Another Newbie Again

[catbirdie]

Hi all,

Yes another newbie. I found this site by doing a google search with the question- 'how to move tropical fish from one tank to another'. Great posts!! I'm new at managing an aquarium, having no idea I would get so hooked on having fish. I just love them. About two months ago I purchased 3 neon's for a 5 gal tank. I wanted them to have more space so moved them into a ten gal today...with the two snails from that tank as well. The neon's are swimming around but a little nervous at the moment. The other tank is a 29 gal with 4 guppies and 2 Platy fish which brought me a surprise of an itsy bitsy baby fish!!.. which has been around now for a week. I was very excited. I also have two snails in that tank which has fish now for about a month. I have a bunch of questions but wanted to do the intro first. I cleaned out the 5 gal and set it up as an extra for whatever I might need it for...right now there are no fish in that one. They're freshwater tanks, with plastic plants well, I didn't think I was going to get so involved. I'm sure I'll want to go natural but that will take knowing more than I do at the moment. Learning stages here. I'm looking forward to taking great care of my fish, and getting to know folks here.

Catbird

 

[KittyKat]

Hi, did you move the filter from the 5 gallon to the 10 gallon when you upgraded? If you haven't done so yet, do that now! The media inside the filter is where all the good bacteria live, the ones which make the water clean for the fish.

Neons are schooling fish, so you also might want to increase those numbers to 10. You can also add some bogwood, which is likely to make the water slightly tea coloured, to give them a more natural environment. Some plants like Cabomba, some Hygrophila, Java moss, Java fern and some Crypts are not demanding, so you should try them, the fish will appreciate it.

 

[fluttermoth]

That's good advice there from KittyKat (as always!)



Hope you enjoy your stay here

 

[colleen0309]

Helo and welcome!

 

[catbirdie]

Hi Kitty Kat,
Thanks for the reply and all the info!! No, I had a completely new tank filter and all for the 10 gal. I have the filter from the 5 gal still on the 5 gal tank as that one is up and running also. So I should start replacing the plastic plants ..maybe one at a time.. gradually? (I know I feel terrible they have plastic now that I'm actually getting into this). Is there any maintenance for real plants that I should know? Another question that's pressing on my mind is how often do I feed the two snails? I've read several different thoughts on the internet about that. When you said increase the fish in the tank did you mean with more neons or other tropicals?

Catbird

***********

Hi, did you move the filter from the 5 gallon to the 10 gallon when you upgraded? If you haven't done so yet, do that now! The media inside the filter is where all the good bacteria live, the ones which make the water clean for the fish.

Neons are schooling fish, so you also might want to increase those numbers to 10. You can also add some bogwood, which is likely to make the water slightly tea coloured, to give them a more natural environment. Some plants like Cabomba, some Hygrophila, Java moss, Java fern and some Crypts are not demanding, so you should try them, the fish will appreciate it.
[/quote]

Thank you much for the welcome. I'm already pleased that I had replies to my post

Catbird



That's good advice there from KittyKat (as always!)



Hope you enjoy your stay here

Hi Colleen,

Thanks for the welcome, I feel like I'm in the right place!!

Catbird



Helo and welcome!

 

[Crazycat lady]

Hi there,I'm pretty new to this too and like you had no idea I'd get so addicted! Kitty cat meant to add more neons but I wouldn't do that just yet, I'd quickly put some of the sponge from the 5 gallon filter into the 10 gallons filter x

When you start up a tank completely from scratch and put fish in straight away then it's not cycled. Fish produce ammonia in their poop which is toxic to them and will kill them.

In a cycled tank the ammonia will be converted into nitrite, then to nitrate which is relatively harmless unless in large doses. The only thing that will convert the ammonia to nitrite is special bacteria which live in your filter. With a completly new setup and fish put straight in then there is no bacteria yet and ammonia will get dangerously high.

If u go to the beginners resource section in here it's great help for starters x but I'd transfer the sponge to new filter, don't wash it just take a bit of water out of your 5 gallon, put in a bowl and squeeze it out a bit. Also do a water change in 10 gallon, maybe 50%(that ok kittykat?) And remember to add dechlorinator to the replacement water xx

 

[KittyKat]

Hi, did you move the filter from the 5 gallon to the 10 gallon when you upgraded? If you haven't done so yet, do that now! The media inside the filter is where all the good bacteria live, the ones which make the water clean for the fish.

Thanks for the reply and all the info!! No, I had a completely new tank filter and all for the 10 gal. I have the filter from the 5 gal still on the 5 gal tank as that one is up and running also.

