I am so BEYOND frustrated.

[OliveFish05]

I don’t even know where to start. My beautiful koi pond, let’s start there. Last spring (about March) my family started digging our 1,500 gallon koi pond. We dug up 1,500 gallons of red Clay with shovels over the course of two days. Over the spring and summer we got koi, goldfish, and so many plants. By mid summer, the koi pond was stable and thriving. We knew nearly ever koi by name. Pearl, Angelica, Midas, Tattoo, Peach, Daisy, Horse Face, Sterling, Dune, Chani, Craigslist Koi, our little koi with scoliosis whose name I don’t know how to spell, and so many others. Too many to name in this post. My point is - my family poured our hearts into this pond and every single one of our koi. As it got cold, we winterized the pond. The koi slowed down, we cut the plants back for the winter, did a big cleanout of all the leaves and twigs on the bottom, and reduced feeding. Eventually we stopped feeding and put in a deicer. All was well with our beautiful fish.

The photos were towards the end of summer. So anyways, let’s skip to mid-December. All 30 or so fish are doing great. The pond is stocked to the Max, but not above. We feel really good with how smoothly the winter transition has gone and some of our anxiety about it has faded. Then we get a call from my uncle. “Hey you’ll never guess what you’ve done. You’ve got me hooked on koi, I’m gonna get some tanks and build a pond in the spring” “Oh wow, that’s awesome! We can’t wait, you’ll have to have us come over and help. How fun.” blah blah blah, then “Oh and by the way, I’m shipping 15 koi to your house. I need you to keep them in your pond until I get my tanks set up” us- “what.... oh um, the pond, first winter, not good time, the cold, the cycle couldn’t really handle it right now without the plants, er, umm please don’t” him- “It’ll be fine, you have room for like 150 koi in there! Plus I’ve already put the order in. They’ll be there in three days” What. Just. Happened.

Fast forward three days, the koi get here. They had shipped them upside down, so half the water leaked out and one of the koi died in shipping. It was the mail carrier not the seller of course. About a week in, we start losing koi. My uncle went talked to the guy at the pet store and in this case it was extremely helpful! He asked my uncle what size the pond was (1,500 gallons), how many koi there were (48 when my uncle added his fish, before any died), what kind of bubbler we had (waterfall), etc etc. As soon as my uncle answered he goes “that’s your problem. Your pond is grossly overstocked, the fish are dying because of poor water quality, lack of space, and limited oxygen. They could even be picking on the smaller ones because they know they don’t have what they need for all of them to survive this winter. A good rule of thumb in a pond like yours is 10 gallons per inch of fish“ apparently my uncle thought it was 10 gallons per FISH. UGH. We lost 15 of our beautiful koi, Midas, Dune, and Daisy among the ones we lost. That’s not even the end though...

Around mid January my uncle gets his tanks all set up and took his koi back. Someone had told him I would give him cycled filter media, so when he asked I did. From my tank. A couple days later Could only count 7/10 neon tetras. I told my uncle that he set up his second tank I’d get him a little bit of media from the pond filter. Well about 3 days later they brought back my cycled filter sponges, except they were covered in blue ich medication and had been washed in tap water. Completely ruined. Granted, they didn't know. Then my aunt (my uncle’s wife) started talking about getting more sponges from me. I told her I’d get her some media from the pond. A family member overheard and said “Don’t get it from the pond, they need to leave. Just take it from your tank” I tried to discreetly whisper that I had already given all that I could take from my indoor tank, but they didn’t understand and more firmly told me I couldn’t take it from the pond. I was rushed and panicked in a panicked state of not knowing what to do I reluctantly gave them the last of the filter media from my 20 gallon tank... Two days later (day before yesterday) one of my honey gourami died and 2 more tetras are missing. I immediately did a water change and decided to pull one of my two sponge filters from my axolotl tank, because it’s cycled. I went out and bought some fast growing plants last minute to spread between all my tanks. Hornwort and duckweed... All that to learn that they washed the sponges I gave them so it was absolutely pointless. I am , disappointed, frustrated, and a little bit lost on what to do next. Now my tetras (5) and gourami (2) don’t have the right sized groups. I am hesitant to just replace them...

Well anyone who made it this far, thanks for reading. I just needed to share my frustration with some people who get it.

