Hello All

[Tybs]

Hi All

Well I am looking at getting into this Hobby or should I say my wife is, we havent kept fish before myself although have kinda looked after some for a while.

So first question is Tank ?
My wife and I for that matter really like the BiOrb Life 60L, is this a good starting tank ?
We havent got the room for anything much bigger at the moment and I want to be sure its a good idea before getting anything bigger.

Looking forward to the comments and help

Tybs

 

[Gvilleguy]

Hi Tybs - welcome to the forum!! One thing to keep in mind with tank size is the limitation on how many fish can fit safely in the tank without overloading it. Too many fish in too small a tank = too much ammonia waste which will hurt the fish.

A general rule of thumb I have seen on this forum is 1" of fish per 1 gallon of aquarium. So your 60 liter would be about 15 gallons = 15" inches total of adult fish. Does this make sense?

 

[Jenste]

to be honest, the 1" per gallon is pretty much rubbish....one 5" fish is going to produce much more waste than five 1" fish, right?

there is no exact guideline to the "number" of fish per liter/gallon....experienced fish keepers are able to stock their tanks more than new tank keepers due to tank maturity, filter, not to mention knowledge and a sense for maintenance.


for a 15 gallon tank I would suggest limiting yourself to about 3 types of fish that appeal to you - - you should stay away from all bottom dwelling fish such as corydoras, plecos, catfish etc, the "orb" shape does not give them any room to swim about - - also corydoras are schooling fish, meaning you would need to have atleast 4, preferably more than 6 for them to be happy...and considering most cory species grow to approx 3", a standard 15 gallon tank would be pretty much stocked. also, in a tank this size, you should be able to do the teeny algae maintenance yourself - - do not get a pleco or catfish to do the work for you! most of them get 6" + and the common pleco gets 18" - 24" I believe. yes, they all start off tiny - all fish in the pet stores are juveniles/babies....but trust me, they grow QUICKLY!

also, no goldfish, no matter how small it is when you buy it, will live happily in this tank - it is tiny because it is very very young - one goldfish should be in atleast a 20 gallon tank due to their waste production and sheer mass!



i suggest getting either 3 groups of tetras of 5 fish each (or better yet 2 schools of 6-8 fish each). tetras are simply gorgeous shoaling together, and their slim bodies and quick movements will give you a lovely ball of flashing colors

you could also look into getting one dwarf gourami - I am not an expert on these however so I will leave someone more experienced to lead you in the right direction about their proper care.


but before you start adding fish....I suggest you research "fish-less cycling" there are very helpful how-to articles in the beginners section. it takes patience, but in the end you will have happy and healthy fish, with minimal needless dying!

 

[Gvilleguy]

I think it's a good rule of thumb for beginners for the very reasons you mentioned - "tank maturity, filter, not to mention knowledge and a sense for maintenance". That rule tends to keep beginners from overstocking, killing fish, and getting discouraged.

 

[Jenste]

I think it's a good rule of thumb for beginners for the very reasons you mentioned - "tank maturity, filter, not to mention knowledge and a sense for maintenance". That rule tends to keep beginners from overstocking, killing fish, and getting discouraged.

yes, but they cant be thinking that two 5" fish can live in a ten gallon tank - - that was why i explained it a little more in depth of ONE five inch fish needing very different requirements than five ONE inch fish, you know? a newbie can simply think one inch to one gallon and find themselves in an awful situation . . . but for tiny, slim bodied fish like tetras and hatchets, it is a fairly acceptable guideline.

 

[Tybs]

Gvilleguy & Jenste

Many thanks for your comments all taken on board, and I had read on this site about Fish-less cycling and will be doing that too, our local supplier even suggests taking a water sample into them prior to stocking to ensurre all is ok.

Just wondered if there are any major reasons NOT to use a BiOrb ?

 

[Jenste]

well if you have the choice between a 15 gallon rectangular tank vs a 15 gallon orb, I personally would choose the rectangular tank. this allows for more surface area = = more swimming room etc. you can also have more options for stocking. with an orb you pretty much need to plan for mid-range fish .... bottom and top dwelling fish will have very little room to swim. from what I have heard, mind you I have never had one personally so I am simply stating what orb owners have told me, the filtration system an orb comes with is somewhat rubbish and a pain in the behind to clean.

also, the price tag of the orb is much higher than the equivalent sized rectangular tank . . why not use that extra money and invest in a slightly larger tank? say a 20-30 gallon? this will open up your stocking possibilities IMMENSELY, and also the larger the tank, the more stable the water is, and the less overall worries. you will also find that you will enjoy the possibilities of a larger tank . . . once you get the hang of this hobby, you are always dreaming for bigger!!

