Fish In Cycling

[Bigd5482]

Well as some of you may know from my previous post was given a tank with fish from someone who didn't really test the water and such. So obviously having to do a new cycle since the tank was moved and its with fish in already. Thats the short version so on to the question.

So currently doing 2 30% water changes a day checking levels and hour or 2 after each change. So at this point the ammonia is still sitting between 1.0 and 2.0 but nitrite started at 1.0 and now has been either .50 or .25 after the changes. I've cut back on feedings only feeding once a day to cut back on ammonia. Is there anything else that I can be doing to help the tank and are the readings for the ammonia normal after the changes? Granted only been doing the fish in cycle for 5 days and the 2 water changes a day for 3 of those days.

 

[snowflake311]

Keep the nitrites and ammonia at .50 try not to let it get to 1.0 . Sounds like your doing fine to me. You could add plants to help take out ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. I would add plant is I were you. When I did a fish cycle I cut back on food only once every other day and if I had a spike I would hold off food for 3 days.

Keep doing what you are doing. You will get throw it. Just 2 more weeks now if you see the nitrites.

 

[Bigd5482]

Keep the nitrites and ammonia at .50 try not to let it get to 1.0 . Sounds like your doing fine to me. You could add plants to help take out ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. I would add plant is I were you. When I did a fish cycle I cut back on food only once every other day and if I had a spike I would hold off food for 3 days.

Keep doing what you are doing. You will get throw it. Just 2 more weeks now if you see the nitrites.

That's the one thing that is boggling me I got 5 plants in the tank already so I thought I should be seeing smaller ammonia levels but still no. So guess will just keep doing the changes and doing my best to keep the levels down. So far knock on wood haven't lost any fish and they seem to be holding their own strugglin through it.

 

[kbekll]

plants really only affect the nitrate (use this to feed on) they can be damaged from ammonia

but you seem to be doing ok tho

 

[greenscooby]

I'd be doing larger water changes and more often, do a change every time your ammonia is above 0.25, i got caught with a fish in cycle and was doing 3 x 50% water changes a day, good luck my friend, it's gonna be hard work but so rewarding.

 

[waterdrop]

Yes, greenscooby is right: Your initial water changes are too delicate. Often it takes several very large water changes to get down close to zero and then it will be easier to maintain your max under 0.25ppm.

The concept of "percentage" water changes is meant to guard against temperature/hardness/pH shocks during water changes. But with poison levels above 0.25ppm, there's little point to these minor measures. Its kind of like offering a person a blanket to keep warm "while we think about how to get you out of this garage filled with carbon monoxide!" The fish need to be allowed to breathe so to speak.

Ammonia, even in small amounts, causes permanent gill damage. Nitrite(NO2), even in small amounts, causes permanent nerve damage, due to suffocation. In both cases, prolonged exposure leads to shortened fish lives or death.

So your goal is to figure out what percentage and frequency of water changes will allow you to get back to your house for the next water change without the ammonia or nitrite going over 0.25ppm, and hopefully with the water change making it look like zero or a slight trace. Its a complication if you have ammonia in your tap water. Also of course, be sure to use conditioner, possibly at 1.5x or 2x instructed dose and be sure to roughly temperature match with your hand.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Bigd5482]

Yes, greenscooby is right: Your initial water changes are too delicate. Often it takes several very large water changes to get down close to zero and then it will be easier to maintain your max under 0.25ppm.

The concept of "percentage" water changes is meant to guard against temperature/hardness/pH shocks during water changes. But with poison levels above 0.25ppm, there's little point to these minor measures. Its kind of like offering a person a blanket to keep warm "while we think about how to get you out of this garage filled with carbon monoxide!" The fish need to be allowed to breathe so to speak.

Ammonia, even in small amounts, causes permanent gill damage. Nitrite(NO2), even in small amounts, causes permanent nerve damage, due to suffocation. In both cases, prolonged exposure leads to shortened fish lives or death.

So your goal is to figure out what percentage and frequency of water changes will allow you to get back to your house for the next water change without the ammonia or nitrite going over 0.25ppm, and hopefully with the water change making it look like zero or a slight trace. Its a complication if you have ammonia in your tap water. Also of course, be sure to use conditioner, possibly at 1.5x or 2x instructed dose and be sure to roughly temperature match with your hand.