When you start up a tank completely from scratch and put fish in straight away then it's not cycled. Fish produce ammonia in their poop which is toxic to them and will kill them.

In a cycled tank the ammonia will be converted into nitrite, then to nitrate which is relatively harmless unless in large doses. The only thing that will convert the ammonia to nitrite is special bacteria which live in your filter. With a completly new setup and fish put straight in then there is no bacteria yet and ammonia will get dangerously high.

If u go to the beginners resource section in here it's great help for starters x but I'd transfer the sponge to new filter, don't wash it just take a bit of water out of your 5 gallon, put in a bowl and squeeze it out a bit. Also do a water change in 10 gallon, maybe 50%(that ok kittykat?) And remember to add dechlorinator to the replacement water xx

..so if there are no fish or any other live animals in the 5 gallon right now, do move the filter from that into the 10 gallon or you will get ammonia and nitrite in there. Chlorine kills the good bacteria, so make sure you only clean the filters in old tank water, not under the tap.

If there is no ammonia reading, I'd say 50% is a bit on the high side.. but if there is any ammonia reading, 50% is the minimum. Also, it is quite important to temperature match the new water to the old water for water changes of over 25%, or the fish may get a shock from the change in temperature.

Neons are schooling fish, so you also might want to increase those numbers to 10.

When you said increase the fish in the tank did you mean with more neons or other tropicals?

Kitty cat meant to add more neons but I wouldn't do that just yet, I'd quickly put some of the sponge from the 5 gallon filter into the 10 gallons filter x

Yes, I did mean neons and I also meant not right away! You should wait about 4-6 weeks before adding new fish.

In short, any fish which is considered "schooling" lives in groups of 500-25000+, in the wild. So in aquariums, we recommend that at least 6 are kept together, or preferably 10-15+. Tetras, rasboras, barbs, rainbowfish and suchlike are all schooling fish. We also sometimes use the term "shoaling" instead of schooling.

Some plants like Cabomba, some Hygrophila, Java moss, Java fern and some Crypts are not demanding, so you should try them, the fish will appreciate it.

So I should start replacing the plastic plants ..maybe one at a time.. gradually? (I know I feel terrible they have plastic now that I'm actually getting into this). Is there any maintenance for real plants that I should know?

One at a time or all together should both be fine. When you plant, you need to remove any weights or pots that the plants may have, then spread them out a bit (say plant them 1-5 cm apart). Depending on the type, you may only need to remove any dead leaves for rosette plants, or trim any stem plants and mosses occasionally.. you'll figure it out as you go along. Some LFS do sell non-aquatic plants as aquatic, and these will rot under water, so do decide which plants you want, then go and buy those specific ones, not just any one you like the look of. It will probably be easier if you go into the shop with a list of plant names.. Demanding plants need a lot more care than undemanding plants, so it is best to stay away from those until you have more experience.

Another question that's pressing on my mind is how often do I feed the two snails?

What species are they?

 

[Crazycat lady]

nice use of the 'quotes' function kitty kat xxx

 

[catbirdie]

Hi Crazy cat lady Love the pic of the cats Yes, this really sneaked up on me when I just purchased the 3 neons to give the cats some "TV".. now I can barely take myself away from the fish. I had the 10 gal tank for a week, then I got out my test kit and all was well so I transferred them over. I don't have the old filter with the carbon in it anymore, I had replaced that in the old tank. I tested their water again and according to the test strips it's ok??? Says' no ammonia...and all else is in safe range at the moment. But for the future I'm glad I know this!!! You told me a lot of good info which I will save. I'll keep testing the water to make sure it's ok.

Thanks much Crazycatlady



Hi there,I'm pretty new to this too and like you had no idea I'd get so addicted! Kitty cat meant to add more neons but I wouldn't do that just yet, I'd quickly put some of the sponge from the 5 gallon filter into the 10 gallons filter x

When you start up a tank completely from scratch and put fish in straight away then it's not cycled. Fish produce ammonia in their poop which is toxic to them and will kill them.

In a cycled tank the ammonia will be converted into nitrite, then to nitrate which is relatively harmless unless in large doses. The only thing that will convert the ammonia to nitrite is special bacteria which live in your filter. With a completly new setup and fish put straight in then there is no bacteria yet and ammonia will get dangerously high.