 

[CuriousFins]

I don’t even know where to start. My beautiful koi pond, let’s start there. Last spring (about March) my family started digging our 1,500 gallon koi pond. We dug up 1,500 gallons of red Clay with shovels over the course of two days. Over the spring and summer we got koi, goldfish, and so many plants. By mid summer, the koi pond was stable and thriving. We knew nearly ever koi by name. Pearl, Angelica, Midas, Tattoo, Peach, Daisy, Horse Face, Sterling, Dune, Chani, Craigslist Koi, our little koi with scoliosis whose name I don’t know how to spell, and so many others. Too many to name in this post. My point is - my family poured our hearts into this pond and every single one of our koi. As it got cold, we winterized the pond. The koi slowed down, we cut the plants back for the winter, did a big cleanout of all the leaves and twigs on the bottom, and reduced feeding. Eventually we stopped feeding and put in a deicer. All was well with our beautiful fish.View attachment 153881View attachment 153886View attachment 153880View attachment 153887View attachment 153882View attachment 153883View attachment 153884View attachment 153885

The photos were towards the end of summer. So anyways, let’s skip to mid-December. All 30 or so fish are doing great. The pond is stocked to the Max, but not above. We feel really good with how smoothly the winter transition has gone and some of our anxiety about it has faded. Then we get a call from my uncle, who is moving to the area in January, 2022. “Hey you’ll never guess what you’ve done. You’ve got me hooked on koi, I’m gonna get some tanks in the new house and build a pond in the spring” “Oh wow, that’s awesome! We can’t wait, you’ll have to have us come over and help. How fun.” blah blah blah, then “Oh and by the way, I’m shipping 15 koi to your house. I need you to keep them in your pond until I get my tanks set up mid January” us- “what.... oh um, the pond, first winter, not good time, the cold, the cycle couldn’t really handle it right now without the plants, er, umm please don’t” him- “It’ll be fine, you have room for like 150 koi in there! Plus I’ve already put the order in. They’ll be there in three days” What. Just. Happened.

Fast forward three days, the koi get here. They had shipped them upside down, so half the water leaked out and one of the koi died in shipping. It was the mail carrier not the seller of course. About a week in, we start losing koi. My uncle, who is now moved down here and getting stuff for his tanks, went talked to the guy at the pet store and in this case it was extremely helpful! He asked my uncle what size the pond was (1,500 gallons), how many koi there were (48 when my uncle added his fish, before any died), what kind of bubbler we had (waterfall), etc etc. As soon as my uncle answered he goes “that’s your problem. Your pond is grossly overstocked, the fish are dying because of poor water quality, lack of space, and limited oxygen. They could even be picking on the smaller ones because they know they don’t have what they need for all of them to survive this winter. A good rule of thumb in a pond like yours is 10 gallons per inch of fish“ apparently my uncle thought it was 10 gallons per FISH. UGH. We lost 15 of our beautiful koi, Midas, Dune, and Daisy among the ones we lost. Fifteen $20-$30 fish adds up to hundreds of dollars. That’s not even the end though...

Around mid January my uncle gets his tanks all set up and took his koi back. Someone had told him I would give him cycled filter media, so when he asked I did. From my tank. A couple days later Could only count 7/10 neon tetras. I told my uncle that he set up his second tank I’d get him a little bit of media from the pond filter. Well about 3 days later they brought back my cycled filter sponges, except they were covered in blue ich medication and had been washed in tap water. Completely ruined. Then my aunt (my uncle’s wife) started talking about getting more sponges from me. I told her I’d get her some media from the pond. A family member overheard and said “Don’t get it from the pond, they need to leave. Just take it from your tank” I tried to discreetly whisper that I had already given all that I could take from my indoor tank, but they didn’t understand and more firmly told me I couldn’t take it from the pond. I was rushed and panicked and my aunt was getting kind of snappy, and I also had to obey the family member that said not to take it from the pond, and in a panicked state of not knowing what to do I reluctantly gave them the last of the filter media from my 20 gallon tank... Two days later (day before yesterday) one of my honey gourami died and 2 more tetras are missing. I immediately did a water change and decided to pull one of my two sponge filters from my axolotl tank, because it’s cycled. I went out and bought some fast growing plants last minute to spread between all my tanks. Hornwort and duckweed... All that to learn that they washed the sponges I gave them so it was absolutely pointless. I am furious, disappointed, frustrated, and a little bit lost on what to do next. Now my tetras (5) and gourami (2) don’t have the right sized groups. I am hesitant to just replace them...

