Aquascaper 600

mbsqw1d

Member
Tank of the Month!
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
1,842
Reaction score
1,629
Location
UK
Something tells me this may not be how it works. "Growth" is photosynthesis, and photosynthesis cannot occur if the light is not of sufficient intensity. Photosynthesis ceases. Of course, the assimilation of ammonia/ammonium continues day and night 24/7, so perhaps this is what you are referring to?

I've not come across whether or not the level of normal respiration changes, I will see if I can track that down.
I'm alluding to the ratio of photosynthesis and respiration. I understand the plant respires 24/7, however if I can talk in terms of: lights on = photosynthesis (over compensation point) and lights off = respiration (below compensation point).
An equal(?) amount of carbon absorbed during the lights on period would then be output during respiration when lights off?
If we are adding carbon artificially to the aquarium in a bid to obtain better growth, then the plant is performing an increased level of photosynthesis and generating/storing an additional amount of glucose (for argument sake, the light levels are sufficient). This should lead to a greater amount of respiration when the lights are off, and as such, take up more o2, than if no co2 was added artificially during lights on?
 
OP
Wills

Wills

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Global Moderator
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
7,068
Reaction score
654
Really interesting articles - I supose on thing I think is missing in some of that article is that although most guidance is to set the level for the drop checker at 30ppm but it does not take into account that the plants will be pumping oxygen back into the tank in the photo period and when pearling occurs it means the water is over saturated with oxygen. I agree that managing the night period is very important though. Again if you can demonstrate through a drop checker that over night it is a steady blue colour the Co2 in the tank is probably under 15ppm.

The welfare of any fish I add into the tank will always be the priority for me so if I see issues with Co2 usage it will just stop, light will be replaced and less demanding plants will be used. I have seen some people have success with weaning plants of Co2 and maintaining long term success with them once they are healthy without Co2.

I always judge success with fish if you can maintain them to their natural lifespan, though some issues can always be expected with new fish. For me part of the point of the hobby is to give the animals a better life than they would in the wild when considering habbitat destruction, pollution etc. Though I do also get enjoyment of having a slice of nature in my home.
 

Byron

Member
Joined
Feb 25, 2009
Messages
14,089
Reaction score
5,501
Location
CA
An equal(?) amount of carbon absorbed during the lights on period would then be output during respiration when lights off?
No, I don't think this is the case. Plants can and do store carbon. So I cannot see the plant releasing more carbon than it does at normal respiration during the night. Respiration is constant, 24/7, so far as I understand it.

In my planted tanks, which do not have any artificial "carbon" supplementation, CO2 builds during the night because it is being produced the same as it is during the day, but at night nothing is using it so it accumulates. This is also the principle behind the "siesta" approach; providing a period of no tank lighting mid-day to allow the CO2 to rebuild because the plants have taken up most of it and it becomes the limiting factor. [I'm not advocating this approach, as it is detrimental to fish, just noting the process.]
 
OP
Wills

Wills

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Global Moderator
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
7,068
Reaction score
654
Woke up this morning and before I even turned the lights on I could see the tank was innundated with green hair algae, I noticed a bit last night but there were strands reaching the surface from some plants.

I managed to manually remove most of it off the plants and scrubbed wood and rocks with a toothbrush but was feeling pretty defeated if I am honest.

So I've taken a pretty drastic step, and I have added a group of 15 Amano shrimp. In response to this I have dropped my Co2 injection to 1 bubble per second (down from approx 5) and I have cut the light intensity to 80% with a daylight arc on it (dimmer start and end, brightest in the middle). Before adding them I did a large water change to help reset the Co2 level in the tank and make it an easier transition for them. In just a few hours they have visably made a dent in the algae and biofilm that my wood has been producing over the last few weeks.

Needless to say now that there are animals in my tank, it will be much stricter monitoring - though I do take comfort with this species of shrimp and Co2 given they are named after the man who developed Co2 injection and invented modern aquascaping :)

I'll try and update with some pics tonight once its darker outside :)

Wills
 
OP
Wills

Wills

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Global Moderator
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
7,068
Reaction score
654
Here we are :) - you can spot a few in the main pic but there is a close up to, quite hard to get a good shot of as they dash off so quickly, reasonably confident they are true Amanos too, especially given how active they have been. The fake ones have a reputation of being a bit lazy?

IMG_0888.jpg

IMG_0889.jpg


Wills :)

*edit forgot to say, I added a Tropica 1-2-grow pot of Atlernanthera Reineckii 'Mini'. Looks really nice just quite small right now!
 

mbsqw1d

Member
Tank of the Month!
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
1,842
Reaction score
1,629
Location
UK
Here we are :) - you can spot a few in the main pic but there is a close up to, quite hard to get a good shot of as they dash off so quickly, reasonably confident they are true Amanos too, especially given how active they have been. The fake ones have a reputation of being a bit lazy?

