Help :-(

[rob_deeks]

Hi, I would be really grateful for any help you can offer.
I set up a 60 gallon tank with heater and pump and water treatment for over a week.
I introduced 8 teras and a plek- unfortunately the teras died. I found one tetra being sucked into the filter and thought that maybe the filter was too strong for the fish in the tank. As I freed the tera, I moved the heater and accidentally changed the tempreture and I thought that was what killed them.

After a few days, it became apparent that the plek was fine - I ran water tests and the results came back fine, apart from general hardness. I consulted my local shop and they said that it is nothing to worry about.

Reassured,I introduced two female and one male fighting fish and now I'm worried.

Their behaviour is slugish and slow- they seem content to float.
I have turned the pump off because they keep getting pulled towards it.
I don't know what to do.
I can't find anything wrong per se but I have a terrible feeling they will die.
I can't understand what's wrong with the set up.

 

[Wills]

Hi welcome to the forum and they hobby! It sounds like your in a situation called a fish in cycle, basically when fish poo the poo creates poison called ammonia over time a bacteria will grow in your filter that will turn the ammonia into a lesser poison called nitrite and then an other type of bacteria will turn the nitrite into nitrate which is quite harmless and gets removed from the water when you do a water change.

Which test kit are you using and what are the readings for ammonia and nitrite?

What kind of plec is it? Is it just the common brown one that costs about £2 - £5? Which kind of tetras were they?

To control the fish in cycle to prevent any more fish dieing from exposure to ammonia and nitrite the best thing to do is do 50% water changes each day for a few weeks till no traces of ammonia and or nitrite are present in the tank. Just to point out this is advice you wont get from your fish shop but it is the best way to ensure the fish stay alive.

One more issue that has happend with the tank is, its always a bad idea to mix male and female fighting fish in a community tank, male fighting fish are particularly problematic in community tanks as well as it will limit the types of fish you can keep with him due to his aggression and also other fish that will nip him, it might be best if you get him is own 5 gallon tank and keep him alone and then get 4 more female fighters to keep with your single one now.

This is a common begginer mistake to impusle buy, I did it and I still do but I have enough knowledge to make decisions by my self rather than relying on pet shop employees which is what I would reccomend for you to do in the future research they types of fish you want in your tank learn all about them and then get them.

Like I say welcome to the forum sorry its bad news but its all mistakes we all make at the start of the hobby and usually because of bad advice from fish shops.

Wills

 

[rob_deeks]

Thank you so much for your response Wills.

Which test kit are you using and what are the readings for ammonia and nitrite?

We are using a six in one "Tetra" test kit.

The nitrite/nitrate levels appear to be fine: Between 10 and 25 for NO3 and 1 and 5 for NO2
sorry it's not so precise - it's based on colours.

The test itself doesn't take a reading for Amonia. I'll buy one.

What kind of plec is it? Is it just the common brown one that costs about £2 - £5? Which kind of tetras were they?

Common brown plec at 2.99 and the tetras were neon.

To control the fish in cycle to prevent any more fish dieing from exposure to ammonia and nitrite the best thing to do is do 50% water changes each day for a few weeks till no traces of ammonia and or nitrite are present in the tank. Just to point out this is advice you wont get from your fish shop but it is the best way to ensure the fish stay alive.

So, I should take out half the water and replace it with water treated to be safe. I've been using Nutrafin's AquaPlus and Cycle - have you any experience of these products?

Thankfully, the fish have made it through the night and they look a little brighter.
Do you think I should put the filter back on to oxygenate the water or leave it off until they get stronger? (before they didn't seem strong enough to deal with it and were getting buffeted by the current)

Thanks for all your advice.

 

[Harlequins]

Hi & welcome

I agree with what wills said above

Have a read of this Beginners section it tells you about the nitrogen cycle,its what your filter needs to go through before fish can safely be put in the tank without fear of death.

Your neons probably died of ammonia poisoning and not the filter being too strong, the plec is a messing fish so i hope your filter is a good one to keep the water clear.

I would advise taking the fighting fish back for now until you get your water quality sorted.their sluggish behaviour is because of poor water quality.

For now do a very large waterchange with dechlorinator and try to temperature match.this will keep the fish happy for a short while,
I suggest you buy a liquid test kit,a fair few use api master test kit,which tests for ammonia/nitrite/nitrate & ph,these are available on ebay for around £20 incl P&P,whereas lfs tend to tell them around the £30 mark.
You'll need to test for ammonia/nitrite -these 2 are the ones that need to be kept at zero

Good luck & let us know how you go.

 

[Harlequins]

Test strips are very unreliable - with the readings you have there,your n02 nitrite is extremely high,you need at best to do a 75% w/c to bring this down has your fish will be suffering from it.

 

[rob_deeks]

Thanks Harlequins - I've done the 75% water change. The fish already look a lot happier.
So now I do a 50% water change every day until the kit arrives to do an accurate test of the water.
It's strange - on the kit itself - 0-25 for NO3 and 1-5 for NO2 are marked as safe levels.
I'll definately buy a new tester kit.

Thanks so much for all your advice

 

[Harlequins]

Well done on the w/c your fish will thank you for that

Yes that would be good to do a 50% w/c daily,just to keep the levels down until your new test kit comes

Did you read up on the nitrogen cycle? basically by the fish breathing,pooing,eating etc produce ammonia this in turns produces nitrite,which then converts to nitrate - the only way to remove nitrates is that once the filter in the tank has cycled,they're removed by weekly w/c.


N03 - nitrate is ok,depends what your tap water is,once you get your kit,test the tap water for all testers,its not uncommon to see nitrates straight from the tap,mine is 10ppm.-
N02 - nitrite is only safe at zero,some say that during cycling 0.25ppm is okish before w/c is needed.

But tbh any ammonia or nitrite in the tank is deadly for fish,it may not kill them straight away but it burns their gills etc leading to a shortened life & then eventual death,

Good luck

 

[Wills]

Agree with what harlequins said really, I would probs take the fighters back due to the problems with the water at the moment but once things level out you could possibly add some females back to the community if you like them.

The plec though small now will quickly outgrow your tank eventually growing to a massive 18 inches! And in a tank like yours they will grow fast a bit more than an inch per month. But he will be okay for now, just something to bear in mind.

I would also advise you to get an API master test kit this is a liquid test kit that is one of the most reliable and costs about £15 for all the bottles you need

Wills

 

[OldMan47]

Welcome to the forum Rob Deeks.
The amount of nitrite and ammonia concentrations that are acceptable vary a lot depending on the pH of your water. In low pH water, more ammonia can be tolerated but less nitrite can be tolerated. Here on TFF we tend to assume the worst in terms of pH and always advise that both ammonia and nitrites be maintained at less than 0.25 ppm. In very low pH situations, you can even do well with rather high ammonia levels, but it is dangerous to establish such a situation. The least bobble in pH will leave a previously perfectly fine tank in a very toxic situation.
We ordinarily deal with chemistry problems in the New fish tank section so I will move this thread there for people like WD to help you out.