 

[Tybs]

well if you have the choice between a 15 gallon rectangular tank vs a 15 gallon orb, I personally would choose the rectangular tank. this allows for more surface area = = more swimming room etc. you can also have more options for stocking. with an orb you pretty much need to plan for mid-range fish .... bottom and top dwelling fish will have very little room to swim. from what I have heard, mind you I have never had one personally so I am simply stating what orb owners have told me, the filtration system an orb comes with is somewhat rubbish and a pain in the behind to clean.

also, the price tag of the orb is much higher than the equivalent sized rectangular tank . . why not use that extra money and invest in a slightly larger tank? say a 20-30 gallon? this will open up your stocking possibilities IMMENSELY, and also the larger the tank, the more stable the water is, and the less overall worries. you will also find that you will enjoy the possibilities of a larger tank . . . once you get the hang of this hobby, you are always dreaming for bigger!!

Yes I take your point about a larger tank but at the moment I dont have the room without redesigning the room, the BiOrb we are thinking of is not a bowl but a retangular shape Taller than wider BiOrb Life and if the wife likes it and manages to keep the fish alive I have no doubt we will be getting a bigger tank later on.

 

[Gvilleguy]

I think it's a good rule of thumb for beginners for the very reasons you mentioned - "tank maturity, filter, not to mention knowledge and a sense for maintenance". That rule tends to keep beginners from overstocking, killing fish, and getting discouraged.

yes, but they cant be thinking that two 5" fish can live in a ten gallon tank - - that was why i explained it a little more in depth of ONE five inch fish needing very different requirements than five ONE inch fish, you know? a newbie can simply think one inch to one gallon and find themselves in an awful situation . . . but for tiny, slim bodied fish like tetras and hatchets, it is a fairly acceptable guideline.

Yep - you're right about that. I was thinking smaller fish when I typed my initial reply.

 

[Quisty]

to be honest, the 1" per gallon is pretty much rubbish....one 5" fish is going to produce much more waste than five 1" fish, right?

there is no exact guideline to the "number" of fish per liter/gallon....experienced fish keepers are able to stock their tanks more than new tank keepers due to tank maturity, filter, not to mention knowledge and a sense for maintenance.


for a 15 gallon tank I would suggest limiting yourself to about 3 types of fish that appeal to you - - you should stay away from all bottom dwelling fish such as corydoras, plecos, catfish etc, the "orb" shape does not give them any room to swim about - - also corydoras are schooling fish, meaning you would need to have atleast 4, preferably more than 6 for them to be happy...and considering most cory species grow to approx 3", a standard 15 gallon tank would be pretty much stocked. also, in a tank this size, you should be able to do the teeny algae maintenance yourself - - do not get a pleco or catfish to do the work for you! most of them get 6" + and the common pleco gets 18" - 24" I believe. yes, they all start off tiny - all fish in the pet stores are juveniles/babies....but trust me, they grow QUICKLY!

also, no goldfish, no matter how small it is when you buy it, will live happily in this tank - it is tiny because it is very very young - one goldfish should be in atleast a 20 gallon tank due to their waste production and sheer mass!



i suggest getting either 3 groups of tetras of 5 fish each (or better yet 2 schools of 6-8 fish each). tetras are simply gorgeous shoaling together, and their slim bodies and quick movements will give you a lovely ball of flashing colors

you could also look into getting one dwarf gourami - I am not an expert on these however so I will leave someone more experienced to lead you in the right direction about their proper care.


but before you start adding fish....I suggest you research "fish-less cycling" there are very helpful how-to articles in the beginners section. it takes patience, but in the end you will have happy and healthy fish, with minimal needless dying!

Dwarf gourami's are touchy. Of the fish I have had in my tanks....I had powder blue dwarf gourami's....and they would be the fish that got sick and wouldn't make it...they were beautiful... but were very touchy... this is in my experience of course.

Tetra's would be pretty to have in the tank. Especially in a small school. ^^

 

[OohFeeshy]

I'd probably pick a different tank, there are quite a few of a similar size that are also quite pretty. The main issues with the Biorb tanks are the filtration, substrate (which acts as the filter media, but means you can't really have plants or bottom dwellers), that it's acryllic (scratches easily) and maintenance is going to be pretty tricky.

My opinion would be that if you're going to have a tank of a similar footprint to the Biorb one, it's likely to be a better option to have it shorter. It might mean less volume, but given that it's going to have a bigger surface area to volume, and is going to be much easier to maintain and decorate, it's going to save a fair bit of hassle.

 

[Assaye]

BiOrb and BiOrb Life tanks have much less surface area (which means less swimming room and oxygen) than traditional rectangular tanks. You can still do a certain amount with them but there are more restrictions.

1) Avoid bottom dwellers, with shrimp and otos as possible exceptions. Many bottom feeding fish like to sift through sand or fine gravel which isn't appropriate for these tanks and they don't have much space to move around. Shrimp will go all over the place and have a low bio-load (i.e. they don't produce much waste) and otos are tiny suckermouth catfish so will spend a lot of time on the plants and glass. However, both of these species should be kept in groups of 4-6 as a minimum and they get to over an inch each.

