Am I Finished Cycling?

[poohbear1]

Ok my ammonia is 0 my nitrites are 0 and my nitrates are 160.
If I do a 50% water change can I put fish in the tank today??
Thanks

 

[littlest]

sounds good. When you add 4-5ppm of ammonia, how long does it take for nitrite and ammonia to reach zero?

 

[poohbear1]

sounds good. When you add 4-5ppm of ammonia, how long does it take for nitrite and ammonia to reach zero?

I have been testing everynight and adding ammonia and its dropped within 24 hours.
yesterday and todays test showed nitrites at0 but nitrates high so I was just wanting to check.

 

[littlest]

sounds like you are pretty much there, but really the ammonia should be dropping in 12 hours. Have you tested after 12 hours?
You probably could stock your tank now, but I always think its better to do an extra week for luck (I did this once and in the extra week my cycle semi-crashed, so I was glad I hadn't stocked yet)

 

[poohbear1]

sounds like you are pretty much there, but really the ammonia should be dropping in 12 hours. Have you tested after 12 hours?
You probably could stock your tank now, but I always think its better to do an extra week for luck (I did this once and in the extra week my cycle semi-crashed, so I was glad I hadn't stocked yet)

Ive been testing early afternoon to late night so sometimes its been about 16 hours since last tested. The test today was done within 13 hours.
Ive done a 50% water change and nitrates are down so if I dont get to my local lfs today I wont be putting anything in till monday or tuesday as I have a bust weekend being my sons 12th birthday.

 

[littlest]

OK,
If you don't get anything today, remember you will need to top up the ammonia to keep the bacteria alive (then do another water change before adding fish).

If you are having a busy weekend it might be wise to wait until next week. Acclimatising fish can take a while and it is good to be around when you add new fish (particularly the first ones to the tank) to check they are settling in OK and check the levels. Also, if the birthday party is in your house, then all the screaming kids could spook a new fish out quite a bit. They need some quiet for a while.

 

[waterdrop]

Poobear, don't mean to crash your thread (have a calmer weekend on hand as my son doesn't turn 12 until Sept ),

Wanted to ask littlest and the other experienced cyclers something this thread made me think about.. It sounds like the "second" family of bacteria in poobear's tank is quickly taking the nitrites down to nitrates but the "first" family of bacteria is not converting the ammonia into nitrites quite as fast as littlest thinks would be ideal (am I hearing that right?)

(bear with me here, hard to express but ultimately simple idea..)

So in the little picture I've built up in my head this goes against what I would have expected. My simple image is that the "first" family of bacteria has a head start because one is supposed to watch for the nitrite spike to happen first in the fishless cycling procedure. Then one waits a usually longer period for the "second" group to develop, during which time the "first" bunch should be continuing to reproduce and enlarge their colony, right? So, on paper, I always figured that by the time the nitrites were quickly dropping to zero, one could always expect the ammonia to also be dropping to zero.

Is it the case that the "first" population (gee, gotta learn their names, don't I?) can be individually damaged by something while the "second" bacteria is still flourishing? I mean, its easy to conceive of this but is it a thing that experienced cyclists observe or look for?

OK, that's my question, hope some of you will have thoughts on this!

~~waterdrop~~

 

[rabbut]

Waterdrop, its probibly the other way arround. The nitrite eating bacteria colonie relys on ammonia to be processed before it can go to work. It would be OK to add fish to day, with another 50% water change, as you are supposed to aim for 75-90% However, if you are going to have a lot of noise in the house over the next few days, it would be best for the fish, if you wait untill its over. Fish get diseased more easily when stressed. The noise of a party will definately stress them while they are still settling in. Introducing them now may well lead to problems later on. I'd be patient and wait till early next week

HTH
Rabbut

 

[poohbear1]

Waterdrop, its probibly the other way arround. The nitrite eating bacteria colonie relys on ammonia to be processed before it can go to work. It would be OK to add fish to day, with another 50% water change, as you are supposed to aim for 75-90% However, if you are going to have a lot of noise in the house over the next few days, it would be best for the fish, if you wait untill its over. Fish get diseased more easily when stressed. The noise of a party will definately stress them while they are still settling in. Introducing them now may well lead to problems later on. I'd be patient and wait till early next week

HTH
Rabbut

we arent having a party in the house we are taking him to see his fav football team so will be out house for about 5 hours during day but I can check before and after we come back and sundays we have lazy days in the house after my oldest sons game which we would be out the house for 3 hours for.
So the house will be quiet apart from everyday noise like 2 boys arguing lol.
the ammonia dropped over a week ago and its taken ages for the nitrites to drop but eventually they have and Ive waited a few days testing daily and adding ammonia daily.

 

[littlest]

Poobear, don't mean to crash your thread (have a calmer weekend on hand as my son doesn't turn 12 until Sept ),

Wanted to ask littlest and the other experienced cyclers something this thread made me think about.. It sounds like the "second" family of bacteria in poobear's tank is quickly taking the nitrites down to nitrates but the "first" family of bacteria is not converting the ammonia into nitrites quite as fast as littlest thinks would be ideal (am I hearing that right?)

sorry I think you misunderstood, The OP said that it took 24 hours from adding ammonia for ammonia and nitrite to reach 0. I was saying it should preferably take 12 hours but I meant 12 hours for both ammonia and nitrite to reach zero (which involves all ammonia being converted to nitrite and then all nitrite converted to nitrate). I was referring to the whole process as it were, rather than a specific bit of it.

 

[waterdrop]

Poobear, don't mean to crash your thread (have a calmer weekend on hand as my son doesn't turn 12 until Sept ),

Wanted to ask littlest and the other experienced cyclers something this thread made me think about.. It sounds like the "second" family of bacteria in poobear's tank is quickly taking the nitrites down to nitrates but the "first" family of bacteria is not converting the ammonia into nitrites quite as fast as littlest thinks would be ideal (am I hearing that right?)

sorry I think you misunderstood, The OP said that it took 24 hours from adding ammonia for ammonia and nitrite to reach 0. I was saying it should preferably take 12 hours but I meant 12 hours for both ammonia and nitrite to reach zero (which involves all ammonia being converted to nitrite and then all nitrite converted to nitrate). I was referring to the whole process as it were, rather than a specific bit of it.

Yup, that was it, somehow the way you said it made me misunderstand. And then I got off thinking about how independent the two types of colonies might be (which I still think is a valid question, but not one likely to be answered outside some science journal none of us reads!) Thanks littlest. (Rabbut, believe me, my son & I have been over the N cycle and fishless cycling from the info here a hundred times and have it memorized! I just mistook littlest's comment about ammonia not dropping in 12 hours to mean that nitrite was but ammonia was not which indeed would seem weird.)

What's interesting is how you can read the technique and you can look at diagrams but it doesn't necessarily mean you know it. I've been reading lots of these threads where people get helped because somehow that helps one to see more of the reality or art of it. I'm sure you know what I mean - seeing what people with experience pick up on when a newbie offers a case can really teach you more about what to look for if you've never done it. Anyway, I keep learning -- the very fact that members bother to answer the newcomer's questions over and over is really helpful!

 

[OldMan47]

What you are interested in getting is nitrates under about 20. The 50% water change won't get you close to that. I would do a 90% change and test again. If you end up under 20 ppm as I expect you to, you are ready to add fish.