Well anyone who made it this far, thanks for reading. I just needed to share my frustration with some people who get it.

Oh, man. I am so sorry you're having to go through all this. I know it can be frustrating when family members just don't get it, and they don't listen when you try to protest either. Wishing you the best of luck with your fish.

 

[connorlindeman]

Im sorry this is happening. What I would do is put a whole bunch of good bacteria in your indoor tank. I dont know what to do about your outdoor tank.

 

[PlasticGalaxy]

I'm so, so sorry to hear this Olive! It's so terrible to watch things like this go to waste because others won't listen to you. It really is such a shame, it must be so stressful to go through. Things will get back up to code in time, just try not to let these things get too you too much, it can really take a hit on your enthusiasm with the hobby. Sending you lots of platonic love and hope.

 

[Tacocat]

I don’t even know where to start. My beautiful koi pond, let’s start there. Last spring (about March) my family started digging our 1,500 gallon koi pond. We dug up 1,500 gallons of red Clay with shovels over the course of two days. Over the spring and summer we got koi, goldfish, and so many plants. By mid summer, the koi pond was stable and thriving. We knew nearly ever koi by name. Pearl, Angelica, Midas, Tattoo, Peach, Daisy, Horse Face, Sterling, Dune, Chani, Craigslist Koi, our little koi with scoliosis whose name I don’t know how to spell, and so many others. Too many to name in this post. My point is - my family poured our hearts into this pond and every single one of our koi. As it got cold, we winterized the pond. The koi slowed down, we cut the plants back for the winter, did a big cleanout of all the leaves and twigs on the bottom, and reduced feeding. Eventually we stopped feeding and put in a deicer. All was well with our beautiful fish.View attachment 153881View attachment 153886View attachment 153880View attachment 153887View attachment 153882View attachment 153883View attachment 153884View attachment 153885

The photos were towards the end of summer. So anyways, let’s skip to mid-December. All 30 or so fish are doing great. The pond is stocked to the Max, but not above. We feel really good with how smoothly the winter transition has gone and some of our anxiety about it has faded. Then we get a call from my uncle, who is moving to the area in January, 2022. “Hey you’ll never guess what you’ve done. You’ve got me hooked on koi, I’m gonna get some tanks in the new house and build a pond in the spring” “Oh wow, that’s awesome! We can’t wait, you’ll have to have us come over and help. How fun.” blah blah blah, then “Oh and by the way, I’m shipping 15 koi to your house. I need you to keep them in your pond until I get my tanks set up mid January” us- “what.... oh um, the pond, first winter, not good time, the cold, the cycle couldn’t really handle it right now without the plants, er, umm please don’t” him- “It’ll be fine, you have room for like 150 koi in there! Plus I’ve already put the order in. They’ll be there in three days” What. Just. Happened.

Fast forward three days, the koi get here. They had shipped them upside down, so half the water leaked out and one of the koi died in shipping. It was the mail carrier not the seller of course. About a week in, we start losing koi. My uncle, who is now moved down here and getting stuff for his tanks, went talked to the guy at the pet store and in this case it was extremely helpful! He asked my uncle what size the pond was (1,500 gallons), how many koi there were (48 when my uncle added his fish, before any died), what kind of bubbler we had (waterfall), etc etc. As soon as my uncle answered he goes “that’s your problem. Your pond is grossly overstocked, the fish are dying because of poor water quality, lack of space, and limited oxygen. They could even be picking on the smaller ones because they know they don’t have what they need for all of them to survive this winter. A good rule of thumb in a pond like yours is 10 gallons per inch of fish“ apparently my uncle thought it was 10 gallons per FISH. UGH. We lost 15 of our beautiful koi, Midas, Dune, and Daisy among the ones we lost. Fifteen $20-$30 fish adds up to hundreds of dollars. That’s not even the end though...