If u go to the beginners resource section in here it's great help for starters x but I'd transfer the sponge to new filter, don't wash it just take a bit of water out of your 5 gallon, put in a bowl and squeeze it out a bit. Also do a water change in 10 gallon, maybe 50%(that ok kittykat?) And remember to add dechlorinator to the replacement water xx
[/quote]

 

[catbirdie]

If there is no ammonia reading, I'd say 50% is a bit on the high side.. but if there is any ammonia reading, 50% is the minimum. Also, it is quite important to temperature match the new water to the old water for water changes of over 25%, or the fish may get a shock from the change in temperature.

*******I read on this board how to transfer the fish before I did it, just didn't see a post about the filter unfortunatetly. I took a measuring cup filled it with water from their 5 gal tank, hung it inside the new tank to get used to the temp. then added a little water at a time from the new tank to get them used to the temp. So hopefully they will be ok. I appreciate the info believe me.

Kitty cat meant to add more neons but I wouldn't do that just yet, Yes, I did mean neons and I also meant not right away! You should wait about 4-6 weeks before adding new fish.

*****OK that's important, thanks much.

In short, any fish which is considered "schooling" lives in groups of 500-25000+, in the wild. So in aquariums, we recommend that at least 6 are kept together, or preferably 10-15+. Tetras, rasboras, barbs, rainbowfish and suchlike are all schooling fish. We also sometimes use the term "shoaling" instead of schooling.

****** I'm getting the crash course LOL. ...and having to learn fast for the fishies sake. OK so I have the plant list to add and what fish are ok to add..

Some plants like Cabomba, some Hygrophila, Java moss, Java fern and some Crypts are not demanding, so you should try them, the fish will appreciate it.

***** OK that sounds just great, I'm sure they'll be thrilled to have real plants in there versus the plastic.. geesh! I'll take the list to the store with me when I go.

One at a time or all together should both be fine. When you plant, you need to remove any weights or pots that the plants may have, then spread them out a bit (say plant them 1-5 cm apart). Depending on the type, you may only need to remove any dead leaves for rosette plants, or trim any stem plants and mosses occasionally.. you'll figure it out as you go along. Some LFS do sell non-aquatic plants as aquatic, and these will rot under water, so do decide which plants you want, then go and buy those specific ones, not just any one you like the look of. It will probably be easier if you go into the shop with a list of plant names.. Demanding plants need a lot more care than undemanding plants, so it is best to stay away from those until you have more experience.

****Yes, I'll take the list for sure and thanks for the explanation above.

Another question that's pressing on my mind is how often do I feed the two snails...What species are they?

I'm going to have to call them and ask. They just told me to add a couple of snails to each tank. One is black and one is yellowish. So I'll have to get back to you on that. They told me to give them an algae wafer approx every three days.. but wanted to check that out.

I'm so glad I joined this board. You're just great, thanks for all the step by steps of info. catbird

 

[catbirdie]

I hope I didn't miss anything as I'm just getting used to using the forum and will read up more on the rules and such. Im more used to groups with group mail so if I miss something it's not intentional Catbird

 

[Crazycat lady]

Hi Crazy cat lady Love the pic of the cats Yes, this really sneaked up on me when I just purchased the 3 neons to give the cats some "TV".. now I can barely take myself away from the fish.

Exactly the same thing happened to me!!!!!! then i was referred to here and was introduced to lots of different fish, i love plecs. my tank is not that big so i went for an "L" number pleco. they don't get as big as the common ones who can grow to be monsters. type in L134 (fish talk for the type of pleco) into google immages. thats a leopard frog plec, i think its gorgeous. and L200 (put pleco after that or else you get a load of cars up), green phantom pleco.

test strips are a bit crappy sometimes, the ones with a little tub where you have to drop chemicals in are best. can get them on ebay or any local fish store(around £5-£10).

when transferring fish i tend to ask my fish shop for one of the bags they give you to transport your fish home. most don't mind at all. i put the fish in the bag with water from their tank. roll the top down and then float it in the new tank. leave it there for half and hour and then the temp should be the same.

keep a very close eye on your ammonia and nitrite levels. is best to have them at zero as they hurt the fish! if you detect any then do a water change.

right i'm gonna reply more later coz i gotta go to dentist now. plus my brain isn't working coz i caught a cold of my neighboure little boy yesterday!

 

[KittyKat]

I had the 10 gal tank for a week, then I got out my test kit and all was well so I transferred them over.

Sitting the tank for a week like that doesn't actually do anything.. you might want to follow my fish-less cycle log, I will be starting with the ammonia addition tomorrow.. link is in my sig.

I don't have the old filter with the carbon in it anymore, I had replaced that in the old tank.

