Fert Newbie Here, Help Please :)

[greenmumma141]

Hello. I am upgrading my tank from a 30 G vertical, to a 60 G long

lol and I am going to do some heavy planting, and i have come to realize that I will probably have to use some sort of fertilizer. I really don't want to spend the time and money on the plants for it to not be successful. I will only be doing easy/basic planting. (java ferns, swords, anubias, moss, etc.) I have never used ferts before, and Ive tried doing some research before asking for help but I'm still pretty lost lol if anyone can give me some pointers or advice before I get started so I know what I'm looking at, I would really appreciate it. Maybe just a very basic/beginner's guide to fertilizing would be wonderful. Keep in mind that I have only had my tank up for a year, so while I have learned a lot, I still have a way to go lol Thanks!!

 

[msasa19]

i will be following this thread as i am in the same situation!

 

[KrystaK]

Congrats on the upgrade!

If you are only planning on planting the easier, more hardy plants, fertilizing is pretty easy. I'm not sure I understand what your asking for, so I'll just sort of throw out a bunch of general info that you probably already know at you

.
I am by no means an expert on aquatic plants, but the plants I grow in my tank are all doing very well.

It is not just fertilizing you have to consider, but your entire setup;
Substrate? Will you have a base layer of gravel for the plants to root in easily and then a top layer of sand which (Depending on how fine it is) can be difficult for plants to root in, or will you just have a single layer substrate?

Light source? Your light source needs to also be considered, plants need a full spectrum that mimics natural sunlight. You can buy these bulbs at the pet store. You must consider how long you leave the lights on for, not long enough and your plants will die, but for too long and you will develop an algae problem.

Supplements and Fertilizing? Some tanks don't need fertilizing, as there is enough waste generated by the fish in the tank to take care of the plants needs, but generally it is recommended to use a supplement, as that will add any nutrients that your fish do not produce but that your plants may need. (As fish don't produce iron or sulfur, yet plants need it to be healthy.)
Plants need different elements in different amounts. For example plants need a good amount of nitrogen to grow properly, much of which can come from the fish in the aquarium. while with something like iron, plants need only a little of it, and too much of it can be harmful to fish - and people.

Generally, for tank fertilizers there are two types, substrate additives such as Seachem flourish tabs, or liquid fertilizer such as Seachem Flourish liquid. Both have their pro's.
The tabs help limit algae growth as they provide nutrients directly to the roots of plants (And algae doesn't have roots so it won't get as many nutrients) - tabs can also add more nitrogen or other important nutrients to the water.
The liquid will help support floating plants, which don't root, but actually floats on the surface. Many plats absorb nutrients through their leaves as well as their roots.

Assuming you're asking about the process of fertilizing and what it actually does to your tank; (Like the chemical process of nitrogen absorbtion) than I can't help, my own knowledge is only rather basic at best, but as I stated earlier, it's enough that my plants are thriving. I could go a little more in depth but I'm not actually sure that any information I have beyond this stuff is correct.

As far as a fertilizer or supplement for the plants you mentioned, Java fern, Annubis, Moss, Swords etc... either a substrate tab or a liquid fertilizer would do well. And depending on the stock you plan on having one may be better than the other. If you plan on fully stocking your tank than the fish will should produce enough nitrogen that you don't need a tab to provide said nutrient, and a liquid may be better, but then you would have to worry about algae growth- every hobbyists nightmare. It's really a tossup of what you feel is best - and you can always switch between the two. I use a liquid supplement weekly on my tanks, but I have been thinking of switching to a tab to help with my algae problem (As I don't have a timer on my tank to turn the lights on and off at a set time).

Oh, and don't even get me started on CO2! (But it's just as important as light for your plants) Light's and CO2 are actually more important than fertilizer for plants though.

