Flame Honey Gouramis

[Xebadir]

Gday,
New to the gourami scene, as when the other day i was looking for a dwarf or two to add to my tank, my friend the shop attendant pointed this mis-shipped guys out to me. It was love at first site(i had researched these guys, but had never found them available at my LFSs) and I bought two females and a male(this is correct by fin plumage). Now while at the shop they have been fed worms, and so are reluctant to take anything but live food(my platy who gave birth lost a few but i dont mind). How do i go about weaning them onto flakes etc?

Thanks

 

[Colisa lalia]

Keep feeding flake to the other fish in the tank. If they do not feed for a few days don't worry. If after a week they still haven't eaten try some frozen foods. If they still refuse frozen foods, then give them a little bit of live food to make sure they have something to eat. I doubt it will take more than a few hungry days to convince them to try flake.

 

[Xebadir]

Update: the male is now feeding happily on flakes, in fact with some gusto. The females are not as yet, but they are a little nervy, and one is concerning me, she seems rather rounded in her abdomen....Stats are : pH 7.0 GH 12.5 NH3 0 N03 15 N02 0 .

Edit: Sorry Sylvia caught me out on my chemistry symbols: morale: dont write posts at 1am

 

[sylvia]

Just to clarify - do you have your NO3 and NO2 the right way round? (the former is nitrAte, the latter is nitrIte). If so, your nitrItes are far too high and your tank's not fully cycled so do a big water change and then make shure to continue doing partial water changes with de-chlorinated water over the next few days to keep the nitrItes down.

The female may have an internal bacterial infection - this is very common in these fish. Bad water quality could also have made her susceptible to infection but I'd argue that it's far more likely to be the result of stress from being shipped and moved from tank to tank. She could also just be gravid or be a little constipated. Try feeding a few de-shelled and crushed peas. She porbably won't take them though - so try some daphnia as well.

If this were my fish and I suspected internal infection, I'd isolate her first of all. That'll prevent anything she has from spreading to the other two (which it can very easily do as these fish may be prone to disease since they have only just been added and have been quite stressed lately)

I can't see your fish though (obviously) so I have no clue what's wrong. It's never a good idea to treat with antibiotics (which is what you'd need to use for an internal bacterial infection) without actualy having a positive diagnosis... You say she's bloated and she's not eating - these are symptoms in line with an internal bacterial infection but they could also be attributed to other things. Does she also have 'pinecone-like' scales? Is she pale and lethargic? Are her eyes ok - no 'bulging'?

What about signs of red streaks/spots, white 'fluffy' patches, stringy or white poo? Does she 'gasp' at the surface? Any flashing against objects as if irritated by something in the water? Are there black, red or white edges to her fins (that shouldn't be there )? Does she have both ventral fins? If not, can you see if an infection (eg: patches of white fungus or bacteria) has set in ar the tip of the remaining fin?

If you can post a picture, that may help.

Just try to ensure the water's as clean as possible, check your temperature and pH are not fluctuating and try to keep the fish as stress-free as possible.

Good luck! I hope things turn out ok

 

[Xebadir]

OK from what you request: 1. Very difficult to get a picture, though i will try, she is a little nervy.
2. She does not sit on the bottom but is a little reclusive and shy.
3.Quite bloated behind the head, however no pineconing due to dropsy, nor popeye.
4. No sign of whitespots, fin damage, however does have very long stringy poo.
5. Her colouration seems naturally dull(most definitively a female), and behavious is quite submissive. However she does seem a little lethargic. No surface gasping, there is also no rubbing against objects as if to remove parasites. She has both ventral fins.

 

[Xebadir]

Internal Parasites she has, thanks for all your help people. Gonna treat it today.

 

[sylvia]

The problem with diagnosing her (if anything's even wrong) is that she's only been added to the tank recently - so the shy and skittish behaviour is to be expected anyway.

The stringy poo may be a sign of parasites but these are relatively rare and it may just be the result of her 'fasting'. The bloating could also be caused by this - but it could also be due to bacterial ifnections - bacterial infections are, by contrast, extremely common in dwarf gouramies.

Has she started to eat yet? Can you try feeding some daphnia? Once she eats, the poo should stop being so 'stringy' - if it still is, the problem is probably a parasite.

If it does improve, I'd start worrying about bacteria but first try to ensure it's not just a matter of her being female! You see, being a little 'plump behind the gill area' is actualy quite normal
Here are some typicaly 'plump' female dwarfs to compare with:
http/www.solodvds.com/images/gourami/ima...lisa_lalia3.jpg
http/www.fishforums.net/uploads/post-39-1088044143.jpg (found this on google but it's from this forum )
http/aquaworld.netfirms.com/Labyrinthfis...isa/clalia2.jpg

If she is still acting lethargic and not eating in a day or two and you're shure it's not just her natural shape, I'd realy reccomend isolating and treating with an anti-internal bacteria med. This would seem quite premature with other species but, particularly with a newly-added dwarf gourami, this kind of thing is almost always to blame.

Oh and, you didn't say what your water params. are after all - high ntirItes could be blamed for the lethargy...

 

[Xebadir]

Hmm well, she isnt just plump(though my other female is): she looks like she has a football inside of her, but no pineconing(1.5-2cm football), she will not take any sort of food, ive tryed everything, live or frozen on preped, passing stringy long poo. I have decided to hit with a med to see if it helps clear up(Waterlife Sterazin). Also noted that my LFS is pretty good: instead of just giving me the med gave me a spanish inquisition for symptoms(where i bought the fish from) and determined that rather to be safe then sorry, remove my active carbon, treat with this stuff for the suggested dosage, and see if that helps. There advice has always been really good before.

Edit: Read up, i corrected: 0 nitrites, 10ppm max Nitrates

 

[sylvia]

That's for parasites right? Your description with the 'football in her belly' is exactly what you see in fish with bacterial infections so, if this anti-parasite med. has no effect, start her on antibiotics.

 

[Xebadir]

Well its no issue: yesterday, second day of the treatment she had improved, she had started eating, and the bulge was smaller...then i came home after work(about 12 hours later) to a dead female, that had been attacked by the other fish.

 

[sylvia]

Aww That's too bad... but you know, she probably wasn't attacked - they likely nibbled on her afterwards. Either way, keep an eye on your other fish and good luck with everyone else.

 

[Xebadir]

Update: my second female i found dead. I also know the cuplrate. While the first was suffering a parasitic infection, and was beginning to improve: her death was still sudden. Then strangely 2 days later another death of a female. The culperate? My Male. I noticed he had been showing unusual colouration: blues with his normal pink/red....from his habits and actions: he has been harassing the females, to their untimely demise. However Ive grown very attached to the little guy(he nibbles on my hand when im doing maintenance and is very friendly). So looks like, until he goes off heat ill have to stay away from female gouramis(especially those that are not strong willed).

Thanks for your help sylvia.

 

[ajbettle]

i have one amle and 1 female in a small tank and they get on great, mine were fed on live foods as well but i just fed flake until they got hungry then they started to take it...my male doesnt go anywhere near the female sorry about your fish though you can get aggressive ones now and again like with guppys

 

[sylvia]

Just so you are aware, male gouramies never realy go 'off heat' - as soon as you add females, he'll act up again. Lowering the temperature can help but not realy by much. Note, also, that while the male probably did contribute to the deaths of the females by stressing them out, unless he actualy injured them, they will not have died as a direct result of his actions. Anyway, sorry that you lost this one but at least the male is healthy I hope he does well!