Fish-in Cycle Question

[mancin]

I'm 23 days into my fish-in cycle. I began getting nitrite readings last week every other day (of 0.25) so I was doing water changes in order to keep the fish safe. Today when I took a sample, the ammonia is at 0.25 and nitrites are between 0 and 0.25, but nitrates are still at 0. I know it takes time, but I just figured I would have seen something for nitrates by now? I have been using a liquid API Test Kit.

Am I being too impatient?

 

[rdd1952]

Once you see nitrite, it will generally take a week or 2 before it begins to process. What size is the tank, what and how many fish do you have and do you have live plants?

 

[mancin]

Once you see nitrite, it will generally take a week or 2 before it begins to process. What size is the tank, what and how many fish do you have and do you have live plants?

Oops sorry. I didn't include that info originally. It's a 29 Gallon tank. Currently have 10 fish (6 tiger barbs, 2 platys, 2 tin foils). No live plants. Also, pH is about 7.5.

My bf thinks I'm changing the water too frequently and that's stalling the process. From everything I've read, I need to keep ammonia and nitrite below 0.25, and I have never seen it above that because I have been testing the water daily, if not twice a day, and changing the water when I see any reading but 0. I tried to explain the bacteria is growing in the filter, not the water!

 

[tom_os]

Once you see nitrite, it will generally take a week or 2 before it begins to process. What size is the tank, what and how many fish do you have and do you have live plants?

Oops sorry. I didn't include that info originally. It's a 29 Gallon tank. Currently have 10 fish (6 tiger barbs, 2 platys, 2 tin foils). No live plants. Also, pH is about 7.5.

My bf thinks I'm changing the water too frequently and that's stalling the process. From everything I've read, I need to keep ammonia and nitrite below 0.25, and I have never seen it above that because I have been testing the water daily, if not twice a day, and changing the water when I see any reading but 0. I tried to explain the bacteria is growing in the filter, not the water!

i have the same problem! my mum thinks when i do a water change i take the bacteria out. im 21 days into my fish in cycle and have readings of ammonia and nitrAte but none of nitrIte. i have asked countless questions but i still dont really understand it all

 

[rdd1952]

There isn't any bacteria in the water. As mentioned it is mainly in the filter but also small amounts on the decor and tank walls. You really can't change water too much or often to harm the cycling process unless you are keeping the ammonia and nitrite to 0. Even then, the tank is still cycling slowly as there is always some ammonia and nitrite in the tank. It's just not measurable with our test kits.

As for why you have ammonia and nitrate but no nitrite, it's possible (but not likely) that there are enough nitrite processing bacteria to take care of the nitrite as it's produced. Is the nitrate level rising or staying steady? Have you tested the tap water to see if the nitrate is coming from there instead of from the cycling process?

 

[mancin]

You really can't change water too much or often to harm the cycling process unless you are keeping the ammonia and nitrite to 0.

I guess this is where I get confused. Anytime I see a reading for ammonia or nitrItes that is something other than 0, I have been doing a water change to get it back to 0. I thought that's what I had read to do in Miss Wiggle's post about fish-in cycling because both are toxic to the fish above 0.25 (well I guess any level is toxic, but most toxic above that?)

As for why you have ammonia and nitrate but no nitrite, it's possible (but not likely) that there are enough nitrite processing bacteria to take care of the nitrite as it's produced. Is the nitrate level rising or staying steady? Have you tested the tap water to see if the nitrate is coming from there instead of from the cycling process?

Not sure if this was in response to tom_os, but I'm getting nitrItes, but no nitrAtes yet.

 

[tom_os]

sorry, if you are talking about me rdd1952. my nitrate reading is the same as my tap water.

 

[waterdrop]

I would just like to second what RDD is saying to both of you.

Mancin, you have heard and retained the correct advice: The most important aspect of a fish-in cycle is to water change in a pattern of percentages and frequencies that gets your ammonia and nitrite(NO2) levels as close to zero as possible, hopefully with the high end not going above 0.25ppm. You are definately doing it right!

Tap water is your friend. There's nothing wonderful to be saved with tank water. If there are any free-floating beneficial bacteria, they are inconsequential and completely unimportant to your cycle. The actively dividing significant populations of the bacteria you want exist in the complex biofilms they build up inside the filter where fresh oxygenated water and food in the form of ammonia come constantly flowing to them. Fresh tap water even brings calcium and other trace things that the bacteria will use in their cell and biofilm development.

