Goldfish Not Well Please Help

[Charmian]

My neighbour has asked me to look after his 3 goldfish for two weeks and gave them to me in a small 1 litre round fishbowl that people used to use in the old days.
anyway, i knew that 3 medium size fish would not be happy in a sterile round bowl with no filter. i had a tank in the loft so i cleaned it out and took a chance of putting them in. luckily i had water conditioner etc to start it off. i knew i had to cycle a tank but hated seeing them in the tiny bowl. i think i should have left them in there as this morning they just hover on the bottom of my 10 litre tank (I know that is still too small). I think they may have fin rot... not sure yet. I have only had them 1 day. He changes half of their water every few days with bottled water. I think he has had them for a few months. He was going to throw them in the duck pond near where we live if I could not look after them. He doesn't know anything about fish. He is Iranian and buys them every year to celebrate 'life' and I guess that when they get too ill he throws them. But now I have got them for 2 weeks but do you think they will survive my water change and everything? When I give them back he will put them in the glass bowl again. advice needed please.
This morning when I got up they were looking rather lifeless and at the bottom of tank.

 

[lil'fish]

Are goldfish does form time to time. I could be wrong but try some swim bladder A.S.A.P.

 

[This Old Spouse]

He probably does this every year, giving them to a different neighbor each time and then they die in the neighbor's care.

There are so many things wrong with this scenario it's difficult to know where to start. First, changing the water in their bowl and using bottled water is the first mistake. Tap water is really what they need (minus the chlorine, of course) for all the added minerals, etc.

Do you have any friends or a good LFS where you could get some mature filter media? That would help, but I'd actually try to find them a new home somewhere they'd do well, such as someone with a pond. When the neighbor gets back maybe you could tell him they died.

If you want to attempt this, go to the beginner's section and read up on fish-in cycles (you can click the link below my sig). But, if the neighbor is just going to toss them back in the bowl when he returns, I'd honestly go with my last suggestion. Rehome them.

And, welcome to the forum.

 

[fluttermoth]

I'd try and re-home them while he was away too. just tell him you're sorry but they died?

Couldn't you tell him it's very bad luck in England to keep fish in bowls or something?

 

[Charmian]

I'd try and re-home them while he was away too. just tell him you're sorry but they died?

Couldn't you tell him it's very bad luck in England to keep fish in bowls or something?

Hahaha..... yes that is a good one!
I guess you have gathered that I have not given the fish back? I have been posting about the Juwel Rekord that I started up for them. I bought a new Aqua-Flow 200 filter pump.
I am now trying to cycle it.
When I get back I am going to either give them to the petshop who have a great Aquatic section or a friend's garden pond.
But my neighbour has not asked about them and he has been back since Friday.
C

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

The reason why they are unwell is probably due to the cycling conditions in the tank. You should test the tank for ammonia, nitrites & nitrates daily and do small/medium sized partial water changes with dechlorinator whenever you see any trace of ammonia or nitrites in the aquarium. Only by controlling the water quality this way keeping the toxic ammonia & nitrites to a minimum will the goldfish stand a chance. However the smaller the volume of water the more rapidly water quality conditions will fluctuate (bad) and so by upgrading their aquarium size it will help them cope with the upcoming watert quality problems ahead.
Although.
If you know anyone with an established filtered fish tank, you can help automatically cycle your goldfishes aquarium by squeezing some of the muck from a mature fish filter into the goldfish tanks filter- as long as te filter is fully established, the muck will be full of the beneficial nitrifying bacteria responsible for cyling aquariums and so by transfering the bacteria to the new filter you can help instantly cycle the aquarium .

 

[Charmian]

after my initial post when I first got them they are now doing fine. After a couple of days being in the 10 L tank they perked up as, I guess it was better than what they were in and the shock of the move.
Now they are in a 60L and all three swim together exploring and looking happy (as a goldfish can look?)
They hopefully won't be in there for too long. Just until I can get them another home as said previously.
I tested their water again and it was 2.0 on the Nitrite strip. So I changed 20L treated with Aquaplus treatment.
Should I test again Wednesday night and then how much do I change then? I don't want to keep changing if I am going to make it too clean. Should I still be pyphoning the gravel or should I leave it to gain some bacteria?
Thanks to you all!

 

[Louiseness]

Should I test again Wednesday night and then how much do I change then? I don't want to keep changing if I am going to make it too clean. Should I still be pyphoning the gravel or should I leave it to gain some bacteria?
Thanks to you all!

You can't really make it 'too clean'. The majority of the bacteria live in the filter media (sponges or whatever), not in the gravel or water.

You should change some water (probably around 50%) or more whenever you get a reading of over 0.25 for either ammonia or nitrite. I'd clean the gravel every time too if you can because goldfish are messy and all the decaying waste will worsen the water quality.

 

[Charmian]

Should I test again Wednesday night and then how much do I change then? I don't want to keep changing if I am going to make it too clean. Should I still be pyphoning the gravel or should I leave it to gain some bacteria?
Thanks to you all!

