Cycling A New Tank With Mature Media

[aaronc]

Howdy All
 
I have a new tank after a few years away from the hobby and have some quick questions re cycling.
 
I think I already know the answers to most of my questions, but would just like some opinions from those that have done this already.
 
I have a friend with a large tank who has offered to let me stick some of my new Juwel media in their filter to mature, with that in mind here are the no doubt many times repeated questions
 
- How much media (for a Juwel Rio 125) would you all suggest I stick in the mature tank? (I don't want to be greedy and cause a mini cycle by taking away a large chunk of their filter bacteria on my media)
- How long should I leave it in there before transferring to my own tank (time is on my side here as I don't intend to set the tank up for 2 months yet)?
- Once I have heated the water, dechlorinated and added the mature media - do I fishless cycle as normal (4ppm ammonia) or can I get away with a lower dose.  My thought being, the bacteria in the media may not be used to such high ammonia concentrations and I could actually kill them?
- I am little worried about low PH, we have pretty soft water and my previous fishless cycle a few years ago was forever stalling, requiring large water changes to resume, is it worth buffering the water with crushed coral, or just do a PWC if PH gets crashingly low.
- Where can I get pure ammonia from, Boots still the best bet?
 
Thanks in advance all
 
Aaron
 

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Firstly, you an also get bacteria without that much work if he would give you some substrate, rocks, wood or plants from his tank (or any combo thereof). In the end, as many as prefer living in your filter as the other places will end up there. It would have now different impact on your friends tank that putting your media in his filter.
 
Next, you do not need to dose to 4 ppm and you do not need to dose daily. Anything from 1-3 will work and I would suggest 2-3 is just fine. Once you dose the initial amount to whatever level you chose, be sure to remember how much it took to get there. Then wait a couple of days and test for both ammonia and nitrite.
 
Hopefully what you will see is ammonia down and nitrite there. This means the ammonia bacteria from seeding have started to work and multiply and the ones for nitrite are working to catch up. (How well is a function of how much seed bacteria you have to start). If ammonia is down and nitrites are there, then you can redose 1/2 the amount of the first dose. If not, then wait and do not dose more ammonia. Test every day or two until you do see ammonia down and nitrites there. Then add that 1/2 dose. Wait a couple of days and test again.
 
You are now looking to see ammonia near or at 0. Nitrite can be anything from still topping out to declining and if they are at 0 with ammonia there as well, you are cycled. And then you should do the confirmation test described below
 
If you have 0 ammonia but still are showing nitrites, then dose 1/4 the initial ammonia dose, add it every 3 until nitrites hit 0 (ammonia should also be 0). At this time you are ready to do the confirmation test:
 
-Calculate the ammonia dose to be at 2 ppm (calculate this based on the level of your first dose if. It was to 2 ppm then use that amount. If you started at 3 ppm use 2/3 the staring amount). If your initial dose was only 1 ppm, then use that amount for the confirmation test.
 
-Dose the ammonia for the test, wait 24 hours and test for both ammonia and nitrite.
 
If you are cycled you should get 0 for both nitrite and ammonia. If not, wait until both numbers do reach 0 and repeat the test.
 
Bear in mind the ammonia test kit is most likely to show a small ammonia level that may not be there than the nitrite test is to do the same. If you don't see any nitrite but do see .25 ppm or so of ammonia, that test is likely giving you a false positive which can be ignored
 
Remember, the timing on your cycle will depend on a few things.
 
First, how much bacteria you start with. Next are your water parameters. The more ideal each of the parameters is, the better:
 
-The cycle will go fastest at a temp in the 80sF (28-29C).
-The bacteria need carbonates (inorganic carbon source) in the water which means some KH/ GH. If the KH level is too low, it slows/ halts the cycle. In fishless cycles baking soda in small amount scan add carbonates.However be sure to do the big pre stocking water change to remove the sodium ions.
-It will go fastest at a pH of 8.2 or so and if a tank slips under 7.0 it can drastically slow it down. Much lower than 6.5 and it can take a very long time.
-Rapid drops to lower pH levels or trying to seed "normal" bacteria into acid waters usually wont work.
-The bacteria need to thrive is oxygen. Any filter that roils the surface works.
-The bacteria do not like light. So you can keep your tank light off during a fishless cycle unless you are also doing it with live plants.
 
In most cases one can tune a tanks parameters to optimize the cycle and then change them to suit the fish at the end. Whether you do this or not, at the end of a fishless cycle, you should do a big water change- 75% or more before adding fish. Be sure to change temp. settings if needed and always remember to dechlor.
 
If for any reason you get the tank cycled but can not add fish immediately, you can mantain the cycle by dosing about 1/2 your initial dose ever 3 days or so. The bacteria will not starve.
 
If for any reason you make a mistake or if something goes awry with the numbers, either too low or too high, your best friend is usually a water change. It can help with low KH or pH dropping issues. Start with a 25% change and if it isn't enough to fix the problem, do another one.
 
As for buffering, crushed coral works but it is slow. Use the baking soda, its faster and easier and it buffers water towards 8.2 which is perfect for cycling. I can't help w/ ammonia source as I am in the USA and I use ammonium chloride.
 
Dosing ammonia so it gets above 5 ppm is bad and can harm the bacteria. But the greater danger with repeatedly dosing back to 4 ppm daily is the amount of nitrite it will create and that will for sure kill the bacteria- either some or even all. Also, dosing to 4 ppm makes it much easier to goof and overdose. We all make mistakes

 
Oh yeah- test kits can also goof- so why risk the potential problems when dosing to more than 2 or 3 ppm as described above? Especially, since the above way will usually get one cycled the fastest and with the fewest issues.

 

[aaronc]

Thanks very much TwoTankAmin for that great reply!
 
I am ordering test kit this week, so will see what my tap water is like.  I seem to remember it coming out of the tap at about 6.5 or so that my cause issues.
 
However, the person that is seeding my media also lives locally, so the bacteria are presumably used to the more acidic conditions should help.  I will ask them to test their PH for me if I can.
 
I am going to be planting live plants, so will have to have the lights on at some point, but planning to keep photoperiod low anyway, to prevent algae.
 
Do you have any advice on baking soda dosing? I have a 120litre tank
 
Thanks again

Aaron

 

[TwoTankAmin]

"To raise the KH without raising the GH, add sodium bicarbonate (NaHCO3), commonly known as baking soda. 1/2 teaspoon per 100 Liters raises the KH by about 1 dH. Sodium bicarbonate drives the pH towards an equilibrium value of 8.2."
 
From http/fins.actwin.com/aquariafaq.html