View attachment 111501
View attachment 111502

Wills :)
I need to have a read up on them. Can you expect them to breed like red cherries do? Obviously if you had a male and female..
 
OP
Wills

Wills

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Global Moderator
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
7,068
Reaction score
654
I need to have a read up on them. Can you expect them to breed like red cherries do? Obviously if you had a male and female..
No they are like Nerite Snails they can lay eggs in fresh water but the young need slightly brackish water to hatch. The 'authentic' species are from Japan, though are widely distributed around Asia too but not always collected there. I've read that there are also a relative species that are from Taiwan that are also sold under the same name but have this reputation of being lazy, they also do breed and hatch in fresh water so thats the true way of telling which species you have - though this is all from reading rather than experience so far.

I am tempted to try Cherries in this tank too - not had shrimp before as my cichlids would have just eaten them so would be a new experience.

Wills
 

mbsqw1d

Member
Tank of the Month!
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
1,842
Reaction score
1,629
Location
UK
No they are like Nerite Snails they can lay eggs in fresh water but the young need slightly brackish water to hatch. The 'authentic' species are from Japan, though are widely distributed around Asia too but not always collected there. I've read that there are also a relative species that are from Taiwan that are also sold under the same name but have this reputation of being lazy, they also do breed and hatch in fresh water so thats the true way of telling which species you have - though this is all from reading rather than experience so far.

I am tempted to try Cherries in this tank too - not had shrimp before as my cichlids would have just eaten them so would be a new experience.

Wills
I got my first lot of cherries around a month a go and I've thoroughly enjoyed them. Make a great change to fish. Unfortunately they're not at all interested in hair algae, nevermind, you can't have everything!
 
OP
Wills

Wills

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Global Moderator
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
7,068
Reaction score
654
Concerning battling GHA, have you ever used hydrogen peroxide?
No I have heard people use it for BBA but not hair algae - I think it’s a really extreme chemical that I personally would never use because the risk is just too high.

Some people use liquid co2 for the same purpose but just goes to show how dangerous that stuff is too!
 

seangee

Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
3,998
Reaction score
3,001
Location
Berks
Every time I have encountered GHA reducing light has done the trick - usually the intensity of the light. So it sounds like you are on the right track. I don't use CO2 but that obviously needs to come down to, which you have done. Give it a few days...

At the rate those plants are growing that's probably not a bad thing, unless of course you find trimming / pruning several time a week therapeutic ;)
 
OP
Wills

Wills

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Global Moderator
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
7,068
Reaction score
654
UNADJUSTEDNONRAW_thumb_ea0.jpg


So after adding the Amano shrimp I turned the bubble counter on my Co2 cylinder to 1 bubble per second and added one of these https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07CTQ2KFK/?tag= a really surprising little airpump and stone - looks a bit messy in the tank at the moment so going to get a second stainless steel diffuser soon.

The good news is that over night my Co2 level is now dropping to levels found in non Co2 tanks, the drop checker is giving me a nice blue colour to show that. Through the day at the current setting it is only going to a dark green which I am quite happy with at the moment it means I am between 10-15ppm of Co2. The plants have grown in very well so far, the monte carlo is a little patchy but growing well - just need it all to interlock.

I have a bit of brown algae on the glass which I believe is quite normal at this stage of the tank, plus I set up the timer and I've messed up the settings so I have low levels of light much earlier than I had originally planned because of the ramp up process. I originally liked it so wanted to see if it would work but I suspect thats whats to blame for the algae bloom so will change the schedule tonight after a bit of maintanance.

Going to give it a bit longer but as long as I can keep the C02 under control - ie green through lights on, blue lights off - for a while longer I will start to add fish, the plants are growing sufficiantly that I should be able to use the silent cycling system, though the filter has been through a 'lazy' fishless cycling process already too.

Wills
 
OP
Wills

Wills

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Global Moderator
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
7,068
Reaction score
654
IMG_0892.jpg


2 Weeks since planting tomorrow, I trimmed the background plant quite a bit as it was really taking over the back left corner, it will come back bushier but I want to work out how to shape it without it getting too bushy. I want to add some background plants behind the stump on the left, I'm thinking Rotala H'ra for the fine red leaves, hoping it would compliment the Hygrophila Araguia and AR mini when it comes through. I have some soil space infront of the Hair Grass in the background I want to fill too but not sure what, needs to be something bigger than the mini hair grass and that blends the two tones of green - any ideas?
 
Top