Cycle With Gold Fish?

[Inchworm]

Hi coalpoolwalla

Does your neice have a filter on her goldfish tank?

 

[coalpoolwalla]

Yeah she does.... could i just add my filter in there aswell for a few weeks?

 

[K-Holed]

Absolubtly. Your filter will then begin to gain it's own bacteria and you can then add it to yours with a few fish. Or you could take some of the media from hers and put it in your filter, if that's possible.

 

[coalpoolwalla]

how do i tranfer the media??? sorry i am new to all this.
i think i would just put my filter in her tank save the hassle haha

 

[arobinson1984]

How big is your nieces goldfish tank seeing as you mentioned you would give the 3 fish to her after using them to cycle?

Alot of people dont realise that you'd need a 200ltr+ tank just for 3 goldfish!

I'm with everyone else, fishless cycling is the only way to go, as for the attitude of "its only a goldfish" well thats not the point, its still a living creature, you wouldnt do it to a cat or dog so why is it ok to put a goldfish through torture?

Andy

 

[waterdrop]

One of the biggest factors in the "Fishless vs. Fish-In" debate is the level of expertise of the person cycling and the quality of the communication of the details if the cycler is inexperienced.

For myself, I'd probably find the water chemistry thing too fascinating to be able to pass up my chance to fishless cycle and that's emotionally mixed in with liking the knowledge that no fish are going to be in there to experience my mistakes.

But technically, I have to agree with Inchworm that, done properly, a correct fish-in cycle will not be cruel. Experienced old-timers are quite good at either of two fish-in approaches: choosing just the right very small number of fish for the water volume and then changing water such that the poisons are heavily diluted. Or as a slight variation on that, providing such a heavily planted tank that necessary water changes will be greatly reduced during the fish-in cycling period. This second variation leans on the planted tank hobbyists confidence that they know how to successfully get new plants thriving quickly, which is not a small skill.

Significant problems arise for newcomers to the hobby. By definition, a person without experience will simply not have a "feel" for what to do when there is any gap in the fish-in cycling information that is guiding them. Misunderstandings are rampant among beginners. Right here in the beginners section we see examples each week of misunderstandings that defy logical explanation. Some subset of beginners are just going to be clueless!

I see it as a -gift- that we have fishless cycling to offer to the newcomer/beginner, to allow them to spend their cycling weeks mucking about harmlessly with their test kit and hopefully taking the opportunity to learn all about the basic fundamentals of how an aquarium environment runs and what sorts of modifications to their dream stocking lists need to be researched and made.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[coalpoolwalla]

finnaly got me some ammonia today from homebase.
not added any yet though because i dont get paid till thursday and i am skint so cant get a testing kit.... or could i just add a small ammount to get it going?

also i will post a log on here of me test results because i am new and would like to know if anythinks going wrong

 

[waterdrop]

Sure, if its a small tank put a teaspoon in there, if its a larger tank put two. Can't hurt and it'll hopefully all get worked out Thur night when you can measure.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[rabbut]

I'd go ahead and add the whole first initial shot of Ammonia. Use the Aquarium calculator to work out the amount you need, and add slightly less. It takes usually about a week for the first hit of Ammonia to drop anyway, so you may as well get started while you await the test kits, saves waiting later

Done properly, a fish in cycle is not cruel. The idea is to do enough regular water changes to control the amount of ammonia and nitrites that build up during the process of growing your bacteria. A long slow cycle is not harmful to the fish. Getting impatient and forgetting to do water changes is.

Up until the last five years or so, tanks were always cycled with fish. Then, someone invented the fishless method. Personally, I've never used it, and doubt very much if I ever would.

Disagreeing with a mod usually isn't recommended, but...

No matter how you fish-in cycle, you always intentionally subject fish to some levels of poisonous chemicals. It does not matter how carefully you manage the cycling process, you will always do it, unless the tank is really heavily planted under an EI regime and plant growth is coming through strongly. Research as apparently shown that above 0.25ppm of Ammonia or Nitrite is harmful in the short-term at neutral pH. Any detectable reading in the long-term will lead to damage to the fish. What is defined as short- or long-term is sketchy however, short-term usually between an hour or two to a day, and long term being anything from 4-8 weeks. A cycle takes about 4-6 weeks, and you constantly have at least traces of Ammonia or Nitrite during this time unless the tank "silent cycles" in a heavily planted set-up. This means that in almost all controlled fish-in cycle situations you do damage to the fish, permanent, lasting damage.

I'm not saying I'm totally against fish-in cycling. I've personally done it on a number of occasions. However, for almost all fish now, I will fish-less cycle, purely because I know what I would be doing to the fish by subjecting them to a fish-in cycle

If you do have access to an established tank, be it goldfish or tropical, it's entirely possible that you can start up a new tank by "cloning" it from the older one.

Now there is a good suggestion

Alot of people dont realise that you'd need a 200ltr+ tank just for 3 goldfish!

As someone that's bred Goldfish in the past, I'd argue that they are not tank fish. All my brood stock were stunted by tank life when the spawned, and they were all in excess of 18" in length. A Goldfish in the correct conditions, believe it or not, will reach about 3 foot in length Fancy Goldifish, in larger tanks, I don't mind, but I would never keep common Goldfish in a tank again, only in a pond

All the best
Rabbut

 

[K-Holed]

A Goldfish in the correct conditions, believe it or not, will reach about 3 foot in length

According to the guiness book of records, the longest recorded goldfish was 47.4 cm (18.7 in)

 

[rabbut]

Interesting. Maybe I should get my mate to submit his fish to the record books... I would have expected a much larder entry than that though considering the sizes I've seen them at

 

[coalpoolwalla]

yes this is true "The world's longest goldfish (Carassius auratus) is owned by Joris Gijsbers and measured 47.4 cm (18.7 in) from snout to tail-fin end on March 24, 2003 in Hapert, The Netherlands."