easy to see worms and poop, or add a thin layer of sand if you prefer if you have any left over from your other tank. I've kept fish in a bare bottom tank for treatment before, it does make it easier to see and with the plants and things, it didn't seem to stress them too much, and it is temporary. Replace fish, and monitor water parameters and water change as necessarily in case removing all the substrate puts the tank into a mini cycle. If it does, it should hopefully only take a few days for the bacteria colonies to catch up, but you'll want to get through that before messing with medications and having to redose after each water change.

In the meantime, the substrate can be bleach cleaned to kill any eggs or worms that are in there, if you plan to re-use it, or thrown out if you plan to switch to sand.

Once mini cycle is over, start with the eSHa ndx, because that requires two doses, two weeks apart. I dosed that one first, did the necessary water changes afterwards, then I used the gdex during the two week gap before the second dose of ndex was required. No worms since then.

 

[AilyNC]

Oh no hon, i'm so sorry. I see the worms wriggling in the bucket as well You've had one thing after another since starting the hobby, and it's not your fault! It's so unfair.

Yes, the eSHa gdex and eSHa ndx I used cleared my worm problem, flubendazole is meant to work as well though, but I'd also be alarmed by those worms in the bucket! They're bigger than detritus worms. Perhaps the ones you have are resistant to the flubendazole. eSHa ndx is levamisole and the gdex is praziquantel. Levamisole is effective against roundworms like camallanus and the gdex kills flatworms. @NCaquatics has been having problems with flubendazole not killing off worms as well, I wonder whether the med has become less effective, if worms are resistant to it now.

Your substrate is quite large isn't it, difficult to vac properly between treatments. In your shoes, with fish still showing worm symptoms and seeing this... I might tear down the tank... sorta.... bear with me.

Finish the heat treatment first. Fish have already been through so much, and if none are skinny and lethargic yet, we have time to deal with the worms. Can finish off the heat treatment and let them have a few days break, feed them well since they won't be getting all the nutrients from their food because of the worms, and it'll build them up to get through another round of treatment. Frozen and even better, live foods if you can get them are the best for conditioning. Leave a container of standing water outside and you may get mosquito larvae that fish go wild for.

Get the eSHa meds (if you can get them in Ireland?? Delivery to Ireland being so expensive sucks!) Before using them, remove the fish to a bucket with the airpump and covered with a towel to prevent jumping. Then remove all of that large substrate. Leave the plants in the tank either floating or weighed down with plant weights. Either leave the tank bare bottom during treatment, which makes it easy to see worms and poop, or add a thin layer of sand if you prefer if you have any left over from your other tank. I've kept fish in a bare bottom tank for treatment before, it does make it easier to see and with the plants and things, it didn't seem to stress them too much, and it is temporary. Replace fish, and monitor water parameters and water change as necessarily in case removing all the substrate puts the tank into a mini cycle. If it does, it should hopefully only take a few days for the bacteria colonies to catch up, but you'll want to get through that before messing with medications and having to redose after each water change.

In the meantime, the substrate can be bleach cleaned to kill any eggs or worms that are in there, if you plan to re-use it, or thrown out if you plan to switch to sand.

Once mini cycle is over, start with the eSHa ndx, because that requires two doses, two weeks apart. I dosed that one first, did the necessary water changes afterwards, then I used the gdex during the two week gap before the second dose of ndex was required. No worms since then.

This is great thank you! I was doing water change yesterday & it is tricky to get right in to the gravel. I threw some plants out (they were melting anyway) and made more space but I was really tempted to strip the tank.

The fish are all from the that LFS early on & worming & ICH has been ongoing since before the power cut in early August. The thin thread worms were big considering they're in fish.

I checked the meds you listed & they are available here. If not locally then I can order on Amazon without delivery charge.

I'll do bare bottom tank for treatment & hopefully they are ok with that. I was planning on adding play sand to this tank so if they are very stressed I can give bottom a big clean and add a small layer of sand later.

I felt really sick when I saw the worms I'm so squeamish

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

This is great thank you! I was doing water change yesterday & it is tricky to get right in to the gravel. I threw some plants out (they were melting anyway) and made more space but I was really tempted to strip the tank.

The fish are all from the that LFS early on & worming & ICH has been ongoing since before the power cut in early August. The thin thread worms were big considering they're in fish.

I checked the meds you listed & they are available here. If not locally then I can order on Amazon without delivery charge.

I'll do bare bottom tank for treatment & hopefully they are ok with that. I was planning on adding play sand to this tank so if they are very stressed I can give bottom a big clean and add a small layer of sand later.

I felt really sick when I saw the worms I'm so squeamish

Hey, I'm not terribly squeamish, and I still freaked out when I realised my fish had worms for the second time. It's horrible knowing that there are parasites in your tank/harming your fish!

I'm really happy if this helps! I know how rough it is, and that you've been through so much with it and worked so hard, all because of that stupid LFS owner! This sucks, but it will pass.

I feel okay recommending those meds because they really did work for me. My fish were in a worse state too, I was losing the fry that were 1-2 months old, and two adults had suddenly become skinny and lethargic, struggling to swim properly, but they recovered once I used those meds, and they were in a bare bottom tank at first, with plants around them, made it easy to vac the tank between treatments. Good to hear that you can get them! I ordered them from Amazon too, you might as well since the fish need a few days to finish ich treatment anyway and build condition for the next round.

 

[AilyNC]

The fish all look ok thankfully. Active and the fry are growing too so hopefully they get through this last push to rid the parasites. Being VERY careful not to use any of the same equipment between tanks

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

The fish all look ok thankfully. Active and the fry are growing too so hopefully they get through this last push to rid the parasites. Being VERY careful not to use any of the same equipment between tanks

Good good! It's so easy to cross contaminate worm eggs between tanks via buckets, nets or syphons. Do you know how to bleach clean equipment safely once this is done? Can tell you how