Around mid January my uncle gets his tanks all set up and took his koi back. Someone had told him I would give him cycled filter media, so when he asked I did. From my tank. A couple days later Could only count 7/10 neon tetras. I told my uncle that he set up his second tank I’d get him a little bit of media from the pond filter. Well about 3 days later they brought back my cycled filter sponges, except they were covered in blue ich medication and had been washed in tap water. Completely ruined. Then my aunt (my uncle’s wife) started talking about getting more sponges from me. I told her I’d get her some media from the pond. A family member overheard and said “Don’t get it from the pond, they need to leave. Just take it from your tank” I tried to discreetly whisper that I had already given all that I could take from my indoor tank, but they didn’t understand and more firmly told me I couldn’t take it from the pond. I was rushed and panicked and my aunt was getting kind of snappy, and I also had to obey the family member that said not to take it from the pond, and in a panicked state of not knowing what to do I reluctantly gave them the last of the filter media from my 20 gallon tank... Two days later (day before yesterday) one of my honey gourami died and 2 more tetras are missing. I immediately did a water change and decided to pull one of my two sponge filters from my axolotl tank, because it’s cycled. I went out and bought some fast growing plants last minute to spread between all my tanks. Hornwort and duckweed... All that to learn that they washed the sponges I gave them so it was absolutely pointless. I am furious, disappointed, frustrated, and a little bit lost on what to do next. Now my tetras (5) and gourami (2) don’t have the right sized groups. I am hesitant to just replace them...

Well anyone who made it this far, thanks for reading. I just needed to share my frustration with some people who get it.

Oh my lord. What's the point of taking somebody's grimy media if you're just going to wash it. Surely you realize that the reason you want the grimy media and not clean media is because of the grime, not the media. My condolences

 

[I Like Rare Fish]

I understand this. Some adults think they know everything. I understand peer pressure. Maybe somebody around you could give some filter media to you?

 

[OliveFish05]

Oh, man. I am so sorry you're having to go through all this. I know it can be frustrating when family members just don't get it, and they don't listen when you try to protest either. Wishing you the best of luck with your fish.

Im sorry this is happening. What I would do is put a whole bunch of good bacteria in your indoor tank. I dont know what to do about your outdoor tank.

I'm so, so sorry to hear this Olive! It's so terrible to watch things like this go to waste because others won't listen to you. It really is such a shame, it must be so stressful to go through. Things will get back up to code in time, just try not to let these things get too you too much, it can really take a hit on your enthusiasm with the hobby. Sending you lots of platonic love and hope.

Oh my lord. What's the point of taking somebody's grimy media if you're just going to wash it. Surely you realize that the reason you want the grimy media and not clean media is because of the grime, not the media. My condolences

I understand this. Some adults think they know everything. I understand peer pressure. Maybe somebody around you could give some filter media to you?

Thank you all so much for your encouraging words! I feel like I’ve spent so much time, energy, love, and money on my tanks, I LOVE my fish, and someone who doesn’t even love their fish (I mean they think they’re pretty and enjoy them, but they don’t love the fish themselves) and won’t take the time to learn to do it right just messed all my hard work up! And MY fish paid the price. Thankfully with his fish out of our pond, the pond is doing much better. We tested the water last night and there is 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, 0 nitrates. Things seem to be more in balance, and our two koi who are recovering indoors are doing well. Now That I have my cycled sponge filter from my axolotl tank in the 20 gallon, things are doing better. It is just. So. Frustrating.

 

[Rocky998]

I don’t even know where to start. My beautiful koi pond, let’s start there. Last spring (about March) my family started digging our 1,500 gallon koi pond. We dug up 1,500 gallons of red Clay with shovels over the course of two days. Over the spring and summer we got koi, goldfish, and so many plants. By mid summer, the koi pond was stable and thriving. We knew nearly ever koi by name. Pearl, Angelica, Midas, Tattoo, Peach, Daisy, Horse Face, Sterling, Dune, Chani, Craigslist Koi, our little koi with scoliosis whose name I don’t know how to spell, and so many others. Too many to name in this post. My point is - my family poured our hearts into this pond and every single one of our koi. As it got cold, we winterized the pond. The koi slowed down, we cut the plants back for the winter, did a big cleanout of all the leaves and twigs on the bottom, and reduced feeding. Eventually we stopped feeding and put in a deicer. All was well with our beautiful fish.View attachment 153881View attachment 153886View attachment 153880View attachment 153887View attachment 153882View attachment 153883View attachment 153884View attachment 153885

