Fishless Cycle Diary-back From Hols :)

[ellena]

Right, just a quick update with today's readings (so far! It's been abusy day in my tank-lol!)
26.4.09 18hrs
50% water change
added 0.5ml NH3

6hrs later
pH-6.3
NH3-2ppm
NO2-5ppm
50% water change
NH3-0.5-1ppm
NO2-1ppm (I think, it could be 5-why are those 2 colours so similar?)
added 1 and a bit ml NH3
30mins later
pH-8.4
NH3-somewhere between 4 and 8ppm

Fingers crossed the next 24hrs will be more successful

 

[waterdrop]

Yeah, sorry not to have checked in but Minx had you covered. You just suffered a simple pH crash.

The fishless cycling process produces acids, more and more of them as the process goes on longer. They use up the "buffering" (the dissolved minerals that make water "harder" rather than "softer") and eventually cause the process to "stall" (at about 6.2 pH) and completely stop (at about 6.0 pH) and this is why we do pH tests as one of our battery of daily tests, along with ammonia and nitrite(NO2).

You look to be back in good shape now as a pH of 8.0 to 8.4 is quite optimal for bacterial growth and you'll know to just give it a water change as Minx has outlined if you see it threatening to crash again. The bacteria seem to come through these little setbacks just fine and will take off again basically from where they were prior to the pH crash.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[ellena]

Yay! Thanks for the help guys
Back on track I think

27.4.09 25hrs
NH3-1ppm
NO2-0ppm! Could this possibly mean I have the second type of bacteria?
pH-7.4
added just under 1ml NH3. Will test NH3 and pH again once it's had chance to mix up

 

[fatheadminnow]

Yay! Thanks for the help guys
Back on track I think

27.4.09 25hrs
NH3-1ppm
NO2-0ppm! Could this possibly mean I have the second type of bacteria?
pH-7.4
added just under 1ml NH3. Will test NH3 and pH again once it's had chance to mix up

Yes, when your NitrIte goes up, and then back down, you have the second type of bacteria which is processing NitrIte to NitrAte.

Are you getting a NitrAte reading, if so, what is it at?

-FHM

 

[ellena]

Hi FHM. I just thought of that myself and went to a test.
NO3-20ppm
Had a small near disaster in the process though so have done about 60% water change so will recheck NH3 and redose as necessary.

 

[minxfishy]

Glad things seem to going in the right direction again, just out of interest and also to help you know how much nitrAte is being produced, have you tested your tap water nitrAte level? It can range for 0 - 40ppm in some cases. It helps to know just as a reference point

 

[ellena]

Glad things seem to going in the right direction again, just out of interest and also to help you know how much nitrAte is being produced, have you tested your tap water nitrAte level? It can range for 0 - 40ppm in some cases. It helps to know just as a reference point

Yes I did check it when I first started. It was 10ppm

 

[fatheadminnow]

Well hopefully you got the minor problem sorted out.

Yes, I would say you are nearing the half way mark of the cycle, as you are now starting to colonize the second type of beneficial bacteria.

-FHM

 

[ellena]

Right pH at 8.5 and NH3 at 4-8ppm.
Roll on tomorrow's test
Half way mark you think! Cool! I'm going on holiday in 4 weeks, so I really hope I have fish by then as I can't think anyone would want to be running a fishless cycle for me!

 

[ellena]

28.4.09 21.5 hrs
NH3-0ppm
NO2-0ppm
NO3-10-20ppm
pH-7.3
added 1.3ml NH3 and did 50% water change
NH3-4-8ppm
pH-8.5
I'm thinking I need to go more regular checks now? 12 hr ones, so morning and evening. Come on little bacteria!
Once I get the fish in, the pH won't be the 8ish that the bacteria like will it? So do they just feed in a normal tank but multipy in the fishless cycle 'ideal' conditions we give them?

 

[minxfishy]

Looking good, unless the ph drops again, no need for more w/c until the final 90%+ on the day you get fish. You should start the 12 hours checks, although you only add ammonia once every 24hrs still

Once the cycle is finish the ph should stablise itself to relatively close to your tap ph, depending on substrates, wood etc which can move it a little.

 

[ellena]

OK, slightly confused now When it gets to the point where NH3 is going from 5ppm to 0ppm in 12 hrs, I leave it for the next 12 hrs with no NH3?

 

[fatheadminnow]

OK, slightly confused now When it gets to the point where NH3 is going from 5ppm to 0ppm in 12 hrs, I leave it for the next 12 hrs with no NH3?

Yes.

You add ammonia up to 5ppm, check 12 hours later, (this should be when it goes to zero), then 12 hours later, (24 hours total), you add the ammonia back up to 5 ppm.

Look like everything is going good, and like stated above, no need for a water change until the end.

-FHM

 

[ellena]

Right! Good job minx mentioned it-that point had passed me by completely and I thought I'd read that topic so carefully

 

[waterdrop]

Once I get the fish in, the pH won't be the 8ish that the bacteria like will it? So do they just feed in a normal tank but multipy in the fishless cycle 'ideal' conditions we give them?

Unless conditions are extreme, these bacteria basically "exist to multiply" Its just that there are scientists out there who measure how fast they multiply under varying conditions. They take one condition and vary it and measure bacterial growth rate across many different values of that parameter.

With our two types (Nitrosomonas and Nitrospira) when they vary pH, they find that 8.0 to 8.4 helps them multiply fastest. As you move away from that, say to pH=7 or pH=8.8, the bacteria will still multiply pretty fast, just not as fast as 8.0 to 8.4 pH. When the scientists vary temperature, they find that something around 29C or 84F might encourage the fastest growth, without encouraging other species that we don't want to also grow, so that temperature is then suggested as optimal. It doesn't mean there won't be good division and grown in the filter when the tank is down at 78F or whatever your normal fish temp turns out to be, just that bacterial division might be a bit slower.

~~waterdrop~~