You can't really make it 'too clean'. The majority of the bacteria live in the filter media (sponges or whatever), not in the gravel or water.

You should change some water (probably around 50%) or more whenever you get a reading of over 0.25 for either ammonia or nitrite. I'd clean the gravel every time too if you can because goldfish are messy and all the decaying waste will worsen the water quality.

I did a 20L water change an hour ago and did the gravel all over.
The API Nitraite test kit showed the level as 2.0 (one up from the bottom). So that is real bad!
Should I turn the setting on the Aqua-Flow 200 pump up to MAX whilst I am away or MIN? The pump is more powerful than I need. The petshop said to take the bigger pump so that I am not always cleaning it out. SO which setting please?

 

[Charmian]

The pump says it is for 100-200L and I have a 60L

 

[soybean]

Do you have a proper filter with sponges or just an air pump for bubbles? A pump will simply and water surface movement and add oxygen. It doesn't negate the need to clean them out.

Gravel grows an insignificant amount of bacteria and really won't be making a difference. Nor is it held in the water. It's all about the filter. If you have one, don't be cleaning that, you need the gunk to build up, this us what changes ammonia and nitrite into less harmful nitrate.

I would take the gravel out. I always kept my goldfish barebottom. Not only are you taking up valuable space in that tiny 60 l tank but having no gravel means you can see and be sure you're getting all the mess. You could always leave a handful for them to peck over, but that is optional.

Anything over 0 for ammonia or nitrite is dangerous - 2 incredibly high and I can't believe it's managed to get that high. When cycling a filter you need to be doing large water changes daily without fail to remove the ammonia and nitrite until the filter is able to cope with it. By large I mean taking out enough water to leave the fish just enough to swim in, if you don't want to remove them - around 80%. This can take a long time but must be done daily else the fish will suffer. Ammonia and nitrite can damage the gills especially, which is how fish breathe, so must be avoided.

Goldfish (and many other fish) also secrete a growth hormone into the water. If this is not removed by water changes it can lead to them becoming incredibly stunted.

I really think they need to go in that pond you mentioned. They really will be better off all round. the tank clearly isn't cycled and they won't survive two weeks without a water change, or if they do they will be damaged by the toxins, internally and externally.


If you'd like to see the effects of overcrowding in poor water, see this post and the photos: http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/370086-can-anyone-help-please-my-three-fish-with-illnesses-photos/page__pid__3092294#entry3092294

 

[Louiseness]

I really think they need to go in that pond you mentioned. They really will be better off all round. the tank clearly isn't cycled and they won't survive two weeks without a water change, or if they do they will be damaged by the toxins.

+1.

Air pump or not, I'd bet if you leave them for two weeks in that tank you'll come back to three dead goldfish. The pond would be much more suitable, especially if they're still small.

 

[Charmian]

I really think they need to go in that pond you mentioned. They really will be better off all round. the tank clearly isn't cycled and they won't survive two weeks without a water change, or if they do they will be damaged by the toxins.

+1.

Air pump or not, I'd bet if you leave them for two weeks in that tank you'll come back to three dead goldfish. The pond would be much more suitable, especially if they're still small.

There is a green sponge in the filter and a black carbon sponge in it too. The box says dula-action filter medium with activated carbon.
There is also a spray bar that comes out of the side of the pump which the water comes out of and sprays back into the top of the water causing bubbles to drop down.

 

[Louiseness]

There is a green sponge in the filter and a black carbon sponge in it too. The box says dula-action filter medium with activated carbon.
There is also a spray bar that comes out of the side of the pump which the water comes out of and sprays back into the top of the water causing bubbles to drop down.

Ok good, at least we know you have a filter now and not jsut an air pump

But you really do need to cycle the filter, if you leave them without changing the water for two weeks with an uncycled filter they won't do well at all - the amount of bubbles in the water will make little to no difference.

 

[Charmian]

There is a green sponge in the filter and a black carbon sponge in it too. The box says dula-action filter medium with activated carbon.
There is also a spray bar that comes out of the side of the pump which the water comes out of and sprays back into the top of the water causing bubbles to drop down.

Ok good, at least we know you have a filter now and not jsut an air pump

But you really do need to cycle the filter, if you leave them without changing the water for two weeks with an uncycled filter they won't do well at all - the amount of bubbles in the water will make little to no difference.

Hi again.
They have always had a filter when I have had them. As soon as I got them from my neighbour I put them in my 10 L with a little pump. Then I transferred them into the 60L and bought a new 200 pump because I didn't have one in that tank. I did not expect to get these fish. But they were all in one fairground glass bowl that holds around 2 pints. They have been in there since March and I got them beginning of Aug. He used to change their water with bottled water and they never had a filter until I got them. So I will do a 80% water change and see how we go. I cannot get them to the person's house with a pond until I get back otherwise I would.
Do you think I should put the pump speed up to Max or have it on Min setting for the flow rate of water do you think?
Thanks for your time, I do appreciate it!