The photos were towards the end of summer. So anyways, let’s skip to mid-December. All 30 or so fish are doing great. The pond is stocked to the Max, but not above. We feel really good with how smoothly the winter transition has gone and some of our anxiety about it has faded. Then we get a call from my uncle, who is moving to the area in January, 2022. “Hey you’ll never guess what you’ve done. You’ve got me hooked on koi, I’m gonna get some tanks in the new house and build a pond in the spring” “Oh wow, that’s awesome! We can’t wait, you’ll have to have us come over and help. How fun.” blah blah blah, then “Oh and by the way, I’m shipping 15 koi to your house. I need you to keep them in your pond until I get my tanks set up mid January” us- “what.... oh um, the pond, first winter, not good time, the cold, the cycle couldn’t really handle it right now without the plants, er, umm please don’t” him- “It’ll be fine, you have room for like 150 koi in there! Plus I’ve already put the order in. They’ll be there in three days” What. Just. Happened.

Fast forward three days, the koi get here. They had shipped them upside down, so half the water leaked out and one of the koi died in shipping. It was the mail carrier not the seller of course. About a week in, we start losing koi. My uncle, who is now moved down here and getting stuff for his tanks, went talked to the guy at the pet store and in this case it was extremely helpful! He asked my uncle what size the pond was (1,500 gallons), how many koi there were (48 when my uncle added his fish, before any died), what kind of bubbler we had (waterfall), etc etc. As soon as my uncle answered he goes “that’s your problem. Your pond is grossly overstocked, the fish are dying because of poor water quality, lack of space, and limited oxygen. They could even be picking on the smaller ones because they know they don’t have what they need for all of them to survive this winter. A good rule of thumb in a pond like yours is 10 gallons per inch of fish“ apparently my uncle thought it was 10 gallons per FISH. UGH. We lost 15 of our beautiful koi, Midas, Dune, and Daisy among the ones we lost. Fifteen $20-$30 fish adds up to hundreds of dollars. That’s not even the end though...

Around mid January my uncle gets his tanks all set up and took his koi back. Someone had told him I would give him cycled filter media, so when he asked I did. From my tank. A couple days later Could only count 7/10 neon tetras. I told my uncle that he set up his second tank I’d get him a little bit of media from the pond filter. Well about 3 days later they brought back my cycled filter sponges, except they were covered in blue ich medication and had been washed in tap water. Completely ruined. Then my aunt (my uncle’s wife) started talking about getting more sponges from me. I told her I’d get her some media from the pond. A family member overheard and said “Don’t get it from the pond, they need to leave. Just take it from your tank” I tried to discreetly whisper that I had already given all that I could take from my indoor tank, but they didn’t understand and more firmly told me I couldn’t take it from the pond. I was rushed and panicked and my aunt was getting kind of snappy, and I also had to obey the family member that said not to take it from the pond, and in a panicked state of not knowing what to do I reluctantly gave them the last of the filter media from my 20 gallon tank... Two days later (day before yesterday) one of my honey gourami died and 2 more tetras are missing. I immediately did a water change and decided to pull one of my two sponge filters from my axolotl tank, because it’s cycled. I went out and bought some fast growing plants last minute to spread between all my tanks. Hornwort and duckweed... All that to learn that they washed the sponges I gave them so it was absolutely pointless. I am furious, disappointed, frustrated, and a little bit lost on what to do next. Now my tetras (5) and gourami (2) don’t have the right sized groups. I am hesitant to just replace them...

Well anyone who made it this far, thanks for reading. I just needed to share my frustration with some people who get it.

Now ask them to pay... This story (after seeing your other threads in the past) has me in a rage. I'm sorry, family or not, the first mistake was maybe forgivable but now, now they got to pay for being ignorant adults. Adults think that they know more than us AND they do BUT they also have to understand that sometimes we are smarter than them in other subjects... For them to demand something from you is definitely not ok especially when you said it wouldnt be good. Their using you really...

 

[OliveFish05]

Now ask them to pay... This story (after seeing your other threads in the past) has me in a rage. I'm sorry, family or not, the first mistake was maybe forgivable but now, now they got to pay for being ignorant adults. Adults think that they know more than us AND they do BUT they also have to understand that sometimes we are smarter than them in other subjects... For them to demand something from you is definitely not ok especially when you said it wouldnt be good. Their using you really...

He has said a couple times that he is going to replace them in the spring, but I don't know that he actually will.

 

[Colin_T]

You need to be a little more aggressive. I would have told them to fuplie off and if they want media take it from the fuplie pond because you can't spare anymore from your tanks. If they don't like it, fuplie off.

