getting a new tank and considering cold water

dhjaksu

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possibly getting a 63 gallon tank next wednesday. If I do get it then I plan on setting it up and moving over a couple filters from my 55 to cycle it. I'm selling the majority of the fish from my 55 so moving over half of the filters (there are 4) wont be a big deal. 2 filters are also enough filtration for either tank, each filter is suitable for tanks up to 40 gallon and both tanks are under 80 gallons. I will also add 2 fresh large sponge filters to each tank so both tanks will still have at least 160 gallons worth of filtration. the new tank also having the internal like powered filter which is suitable up to 100 gallons, so will have a bit of flow and with 3 sponge filters it will have 220 gallons worth of filtration.

Anyway, what are some cold water fish? I know goldfish and axolotls and that's about it. all my other tanks have tropical fish.

I will still probably put in a heater just to regulate the temperature as winter starts next month (not that it gets very cold in Australia).

but yeah does anyone have suggestions for cold water fish that are legal in Australia?


If not I will likely use it as a bristlenose grow out tank.
 
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dhjaksu

dhjaksu

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White cloud mountain minnows are my favorite, they will breed, and they look great in big schools.
how many could go in a 60 gal? Would eventually probably be heavily planted as I can afford plants.
 

Guyb93

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What is cold water in down under ? Am i delusional but aren’t you Guys sub tropical and not get away with things like torpedo barbs ?
 

itiwhetu

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how many could go in a 60 gal? Would eventually probably be heavily planted as I can afford plants.
So, I had a 250-liter tank and let them breed over a couple of seasons. I supplied the LFS with fish and had a running population of around 150 fish. The wonderful thing about White clouds is that the fry stays on the surface and the adults under them and they never cross paths so you can just let them go and the population will naturally grow.
 

GaryE

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I'm also curious about the definition of cold water. I know there are regions in Australia not as warm as others, but what do you deal with?

You might have access to one of my holy grail fish that I once kept in unheated tanks here, at 19-20 degrees. Melanotaenia duboulayi is next to impossible to find here but should be available there, maybe even in local waters. You lot have giant crocodiles, venomous mammals and spiders galore, but you also have some of the most phenomenal aquarium fish possible in your creeks and streams, at your local temperatures (depending on where you are in your vast country).
 
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dhjaksu

dhjaksu

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I'm also curious about the definition of cold water. I know there are regions in Australia not as warm as others, but what do you deal with?

You might have access to one of my holy grail fish that I once kept in unheated tanks here, at 19-20 degrees. Melanotaenia duboulayi is next to impossible to find here but should be available there, maybe even in local waters. You lot have giant crocodiles, venomous mammals and spiders galore, but you also have some of the most phenomenal aquarium fish possible in your creeks and streams, at your local temperatures (depending on where you are in your vast country).
Oh yeah the local creeks and steams are full of them. I actually had a wild caught one given to me with some empire gudgeons when I first got my current tank. I felt bad only having one though and didn’t have the gear to catch them and the local aquarium shop didn’t have them in stock at the time so I gave it away to someone with a group of them. It was a good 10cm too. A female I think.

In the local aquarium shop locally bred ones are $10.40 each.

I’m in qld along the coast so it’s not super cold here at all really but it’s also not as hot as like the the Northern Territory and not as cold as like Sydney. But yeah I’m like right in the middle of the country (from most north to most south) along the east coast. So like in the middle of the temperature range here. Not too hot and not too cold.

What is cold water in down under ? Am i delusional but aren’t you Guys sub tropical and not get away with things like torpedo barbs ?
Well I classify cold water as anything below tropical fish temperatures. So like any theist below (and not counting) 24 degrees Celsius.
Which is what my ingested tanks are sitting at now, the last month of autumn. In summer my tanks were up to 27 degrees. So whatever fish I get will need to be ok with going up to there as well I guess unless I get a cooler. That was the tank right near the window that gets a lot of direct sunlight though, the tanks on the other side of the room in the very middle of the building overall would be a bit cooler.
So, I had a 250-liter tank and let them breed over a couple of seasons. I supplied the LFS with fish and had a running population of around 150 fish. The wonderful thing about White clouds is that the fry stays on the surface and the adults under them and they never cross paths so you can just let them go and the population will naturally grow.
Ok so start with like 10-20 and I will end up with hundreds quite quickly?
 

