fishmad135
Fishaholic
When i setup my new fish tank i filled it with water from a mature tank..
will this have the ammonia needed for bacteria?
will this have the ammonia needed for bacteria?
Bacteria..?
- Thread starter fishmad135
- Start date
james_fish
Chuck, Leader Of Ze People.
No.
If it is water out of a cycled mature tank there will be no(or shouldnt be) any ammonia at all.
James.
If it is water out of a cycled mature tank there will be no(or shouldnt be) any ammonia at all.
James.
OP
OP
fishmad135
Fishaholic
well that ansers my question, thankyou 
How do i get ammonia in the tank then? i heard places like boots and homebase dont sell it as they are going 'green'?
How do i get ammonia in the tank then? i heard places like boots and homebase dont sell it as they are going 'green'?
james_fish
Chuck, Leader Of Ze People.
well that ansers my question, thankyou
How do i get ammonia in the tank then? i heard places like boots and homebase dont sell it as they are going 'green'?
Im not sure to be honest were you can buy it from but someone else will
But you could instantly cycle a tank by adding media and/or sponges from another tank and seeding the new filter.
James.
OP
OP
fishmad135
Fishaholic
Mature filter media? I have alot of that.. god i feel so stupid now..
Your really gonna hate me for all these questions.....
but have you ever heard of API master test kit? If so.. is this any good?
Your really gonna hate me for all these questions.....
but have you ever heard of API master test kit? If so.. is this any good?
james_fish
Chuck, Leader Of Ze People.
Mature filter media? I have alot of that.. god i feel so stupid now..
Your really gonna hate me for all these questions.....
but have you ever heard of API master test kit? If so.. is this any good?
Don't feel stupid haha, it's just one of them things we learn!
I don't mind answering the questions either. And yes, I have an API master kit. I can't really compare it to any other kit, but it is very popular in the trade and many members on the forum use it. So it must be pretty decent
James.
API master test kit is very good as long as it's the liquid one.
You can get ammonia from larger boots stores or order it for pickup in smaller stores from there web site.
The bacteria that are used in cycling are generally attached to surfaces so gravel, ornaments or best of all filter media from a mature tank. There not free floating so there won't be many in the water from established tank.
You can get ammonia from larger boots stores or order it for pickup in smaller stores from there web site.
The bacteria that are used in cycling are generally attached to surfaces so gravel, ornaments or best of all filter media from a mature tank. There not free floating so there won't be many in the water from established tank.
waterdrop
Enthusiastic "Re-Beginner"
Yes, the API Freshwater (there is a different marine one) Master Test Kit is the one most of us like and use over here in the beginners section as a great learning tool for understanding mature media and biofiltration.
I disagree slightly that the tank water will contain no ammonia (although it's mostly a matter of semantics!) A properly running freshwater tank (with fish) will always have a low level of ammonia that is in the process of moving from the fish (and debris) -to- the bacteria in the filter. Our liquid-reagent kits will not detect this level as it is below a part per million and they are simply not that sensitive.
As I say, however, that's all splitting hairs and in the practical context in which the question was asked, james_fish's answer is correct, tank water does not contain the amount of ammonia we'd use to encourage new bacteria, and yes, mature media is the way we move from tank to tank without ever again having to do a "from scratch" cycle like a brand new beginner might have to do.
The ideal way to "clone" your biofiltration from an established tank to a new filter on a new tank is as follows: First, never use more than 1/3 of your established biomedia (your main sponge or ceramic gravel or whatever) or else your existing tank might suffer a mini-spike of poisonous ammonia or nitrite. Take that 1/3 of "stuff" and work it into multiple places within the new biomedia or at least make sure it's stuffed in just prior to the new biomedia in the flow direction.
It's ideal before you even do this mature media transfer to already have obtained the correct type of simple household ammonia (yes, Boots, either in their larger stores or from their online site, is apparently the easiest in the UK) and to have dosed the tank such that it's at about a 4ppm concentration (our web calculator helps with this, as well as your API kit.) You then perform the media transfer and begin logging daily 24hour results for ammonia, nitrite(NO2), pH and nitrate(NO3) as per Fishless Cycling instructions here in our BRC. After the media transfer you should also "clean" the existing mature filter in the new tank as if it were a cleaning bucket. This will add still more bacteria from the mature filter to the new tank, as it will be pulled into the operating new filter.
If the clone operation "takes" successfully, it should only take 5 to 10 days of fishless cycling to "qualify" the filter (you qualify it by proving that 4-5ppm of ammonia dosing can be dropped to zero ppm ammonia and zero ppm nitrite(NO2) within 12 hours from when dosed each day for 5 to 7 days in a row.) If your newly cloned filter can do this then the fish can be introduced to pristine healthy water.