Carbon is not much use on an every day basis so you're better replacing it with some sponge or ceramic media when you get a new filter. Carbon is very useful for removing the remains of medication after a treatment, but if used regularly, it is used up after about 1-7 days usually.. so doesn't actually do anything except provide a place for bacteria to live, which sponges and ceramic bio media are better at.

I tested their water again and according to the test strips it's ok??? Says' no ammonia...and all else is in safe range at the moment. But for the future I'm glad I know this!!! You told me a lot of good info which I will save. I'll keep testing the water to make sure it's ok.

Test strips are quite inaccurate, when they run out, get a decent liquid test kit (or get one now if you have the spare cash!). Also, the "safe" levels as marked on strips are not accurate, very often: ammonia and nitrite are only "safe" at 0 ppm (anything above will affect fish), we generally use over 0.25 ppm as "permanently harmful" to fish mark, so if either of those ever shows a reading above 0 ppm, we recommend water changes. You also want to check if your tap water contains ammonia or nitrite, because it sometimes does.

If there is no ammonia reading, I'd say 50% is a bit on the high side.. but if there is any ammonia reading, 50% is the minimum. Also, it is quite important to temperature match the new water to the old water for water changes of over 25%, or the fish may get a shock from the change in temperature.

*******I read on this board how to transfer the fish before I did it, just didn't see a post about the filter unfortunatetly. I took a measuring cup filled it with water from their 5 gal tank, hung it inside the new tank to get used to the temp. then added a little water at a time from the new tank to get them used to the temp. So hopefully they will be ok. I appreciate the info believe me.

The way you transferred the fish is fine, it is the filter we are worried about because without a source of ammonia (fish or household ammonia) in the 5 gallon, the filter bacteria will die and the filter will become useless at keeping the water clean for the fish. Also, the new filter in the big tank was useless at keeping the water clean for the fish because it did not have any bacteria in it, which is why it is important to keep checking ammonia and nitrite, which must both remain at 0 ppm or very close to 0 ppm or they will harm fish.

In short, any fish which is considered "schooling" lives in groups of 500-25000+, in the wild. So in aquariums, we recommend that at least 6 are kept together, or preferably 10-15+. Tetras, rasboras, barbs, rainbowfish and suchlike are all schooling fish. We also sometimes use the term "shoaling" instead of schooling.

****** I'm getting the crash course LOL. ...and having to learn fast for the fishies sake. OK so I have the plant list to add and what fish are ok to add..

Just to make it clear, I wasn't saying you should add all those fish yet! For the moment, keep the neons in about 4-5 weeks start increasing the numbers of neons very slowly

Another question that's pressing on my mind is how often do I feed the two snails...What species are they?

I'm going to have to call them and ask. They just told me to add a couple of snails to each tank. One is black and one is yellowish. So I'll have to get back to you on that. They told me to give them an algae wafer approx every three days.. but wanted to check that out.

Is the black one some sort of nerite snail and the yellow one an apple snail? About 1/4 of a wafer every other day would be better. If one is an apple snail, make sure it goes into the 10 gallon and the nerite into the 5 gallon because when an apple snail dies, it releases a LOT of ammonia, enough to kill all the fish, so I say a minimum tank size for them is 10 gallons, but preferably larger. You must check at least twice per day that the apple snail is alive and there. They usually live for 2-5 years, so you don't really have anything to worry about until it reaches at least 1 inch in diameter, but it's better to be safe than sorry.

 

[catbirdie]

>>> but I'd transfer the sponge to new filter, don't wash it just take a bit of water out of your 5 gallon, put in a bowl and squeeze it out a bit. Also do a water change in 10 gallon, maybe 50%(that ok kittykat?) And remember to add dechlorinator to the replacement water xx


**** Noted on this too tyvm . Even though I don't have that filter anymore for the future, I need to know. No prob w/ adding the dechlorinator, that I do. Just to note, I do have a water filter, but I'm sure it doesn't filter out all the chlorine.


>>>..so if there are no fish or any other live animals in the 5 gallon right now, do move the filter from that into the 10 gallon or you will get ammonia and nitrite in there. Chlorine kills the good bacteria, so make sure you only clean the filters in old tank water, not under the tap.