Sorry if it's not quite what you were looking for

 

[Ps3Steveo]

Ferts, CO2, light and flow are most important, you want to look for around 10 x full tank turnover per hour flow wise, filter/power head etc. If your lighting is low enough those plants and ferts containing basic trace elements will be fine, ferts and CO2 needs depend on light. If you have 40-90 watts of light then the flow and ferts will be ok, if you start edging toward 120 watts or above you need to inject CO2 and full ferts containing nitrates and phosphates. Check out your lighting to see how it affects your set up.

Substrate wise for your set up, anything will do from sand to full nutrient rich as your not using any hi maintenance carpet plants.

Make sure you have some hard scape in there for the Microsorum and Anubias to attach to as they are not good to plant in substrate.

Hope that helps.

Steve.

 

[greenmumma141]

This was extremely helpful. For substrate, I am going to use playsand, as my tank is going to be a cory paradise

I did not want to have a gravel layer underneath, I think having the two layers showing against the glass would really bother me lol. My stocking list:

These are musts b.c i have them in my tank now and I will be breaking down the smaller tank once the new one is up and going:

7 barbs (4 tigers, 3 green)
1 bull nose pleco
1 angel (going to add 1 more)
1 pictus

I have various numbers of cories but I will be stocking up the numbers, so for the new tank i will have:
6 green
6 false juliis
and my 3 pandas and 3 sterbais.

I also have 1 sailfin spotted pleco that i got from a LFS that gave me the wrong info ( 5 inches max, yea right) and now he is almost 4 and growing fast. Im not sure what to do about him, but that's a thread in itself for later lol

I always seem to have a lot of fish poop in my tank, i do vacuum and keep my tank clean, but none the less it is being produced, fast! so that is something to consider when talking about ferts. Also, the area i live has hard water, lots of iron, so that's another thing. my PH is always around 7.8, so Im not sure what that does as far as ferts go. I like the sound of the tablet ferts, but i have a lot of driftwood going in the new tank and i will have a lot of plants glued,tied,etc on wood and rocks and such, so the tabs won't do anything for these?

Haven't figured out the lights yet but once i have the tank Im sure my awesome LFS guy will help with that, I do tend to leave my lights on for longer than most I think. I just like to see my fish lol but Im hoping of maybe finding a cheaper night time light solution for the new tank, any ideas? Algae seems to already be a small problem in my 30 G tank. I think it is scrub brush? and also darker green algae in the back just where my bubbler strip is.

I have no clue about CO2, what to do with it, etc. no clue at all. Im a little scared haha

Also, I have one filter now that i plan on using. It's an AquaClear 70. (up to 70 gallon) 300 gph. Im hoping this is enough for the new tank (60 gallon long) Am i going to need a another filter? I have old media (sponge, and ceramics as well) for cycling. and my single strip bubbler. Any suggestions are well appreciated!!

Thank you KrystaK, that was a lot of great info, it might have raised a couple more ?'s lol but it still helps a lot!! I want to get a good clear idea of what I will need before I get everything up and running. I was very excited about the new tank, still am, but now that it's in the foreseeable future, Im getting a wee bit nervous lol

Ferts, CO2, light and flow are most important, you want to look for around 10 x full tank turnover per hour flow wise, filter/power head etc. If your lighting is low enough those plants and ferts containing basic trace elements will be fine, ferts and CO2 needs depend on light. If you have 40-90 watts of light then the flow and ferts will be ok, if you start edging toward 120 watts or above you need to inject CO2 and full ferts containing nitrates and phosphates. Check out your lighting to see how it affects your set up.

Substrate wise for your set up, anything will do from sand to full nutrient rich as your not using any hi maintenance carpet plants.

Make sure you have some hard scape in there for the Microsorum and Anubias to attach to as they are not good to plant in substrate.

Hope that helps.

Steve.

That just answered a lot of my questions, thank you Steve!

So i am def going to need either a much bigger filter, or another to make up the difference? I only have 300gph but Im going to need 600gph. Do powerheads help with this, or should I still to just my filters. I'm very happy with the filter i have now, i have it on a good medium-high and it gives a good amount of current to my tank, there's a lot of oxygen bubbles all the time in there. Never dealt with powerheads so not really sure what they're beneficial for.