Kolykaf

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I don’t think that you should seek ‘cold water’ fish unless your temps go below 20C for extended periods. Unless particularly hardy, some of these fish would be stressed at 27C. The comfortable zone for most tropical fish is in the range of 22 and 26 (many can go a bit higher or lower for a time). If your winter temps don’t drop significantly below 24, you should be fine with all but a few species that require very high temps like blue rams and discus.
 

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If you have wild Rainbowfish on your doorstep your coldwater is probably different to the US and UK haha! Why not go down that route rather than white clouds and goldfish? I do like fancy goldfish but those rainbows mentioned are amazing!

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I started the hobby after catching local sticklebacks out of curiosity. They're very common where I am, but not good keeping males in the same small tank I had.
Also, apart from a flash of red on the males they lacked appeal.
Having moved to tropical, I would be really chuffed if my local waters had the same species that have there. Why not just stick with them.
I have blue eyed red finned rainbows from down your way, bred locally here and currently breeding in a new tank I set up for them.
You have loads of choice so browse through them and I'm sure you'll find some that would fit in well.
 

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SOUTHERN HALF OF AUSTRALIA
In the southern half of Australia we have summer temperatures during the day, between 25-40C, sometimes warmer. At might it's around 20-25C.

In winter it drops to 2-3C at night (sometimes below 0C) and goes up to 15-18C during the day.

Tasmania is off the south east coast of Australia and gets a bit cooler. They sometimes have snow, as does Victoria in the mountains.

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NORTHERN HALF OF AUSTRALIA
In the northern half of the country it sits above 25C all year round and regularly hits 35-40C during the day, and 20-25C at night.

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INLAND DESERTS
In the desert it can hit 50C in the shade during summer and drop to 5C at night.

In winter it's a bit cooler during the day and the southern parts of the desert will be around 20-25C during the day, while the northern parts of the desert sit on 30-40C during the day.

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QUEENSLAND
Queensland starts about half way up the country and goes right up north to the top of the country. In the southern parts of the state they have summer day time temperatures around 25-40C.

In winter it drops to 15-25C during the day. It's warm enough for most tropical fishes but not discus. They still need a heater.

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There's a number of Australian rainbowfish that can be kept in south Queensland without heaters. In Perth WA (on the other side of the country), we have Rhadinocentrus ornatus, Pseduomugil signifer and mellis, plus most of the Australian Melanotaenia species outdoors all year round. It takes a few generations to get them surviving right through winter but we have a number of people keeping these fish outdoors all year. They can all be kept in Queensland without heaters.

If you don't want rainbowfish, there are Galaxias from New South Wales and Victoria. If you don't want them, go for barbs and tetras.

Bitterlings will survive and so will pygmy perch.

Personally, I would go for Rhadinocentrus ornatus, there are some beautiful coloured fish around New South Wales and southern Queensland.
 

GaryE

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You Australians do understand how much aquarists outside your country value your native fish? I would love to just see a live Pseudomugil mellis, let alone have a chance at breeding. I spent years looking for duboulayi, only the ones I finally found had tb and I had to end the line. Stunning fish. I have M. utcheensis rainbows, and always have an ear out for talk of any other Australian (or PNG) bows or blue eyes available.

Mogurnda mogurnda and Chlamydogobius eremius are two other wishlist fish I will probably never see again. Rhadinocentrus? Someday.