*****Right now, the 5 gal has nothing live in it. I did replace the blue carbon filter (Marineland Filter Cartridge)(OK mistake didn't know then). the other wheel filter is still in there. I rinsed the gravel... instead of vacuuming as it is such a small tank and was due for a vacuum ..and replaced the water as well.... was clear for a couple of days. The water in that 5 gal tank now is very cloudy. I put dechlorinator in that new water. I'm wondering what to do with that tank. Will the cloudiness clear out or is it all no good because that older bio wheel filter is still in there from when the neons were in the tank. When you said take the old filter and put in the new tank did you mean the bio wheel or the filter cartridge?

>>>>If there is no ammonia reading, I'd say 50% is a bit on the high side.. but if there is any ammonia reading, 50% is the minimum. Also, it is quite important to temperature match the new water to the old water for water changes of over 25%, or the fish may get a shock from the change in temperature.

******The temp is the same for all the tanks. I watch that like a hawk also, so that's ok... and did it gradually to get the neons into the 10 gal so that part is alright.

My neons that I moved into the 10 gal are still nervous. They're not relaxed. I wasn't able to go the store today to get a better test kit, I just still have the strips, which test all is alright, just so you know, even though I have learned now this might not be accurate. My plan is to get the type that was suggested tomorrow, as well as a few live plants.

Should I do anything to the 10 gal with the neons to help make them less stressed? They've only been in the tank 4 days. I did plan on adding a couple of fresh plants if I can tomorrow, or should I leave them undisturbed for a while?


>>>> When you plant, you need to remove any weights or pots that the plants may have, then spread them out a bit (say plant them 1-5 cm apart). Depending on the type, you may only need to remove any dead leaves for rosette plants, or trim any stem plants and mosses occasionally.. you'll figure it out as you go along. Some LFS do sell non-aquatic plants as aquatic, and these will rot under water, so do decide which plants you want, then go and buy those specific ones, not just any one you like the look of. It will probably be easier if you go into the shop with a list of plant names.. Demanding plants need a lot more care than undemanding plants, so it is best to stay away from those until you have more experience.


******I called Petsmart and they have the Java Moss, Java fern, and cryptocoryne.

>>>Another question that's pressing on my mind is how often do I feed the two snails?
What species are they?

******I purchased them at Petsmart also, and called them today to ask
They told me they're called Mystery Snails.. on is gold the other black.

Thank you again!!!

 

[catbirdie]

>>>> you might want to follow my fish-less cycle log, I will be starting with the ammonia addition tomorrow.. link is in my sig.

*****OK Kitty Kat I will ty.

Carbon is not much use on an every day basis so you're better replacing it with some sponge or ceramic media when you get a new filter. Carbon is very useful for removing the remains of medication after a treatment, but if used regularly, it is used up after about 1-7 days usually.. so doesn't actually do anything except provide a place for bacteria to live, which sponges and ceramic bio media are better at.

***OK the 10 gal tank where the neons currently are has a new bio bag as a filter.

>>>>Test strips are quite inaccurate, when they run out, get a decent liquid test kit (or get one now if you have the spare cash!). Also, the "safe" levels as marked on strips are not accurate, very often: ammonia and nitrite are only "safe" at 0 ppm (anything above will affect fish), we generally use over 0.25 ppm as "permanently harmful" to fish mark, so if either of those ever shows a reading above 0 ppm, we recommend water changes. You also want to check if your tap water contains ammonia or nitrite, because it sometimes does.


*****OK on that too plan on picking that up tomorrow.

If there is no ammonia reading, I'd say 50% is a bit on the high side.. but if there is any ammonia reading, 50% is the minimum. Also, it is quite important to temperature match the new water to the old water for water changes of over 25%, or the fish may get a shock from the change in temperature.

***Alright, I'll get back to you after I get it and do a reading. I'm anxious to do the other 29 gal tank also as that is the one with the baby fish in it.

>>>The way you transferred the fish is fine, it is the filter we are worried about because without a source of ammonia (fish or household ammonia) in the 5 gallon, the filter bacteria will die and the filter will become useless at keeping the water clean for the fish. Also, the new filter in the big tank was useless at keeping the water clean for the fish because it did not have any bacteria in it, which is why it is important to keep checking ammonia and nitrite, which must both remain at 0 ppm or very close to 0 ppm or they will harm fish.

***what confuses me about this is when I brought the fish home from the store I was putting them in a new tank.. not in a tank that already had fish in it. (Thet went into the 5 gal at that time). The told me it might get cloudy for a few days and then that would be alright. Now this transition to the 10 gal it is still very clear. The fish are hiding a lot... and seem nervous to me.


>>>> keep the neons in about 4-5 weeks start increasing the numbers of neons very slowly

***OK I hope the fish will be alright.

Thanks again