So if i stay near 40-90 watts I only need the basic ferts... can i still leave my lights on for most of the day? and how often would i have to add ferts? and should i do the liquid or tabs? geeze lol

 

[Ps3Steveo]

You can still use gravel under the sand, it will help rooting and you don't have to put it against the front glass, could slope it down and fill the front with just sand if not planting against the front glass.

A power head would help so long as you set it up to compliment the flow from the filter.

As for oxygen bubbles, if they are from surface movement then move the outlet a little as in planted tanks you want a slight surface ripple, other wise any dissolved CO2 in the water will gas off.

Fert wise you could do weekly or daily, if going for 40 ish watts then weekly liquid but if going 90 watts I'd dose daily liquid ferts.

 

[greenmumma141]

You can still use gravel under the sand, it will help rooting and you don't have to put it against the front glass, could slope it down and fill the front with just sand if not planting against the front glass.

A power head would help so long as you set it up to compliment the flow from the filter.

As for oxygen bubbles, if they are from surface movement then move the outlet a little as in planted tanks you want a slight surface ripple, other wise any dissolved CO2 in the water will gas off.

Fert wise you could do weekly or daily, if going for 40 ish watts then weekly liquid but if going 90 watts I'd dose daily liquid ferts.

Okay great. This sounds like something I can manage lol. This may be silly, but Ive read that to use liquid ferts, people use a syringe, and I live in New York where you can't buy a syringe, or even order one. (yes I know this is ridiculous, don't get me started) so is there another way, like a baby medicine dropper, turkey baster, etc? Thanks Steve

Also, what are a couple every day tools for plant care that I should pick up? Thanks everyone, this has been a big help. I'm going to start a thread when I put up the tank and do step by step pics too

 

[Ps3Steveo]

We dont use syringes as such, they are medicine syringes so dont have a needle.

I'd grab some long curved scissors & long tweezers, that should do ya.

When you show us what your up to do a journal for it in planted aquarium journals section.

 

[greenmumma141]

Will do, and thanks again for all the help

 

[snazy]

You can still use gravel under the sand

I wouldn't. The gravel will eventually all go on top of the sand and it will be just a big messy mix. Gravel is no better than sand for rooting and most plants prefer smaller grain substrate to root properly, unlike most types of common gravel available. You can go with a soil base, capped with sand maybe? Easy plants will grow in sand no problem too. If there isn't too much light, you can just start with some micro ferts to the amount recommended on the bottle, spreading the dose daily if possible or a few times a week rather than once at one go,some root tabs for the swords/rooted type plants too because new substrate doesn't contain anything. See how it goes from there, if no issues/algae, you are good to go but a new tank will suffer it's algae stages regardless.

 

[Ps3Steveo]

That depends on how thick your sand cap is and a lot of people use something under the sand just fine but the choice is yours, its not needed but some plants can pull out of sand easier when they get caught in the scissors when trimming.

 

[greenmumma141]

I have some really small pebbles from the hardware store that i might throw in the bottom, Im going to have a pretty thick layer of sound, as Im going for a natural look, I want some hills and stuff lol

 

[Ps3Steveo]

Well the smaller grain size under the sand the better.

 

[greenmumma141]

Well the smaller grain size under the sand the better.

Sorry to seem like such a noob here lol

but I was having a look at the ferts that are available locally for me, and I found Seachem flourish "comprehensive" and a seachem carbon, not too sure which route I should go with. Without using CO2, should i go for the carbon? they also have an API leaf zone (sounds cheesy to me) and an Aqueon plant food. If these aren't too great, I could also go with something from Amazon.com, but I would rather get it locally.

 

[Ps3Steveo]

Flourish is fine, leave the carbon as it will mean dosing more ferts containing NPK.