There is still plenty of ammonia flowing through the filter of a fish-in cycling tank despite our test kits reading zero. That is why those of us with tanks that were cycled long ago can get readings of zero whenever we test and yet we have healthy mature bacterial colonies that constantly support our fish stocking! There is a constant small flow of ammonia and that's exactly what the bacteria need.

Now that's not to say that fish-in cycling is necessarily going to happen fast. Its by definition not as ideal as when you do a fishless cycle because the "soup" (the tank water) has to be optimized for the fish, not the bacteria. When we fishless cycle, we can crank up the temperature, we can dose the ammonia higher, we can throw in baking soda to get the pH up high where the bacteria like it and things like that. When we fish-in cycle we can't do anything anywhere close to that or we'll harm the fish. We have to have a fish temperature, a fish ammonia level (zero on the test kit), a fish pH (whatever pH our tap water is usually.) That's all ok, because that's the only choice we're given with fish-in cycling. But in the end, time is on our side because the bacteria will just slowly but surely do their thing and will eventually build up strong colonies. We just have to be hard workers changing our water, defending our actions against well-meaning relatives and most of all begin patient!

Also, always remember that there are many, many variables in every tank situation and this is definately not a chemistry experiment. Everyone will see different patterns of nitrite and nitrate and different timings on how it changes. The important thing is to just keep going with the water changes and not to worry too much about why one might not see nitrates at a given time. Nitrate readings are simply not that important. Being close to zero on ammonia and nitrite(NO2) is always important.

You'll know you've probably reached your goal when you can go two days, testing twice a day, and get zero ammonia and nitrite(NO2) without doing any water changes. Once you get that you can breathe a huge sigh of relief, but most people certainly continue to watch it closely for the next week or so before easing off on their testing rate.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[mancin]

Sounds good! I'll continue as is then. So far it seems to be going pretty well. Just wanted to make sure I was on the right track!

 

[OldMan47]

I would say that you are definitely on the right track Mancin. Just keep the water clean and the fish will do fine. The cycle will happen and it doesn't matter how clean you keep the water, it will take about the same time.

 

[mancin]

Well, lost another Tiger Barb (lost the first one a couple weeks ago). I didn't see any problems up until I couldn't find him this morning (I do a "head count" when I come home on lunch to take care of my dogs -- the tank lights aren't on yet when I go to work). It took me several minutes to find him because he was laying flat against the gravel. He was still alive, so I put him into the breeder tank in hopes that he would recover, but alas he was dead when I got home. He was quite pale and appeared to have been nipped at previously.

Took water stats and both ammonia and nitrites were up to 0.25, so did a water change. Will test levels again in a couple hours. I'm doing about 40% water changes every other day (that seems to be the pattern of the spiking at least). It's definitely a lot of work!!! Never will I ever fish-in cycle again, it's so sad. And never will I ever cycle WITH Tiger Barbs!! That's all I've lost so far. *knock on wood*

 

[kbod]

hi i had the same readings as you for ages and was doing twice daily water changes of between 30- 50 % ,

infact it wasnt until about day 28 that i finally noticed the nitrates on my api test kit and my tanks 64 litres ,

so guess it does take some tanks longer , however the past few days have seen a great leap from 5. nitrates to 20. so its moving in the right direction ,

so looks like yours is following the same path as a few of ours ,i lost a tetra on week 2 and another on week 3 but seems settled now hopefully yours will soon start kicking in with

the nitrates ,

kaz x

 

[Elquan]

I'm 23 days into my fish-in cycle. I began getting nitrite readings last week every other day (of 0.25) so I was doing water changes in order to keep the fish safe. Today when I took a sample, the ammonia is at 0.25 and nitrites are between 0 and 0.25, but nitrates are still at 0. I know it takes time, but I just figured I would have seen something for nitrates by now? I have been using a liquid API Test Kit.

Am I being too impatient?

hello the liquid test kits are the best. you are doing good just leave the tank alone and let it go threw its cycle.

I'm 23 days into my fish-in cycle. I began getting nitrite readings last week every other day (of 0.25) so I was doing water changes in order to keep the fish safe. Today when I took a sample, the ammonia is at 0.25 and nitrites are between 0 and 0.25, but nitrates are still at 0. I know it takes time, but I just figured I would have seen something for nitrates by now? I have been using a liquid API Test Kit.

Am I being too impatient?

Hello just be patient the tank has to cycle, excellent choice in test kit the liquid test kit is the best way.

 

[Colin_T]

Hi Elquan

don't get too excited about this thread, it's from 2009