Meanwhile, I console myself when I'm freezing in the long dark winter by remembering the Australian spider pics I've seen. My great great great grandfather escaped from prison prior to transportation to Australia, and hitched a ride on a ship bound for Newfoundland before he could be tracked down. I don't think they had weather websites back then.
 
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dhjaksu

dhjaksu

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You Australians do understand how much aquarists outside your country value your native fish? I would love to just see a live Pseudomugil mellis, let alone have a chance at breeding. I spent years looking for duboulayi, only the ones I finally found had tb and I had to end the line. Stunning fish. I have M. utcheensis rainbows, and always have an ear out for talk of any other Australian (or PNG) bows or blue eyes available.

Mogurnda mogurnda and Chlamydogobius eremius are two other wishlist fish I will probably never see again. Rhadinocentrus? Someday.

Meanwhile, I console myself when I'm freezing in the long dark winter by remembering the Australian spider pics I've seen. My great great great grandfather escaped from prison prior to transportation to Australia, and hitched a ride on a ship bound for Newfoundland before he could be tracked down. I don't think they had weather websites back then.
It really is great here. and unless you live in some remote place inland or in the rainforest areas then the amount of spiders is really over exaggerated. I mean the ones you are most likely to see in your house are daddy long legs (harmless to humans). outside most likely to see are jumping spiders (adorable little thing and really friendly, even little kids hold them and their parents are fine with it, I've held hundreds of them and never seen the slightest aggression from them. they also dont seem afraid of people). if you go outside at night you might see a huntsman. also not a threat.

my favourites are golden orb weavers. they are big spiders and have big very obvious gold webs they sit in the middle of. they are practically impossible to accidently come into direct contact with. out of all listed so far those are the only ones I wouldn't handle. not that they are likely too make you bed ridden or kill you or anything, they just look like they would hurt quite a bit if they decided to stick their fangs into you. plus most of the ones you see are giant females and half the time they are gravid or protecting an egg sac.

money spiders are another common one. sometimes found inside. pretty harmless to people. not going to cause anything serious.

st andrews spiders are another one you only ever really see outside. low risk to humans and they live on their web, same as the golden orb weavers.

wolf spiders are more like jumping spiders and huntsmans in the way that you wont find them on a web. would not recommend touching them but I still have and found them pretty docile.

red backs are the main ones people worry about. I only recall ever seeing them in 3 places. and I only know one person who's been bitten and it was entirely there fault. I don't know anyone that's been bitten by any of the others (the daddy long legs probably try to bite but they are physically unable to break human skin).


but yeah those are the most common spiders where I am and none are really a threat.
only other type I've seen that I can think of off the top of my head are other orb weavers and crab spiders. Wouldn't worry about any of them.


oh the spiders with the coolest webs are dome web spiders. only ever seen them twice and both time out in a really bushy areas not very close to where people live
 
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dhjaksu

dhjaksu

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You Australians do understand how much aquarists outside your country value your native fish? I would love to just see a live Pseudomugil mellis, let alone have a chance at breeding. I spent years looking for duboulayi, only the ones I finally found had tb and I had to end the line. Stunning fish. I have M. utcheensis rainbows, and always have an ear out for talk of any other Australian (or PNG) bows or blue eyes available.

Mogurnda mogurnda and Chlamydogobius eremius are two other wishlist fish I will probably never see again. Rhadinocentrus? Someday.

Meanwhile, I console myself when I'm freezing in the long dark winter by remembering the Australian spider pics I've seen. My great great great grandfather escaped from prison prior to transportation to Australia, and hitched a ride on a ship bound for Newfoundland before he could be tracked down. I don't think they had weather websites back then.
both of those first rainbows are everywhere. pseudomugil mellis i havent seen bot there are signifer and tenellus.

purple spotted gudgeons are $19 each at the local aquarium shop. I personally like empire gudgeons and peacock gudgeons more.
Chlamydogobius eremius I am yet to encounter.

Rhadinocentrus I havent seen yet but could probably find
 

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