~~waterdrop~~
I disagree slightly that the tank water will contain no ammonia (although it's mostly a matter of semantics!) A properly running freshwater tank (with fish) will always have a low level of ammonia that is in the process of moving from the fish (and debris) -to- the bacteria in the filter. Our liquid-reagent kits will not detect this level as it is below a part per million and they are simply not that sensitive.
As I say, however, that's all splitting hairs and in the practical context in which the question was asked, james_fish's answer is correct, tank water does not contain the amount of ammonia we'd use to encourage new bacteria, and yes, mature media is the way we move from tank to tank without ever again having to do a "from scratch" cycle like a brand new beginner might have to do.
The ideal way to "clone" your biofiltration from an established tank to a new filter on a new tank is as follows: First, never use more than 1/3 of your established biomedia (your main sponge or ceramic gravel or whatever) or else your existing tank might suffer a mini-spike of poisonous ammonia or nitrite. Take that 1/3 of "stuff" and work it into multiple places within the new biomedia or at least make sure it's stuffed in just prior to the new biomedia in the flow direction.
It's ideal before you even do this mature media transfer to already have obtained the correct type of simple household ammonia (yes, Boots, either in their larger stores or from their online site, is apparently the easiest in the UK) and to have dosed the tank such that it's at about a 4ppm concentration (our web calculator helps with this, as well as your API kit.) You then perform the media transfer and begin logging daily 24hour results for ammonia, nitrite(NO2), pH and nitrate(NO3) as per Fishless Cycling instructions here in our BRC. After the media transfer you should also "clean" the existing mature filter in the new tank as if it were a cleaning bucket. This will add still more bacteria from the mature filter to the new tank, as it will be pulled into the operating new filter.
If the clone operation "takes" successfully, it should only take 5 to 10 days of fishless cycling to "qualify" the filter (you qualify it by proving that 4-5ppm of ammonia dosing can be dropped to zero ppm ammonia and zero ppm nitrite(NO2) within 12 hours from when dosed each day for 5 to 7 days in a row.) If your newly cloned filter can do this then the fish can be introduced to pristine healthy water.
~~waterdrop~~
OP
OP
fishmad135
Fishaholic
Just cut some mature filter media with scissors and placed it into different areas of the new filter. I cannot add any substrate from my mature tanks as they are all sand and my new tank contains black gravel substrate.. 
How about rocks? i could add some of those into the new tank..?
Tomorow i shall beg my parents
to take me to our local pets at home to buy an API Master Test Kit - Fresh water and to look around in boots for ammonia..
Eeeehhh..! I can tell this might take a while
Thanks for all your help, Imogen.
How about rocks? i could add some of those into the new tank..?
Tomorow i shall beg my parents
to take me to our local pets at home to buy an API Master Test Kit - Fresh water and to look around in boots for ammonia.. Eeeehhh..! I can tell this might take a while
Thanks for all your help, Imogen.
waterdrop
Enthusiastic "Re-Beginner"
Put a couple pinches of fishfood in right now if you have that and don't have ammonia. The bacteria will not live long without a source of ammonia (2% loss will start at about 24 hours.) The larger Boots or Homebase will definately be good places to start. The test kit can be 26 to 30 pounds (I hear) or close to half that on the web.. my attempt at UK speak...
~~waterdrop~~
~~waterdrop~~
Aqua Tom
Fish Gatherer
<>
How do i get ammonia in the tank then? i heard places like boots and homebase dont sell it as they are going 'green'?
Check out my signiture for a link to Boots Ammonia
OP
OP
fishmad135
Fishaholic
Couldnt find any bacteria.. but i have the test kit.. cost me £30.99 
i tested the results and they came out
0.25ppm Ammonia
0.25ppm Nitrite
5.0 ppm Nitrate
hmmm.. confusing..
i tested the results and they came out
0.25ppm Ammonia
0.25ppm Nitrite
5.0 ppm Nitrate
hmmm.. confusing..
waterdrop
Enthusiastic "Re-Beginner"
What was it that you tested?
It's good to test both your tap water and your tank water separately and post the results for us. The results posted above look as though they come from a tank that has had fish in it?
Did you mean to say that you couldn't find any household ammonia?
The bacteria would come from your existing filters from established fish tanks, as discussed.
~~waterdrop~~
It's good to test both your tap water and your tank water separately and post the results for us. The results posted above look as though they come from a tank that has had fish in it?
Did you mean to say that you couldn't find any household ammonia?
The bacteria would come from your existing filters from established fish tanks, as discussed.
~~waterdrop~~
OP
OP
fishmad135
Fishaholic
Ooops, yes i ment ammonia.. silly me..
- I tested the aquarium tank water...
My tap water results are between 0ppm and 0.25ppm ammonia
My tank water results are 0.25ppm ammonia
waterdrop
Enthusiastic "Re-Beginner"
Looks like your community tank may be suffering a mini-spike or is not fully cycled for some reason. How long has it been running and had you made any changes to it prior to taking out the mature media for your new tank?
~~waterdrop~~
~~waterdrop~~
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