My family tried crap like that with me but in relation to other stuff and I did my nut at them. It was the only way to get through to them. They all called me a mean foul mouthed little boy, but fuplie them.

Your uncle screwed up when he ordered koi before informing you.
Your uncle screwed up by washing the filter media and then using some chemicals on it.

They are your fish and your filters. You gave them some filter media to start with. You lost your fish because of them. You should not have to give up the remaining filter media from your tanks because they are a bunch of tossers. I don't give a rats bum if they are family. You should not lose fish because of their stupidity and selfishness.

They are fuplie lucky I am not there right now because I would drown most of your family in the damn pond.

------------------
Can you post some pictures of your remaining fish so we can try and see what is going on with the neons?

Have you checked the ammonia and nitrite in their tanks?

 

[WhistlingBadger]

Sorry that happened, Olive. It's a bummer being a kid, sometimes. I think you did the best you could in an impossible situation. It sounds like your mom realized what happened and is sorry, and that's worth a lot. You and the remaining fish will recover. I just hope your uncle learned something too.

 

[OliveFish05]

Sorry that happened, Olive. It's a bummer being a kid, sometimes. I think you did the best you could in an impossible situation. It sounds like your mom realized what happened and is sorry, and that's worth a lot. You and the remaining fish will recover. I just hope your uncle learned something too.

My mom totally misunderstood what was going on with the media, she thought the bacteria lived in the water and I just had to let the water touch the media so it could grab on or something... I don't know. I am just proud that she learned something about cycling But she is convinced it was her fault, when it wasn't. My aunt was pressuring the situation and there just wasn't time to work out the misunderstanding. I feel bad because she feels AWFUL, when it was really not her fault and even if it was her fault, she would never have done it on purpose.

You need to be a little more aggressive. I would have told them to fuplie off and if they want media take it from the fuplie pond because you can't spare anymore from your tanks. If they don't like it, fuplie off.

My family tried crap like that with me but in relation to other stuff and I did my nut at them. It was the only way to get through to them. They all called me a mean foul mouthed little boy, but fuplie them.

Your uncle screwed up when he ordered koi before informing you.
Your uncle screwed up by washing the filter media and then using some chemicals on it.

They are your fish and your filters. You gave them some filter media to start with. You lost your fish because of them. You should not have to give up the remaining filter media from your tanks because they are a bunch of tossers. I don't give a rats bum if they are family. You should not lose fish because of their stupidity and selfishness.

They are fuplie lucky I am not there right now because I would drown most of your family in the damn pond.

------------------
Can you post some pictures of your remaining fish so we can try and see what is going on with the neons?

Have you checked the ammonia and nitrite in their tanks?

I'll post some pictures of the remaining neons and gouramis. It just really sucks trying to work with people who don't know what they're doing, but think they do. My mom always says "show love", so I'm trying, really hard. He felt really awful after the pet store guy told him it was his fault

 

[WhistlingBadger]

My mom totally misunderstood what was going on with the media, she thought the bacteria lived in the water and I just had to let the water touch the media so it could grab on or something... I don't know. I am just proud that she learned something about cycling But she is convinced it was her fault, when it wasn't. My aunt was pressuring the situation and there just wasn't time to work out the misunderstanding. I feel bad because she feels AWFUL, when it was really not her fault and even if it was her fault, she would never have done it on purpose.

I'll post some pictures of the remaining neons and gouramis. It just really sucks trying to work with people who 1. Don't care and 2. Don't know what they're doing, but think they do. My mom always says "show love", so I'm trying, really hard. He felt really awful after the pet store guy told him it was his fault

You are a very nice person. Sometimes it's hard to know when to go with the flow and when to take a stand, especially when you're a kid and adult relatives are involved.

 

[Rocky998]

You are a very nice person. Sometimes it's hard to know when to go with the flow and when to take a stand, especially when you're a kid and adult relatives are involved.

Yes... It can be soooo difficult. You want to be respectful but yet when you actually know you're right, its so frustrating

 

[OliveFish05]

You are a very nice person. Sometimes it's hard to know when to go with the flow and when to take a stand, especially when you're a kid and adult relatives are involved.

I appreciate you saying that! I always try. My uncle feels really bad. It’s just the situation and lack of communication is soooooo frustrating. I’ll shape my uncle into a good fish keeper yet