2) Don't go for bigger tetras/rasboras - the tank is tall rather than long and so this reduces swimming space. Go for a lot of something tiny rather than 5 or 6 larger tetras that in my opinion won't have the swimming room. Green neon tetras, ember tetras, celestial pearl danios and microrasboras are great little fish. I'll be honest - I would even avoid stuff like neons and white clouds because they get to 1.5 inches. Your choice though, I wouldn't say it was cruel, just not ideal. In a regular 60 litre this wouldn't be a problem.

3) If we go on a fish needing at least 6 x it's own body length (this generally goes for larger fish), you are much more limited on medium-large fish in these tanks.

However, if you can bare to understock and really like the tanks, give it a go!

 

[Tybs]

BiOrb and BiOrb Life tanks have much less surface area (which means less swimming room and oxygen) than traditional rectangular tanks. You can still do a certain amount with them but there are more restrictions.

1) Avoid bottom dwellers, with shrimp and otos as possible exceptions. Many bottom feeding fish like to sift through sand or fine gravel which isn't appropriate for these tanks and they don't have much space to move around. Shrimp will go all over the place and have a low bio-load (i.e. they don't produce much waste) and otos are tiny suckermouth catfish so will spend a lot of time on the plants and glass. However, both of these species should be kept in groups of 4-6 as a minimum and they get to over an inch each.

2) Don't go for bigger tetras/rasboras - the tank is tall rather than long and so this reduces swimming space. Go for a lot of something tiny rather than 5 or 6 larger tetras that in my opinion won't have the swimming room. Green neon tetras, ember tetras, celestial pearl danios and microrasboras are great little fish. I'll be honest - I would even avoid stuff like neons and white clouds because they get to 1.5 inches. Your choice though, I wouldn't say it was cruel, just not ideal. In a regular 60 litre this wouldn't be a problem.

3) If we go on a fish needing at least 6 x it's own body length (this generally goes for larger fish), you are much more limited on medium-large fish in these tanks.

However, if you can bare to understock and really like the tanks, give it a go!

Many thanks Assaye for all the comments, I have passed these onto the other half and I think we are now considering an alternative, something more normal, just got to find the right tank for the location we want to put it. Also my wife wante to have some nice plants in the tank and this seems to be a big issue with the BiOrbs, so back to the drawing board and more shopping at the weekend I reckon.

Again many thanks to you all for your help

 

[Jenste]

don't forget to keep us updated! I look forward to seeing pictures of your new tank, your fishless cycling diary (if you choose to post one, they are quite helpful) and of course stocking plans and pictures!

 

[Assaye]

BiOrb and BiOrb Life tanks have much less surface area (which means less swimming room and oxygen) than traditional rectangular tanks. You can still do a certain amount with them but there are more restrictions.

1) Avoid bottom dwellers, with shrimp and otos as possible exceptions. Many bottom feeding fish like to sift through sand or fine gravel which isn't appropriate for these tanks and they don't have much space to move around. Shrimp will go all over the place and have a low bio-load (i.e. they don't produce much waste) and otos are tiny suckermouth catfish so will spend a lot of time on the plants and glass. However, both of these species should be kept in groups of 4-6 as a minimum and they get to over an inch each.

2) Don't go for bigger tetras/rasboras - the tank is tall rather than long and so this reduces swimming space. Go for a lot of something tiny rather than 5 or 6 larger tetras that in my opinion won't have the swimming room. Green neon tetras, ember tetras, celestial pearl danios and microrasboras are great little fish. I'll be honest - I would even avoid stuff like neons and white clouds because they get to 1.5 inches. Your choice though, I wouldn't say it was cruel, just not ideal. In a regular 60 litre this wouldn't be a problem.

3) If we go on a fish needing at least 6 x it's own body length (this generally goes for larger fish), you are much more limited on medium-large fish in these tanks.

However, if you can bare to understock and really like the tanks, give it a go!

Many thanks Assaye for all the comments, I have passed these onto the other half and I think we are now considering an alternative, something more normal, just got to find the right tank for the location we want to put it. Also my wife wante to have some nice plants in the tank and this seems to be a big issue with the BiOrbs, so back to the drawing board and more shopping at the weekend I reckon.

Again many thanks to you all for your help

Yeah, BiOrbs are OK if you restrict yourself to plants that can grow on wood and rocks (such as java fern and anubias) but they are rubbish if you want plants that grow in the substrate because these plants need fine gravel or sand which the BiOrb can't support without major moifications.

If you want a tank that is a good size but has a small footprint try a Aqua One Aqua Start 500. 65 litres and while it isn't as long as some 60-70 litre tanks, it's still got good dimensions and isn't too deep. I keep neon tetras in one of mine and they have plenty of space. I wouldn't recommend it for larger shoaling fish like rainbows, tiger barbs, danios and larger tetras but it's great for smaller tetras and rasboras. I would also recommend getting a Fluval U2 filter, as these tanks come with undergravel filters which are a pain to clean (as you have to empty the entire tank) and pose similar problems to the BiOrbs, plants wise.

Just ask if you would like some photos.