~~waterdrop~~

Ok so I checked tap water and no ammonia in it. Now the thing that is odd before I did the water change I checked levels, Nitrite .25 ammonia .50 and I did a 35% change checked the levels an hour and half after and nitrite still .25 but ammonia was back up to 1.0 probably actually between 1.0 and 2.0. Should I stll be doing the 2 or 3 water changes a day?

Yes, greenscooby is right: Your initial water changes are too delicate. Often it takes several very large water changes to get down close to zero and then it will be easier to maintain your max under 0.25ppm.

The concept of "percentage" water changes is meant to guard against temperature/hardness/pH shocks during water changes. But with poison levels above 0.25ppm, there's little point to these minor measures. Its kind of like offering a person a blanket to keep warm "while we think about how to get you out of this garage filled with carbon monoxide!" The fish need to be allowed to breathe so to speak.

Ammonia, even in small amounts, causes permanent gill damage. Nitrite(NO2), even in small amounts, causes permanent nerve damage, due to suffocation. In both cases, prolonged exposure leads to shortened fish lives or death.

So your goal is to figure out what percentage and frequency of water changes will allow you to get back to your house for the next water change without the ammonia or nitrite going over 0.25ppm, and hopefully with the water change making it look like zero or a slight trace. Its a complication if you have ammonia in your tap water. Also of course, be sure to use conditioner, possibly at 1.5x or 2x instructed dose and be sure to roughly temperature match with your hand.

~~waterdrop~~

Ok so I checked tap water and no ammonia in it. Now the thing that is odd before I did the water change I checked levels, Nitrite .25 ammonia .50 and I did a 35% change checked the levels an hour and half after and nitrite still .25 but ammonia was back up to 1.0 probably actually between 1.0 and 2.0. Should I stll be doing the 2 or 3 water changes a day?

Oh and I'm using Nutrafin Aqua Plus to condition water before adding to tank calls for 5ml for 10gal I\\\'m using maybe 3ml for the 5 gal buckets should I increase this maybe?

 

[Bigd5482]

/bump

Still curious as to why 2 hours after a water change the ammonia levels shoot up to 1.0 or over but before I did it was at .50 and this morning I just checked them again and its back down between .25 and .50. Not sure if I should still be doing all the water changes or if I need to add more conditioner or something else.

 

[Truck]

plants really only affect the nitrate (use this to feed on) they can be damaged from ammonia

but you seem to be doing ok tho

sorry but thats rubbish, plants can use the nitrogen in ammonia as food too, it doesnt damage them

 

[Tolak]

If you are using municipally supplied water it more than likely has chloramine as well as chlorine. Chloramine is a more stable product, a combination of chlorine & ammonia. Many water conditioners split chloramine into its components without dealing with the ammonia part, it seems the conditioner you are using is one of those. While this is often not a problem with smaller water changes in a mature tank, it can be a problem with larger water changes in a cycled tank.

Tetra Aqua Plus or Seachem Prime are two widely available products that will take care of ammonia, by converting it to ammonium. Ammonium is not harmful to fish in levels found in an aquarium, but used the same as ammonia by your bio filtration. You might want to look into one of these products. Be aware that many test kits see ammonium as ammonia, you would need a two reagent ammonia test, a salicylate ammonia test, to discriminate ammonia from ammonium.

This quite possibly is giving you the results you are seeing after the water changes.

But with poison levels above 0.25ppm, there's little point to these minor measures. Its kind of like offering a person a blanket to keep warm "while we think about how to get you out of this garage filled with carbon monoxide!" The fish need to be allowed to breathe so to speak.
~~waterdrop~~

I really like that, very true.

 

[Bigd5482]

Ah that could make sense. I will go out and pick up some tetra aqua plus today. You said with a 2 part test I'm using API freshwater master kit so the the ammonia test has 2 bottles you need to put in to test is this the "2 part" test you're talking about?

 

[Tolak]

http/www.nfkc.info/nfkconliine/Discussio...n%20ammonia.htm

These are the brands that read free ammonia.

 

[Geoff1991]

Like quite a few people... I did a fish-in cycle. Mines just finished actually. Best thing you can do is get into a routine. I used to test the water morning afternoon and evening a perform a water change of around 50% if the ammonia or nitrite was anything but 0. It works ok but i got some mature filter media and that worked better as it was done quicker.

Edited mistakes... im tired, just finished work