African Cichlid Die Off after Partial Water Change, Algae Treatment

[jskirwin]

I've been keeping fish for 40 years, Africans for 20 and this just leaves me stumped.

Here's the situation:
60 gallon glass tank
12 2-3 inch assorted Malawians
Argonite substrate (rounded stuff from Petsmart - not fine sand).
Emperor 300 filtration
P.h 8.1-8.3
well water

This was my son's tank that he brought home from his apartment. He had difficulty getting it going but it was stable for 2 months before we moved it here. Brought the fish with 10 gals of water.
Set up the tank a month ago. Added the rest from our well (I have a 46 gal African tank that has been up and running for 5 years).

This was the first partial water change (10 gals) since the move.
Scraped off green algae from sides of tank with acrylic scrubber used on other tanks.
Rinsed off Emperor filters with hose.
Drained 10 gals of water. Did not vacuum substrate. Replaced with well water. Added 5 mils AlgaeFix.
Added 1/2 scoop of Proper PH 8.2.

Fish looked stressed last night so added 5 rounded tablespoons of Aquarium Salt.

This morning found 4 dead fish. Immediately removed 35 gals and replaced with well water. Add scoop of Proper PH8.2. In a panic added some TopFin water conditioner. Like I said, desperate.

Have lost 2 more fish.
One Yellow Lab buried himself 1/2 way into the argonite, so I pulled him out and put him in my 46 gal tank in a breeder box. I've never ever seen a fish do that before.

The water feels very soapy to me. I am planning to do another 50% water change in the morning.

What the heck have I done? I've never seen such a sudden die off like this. When I moved the fish a month ago I didn't lose a single one. Now I'm looking at killing off half the stock.

Any ideas are appreciated. Again, this was an established tank. My 46 gal uses a fine sand Argonite not the course stuff sold by Petsmart. The fine stuff is a PITA but I'm used to it.

 

[Demeter32]

What is the pH of your well water? I don't like adding any sort of pH additive, I feel that is messes with the water far too much and stresses the fish out. Same for algae stuff, I made the mistake once before when I had too much algae, the chemicals effected my juvenile Africans, causing a lovely male blue zebra to have several seizures and then die. I've never used any algae removed since. It's better to control algae with water changes and proper lighting.

For now, do a large water change, add some active carbon to remove any chemicals. I would stop using the proper pH. Test the pH in the tank and the pH of the well water, if the well water is 7.6 or higher then I would not be using the proper pH at all. The tank should be at 8.2 (with the proper pH), but if there is a pH swing going on then that can certainly causes stress and death.

 

[jskirwin]

Thanks for the response. I agree with you. I should have ditched the chemicals.

I have done another 50% water change this morning and didn't add the pH additive. I've lost 2/3rds of the tank, and some sick fish that I put into a breeder box in my healthy tank have also died. I'm down to 5 fish in a 60 gal tank.

pH of the well water is 6.1. Hardness is 13 (I had the well tested last winter).
The water is high in iron (3.0).

I would have expected this to occur when I filled the tank up with 40+ gals of well water a month ago. But now after a 10 gal water change?

I'm going to drive into town after work with water samples of both my healthy tank and of this disaster. I'm also going to get charcoal and fresh filter pads.

Will post results.

 

[StevenF]

What is your GH and KH for your tap and both of your tanks? If there is a big difference in GH or KH you fish might be shoked during the water change even if the PH matches.

 

[jskirwin]

I can't test hardness in my tanks. Sorry I've had a very stable 46 gal African tank for 5 years with no need. I have fine argonite sand in it and have used Microbe-left 8.5 pH Buffer Stabilizer during water changes.

I took two samples in to Petsmart, one from the bad tank and one from my 46 gal aka "good tank."
Without knowing I had Africans the girl said my pH was too acidic in the bad tank. Now that's likely because I didn't add pH buffer this morning after a 50% water change.

I've added a scoop of Microbe-lift and am waiting an hour before adding another. I replaced the Emperor 400 filter media and added some sacks of activated carbon to the filter.

pH now is around 7.4
Just tested the "bad sample" which I brought home: 6.6 or so.

I'm tending to think Demeter32 may have been right about the algaefix. I've learned to keep the algae down in the good tank without chemicals. In fact I usually avoid all chemicals and even treated a case of ick 2 years ago using heat, salt and airstones. Lost a single mbuna in that.

At this point I suspect the algaefix either poisoned the fish directly or caused a dieoff that killed 4 fish overnight. I balanced the well water during the partial water change. Since then it's probably been losses weakened by the initial poisoning and me causing pH imbalances with large water changes that's adding to the bodycount.

Thanks for the feedback and advice.

9:15pm update: pH now 8.0 after another scoop of Microbe-lift at 7:30. The remaining fish still seem stressed but they are alive at least.

 

[thrujenseyes]

Oh man, I'm sorry to hear this.
What a tragedy.
But like Steven said, even if you're PH matches ...the GH and KG might be quite different (I've learned all of this the hard way).
I hope you can save some of them and remedy the problem.
Good luck and again sorry for the stress (for you and the fish).

 

[jskirwin]

An update: I've lost 80%+ of the fish and am down to 3 survivors: a kenyi, an orange peacock and a yellow lab. No deaths in 24 hours.

I took another water sample to a different pet store who swore the pH in the tank was acidic. I'm not sure why the sample tested that way, but just to be safe I bought all new test kits and buffers.

I wasn't aware that the tests expired, but I notice that the new kits do come with expiration dates.

Current pH is 8.0.
No ammonia or nitrates detectable.

Lessons Learned So Far:
1. Never use chemicals. Although its circumstantial evidence only, I lost 4 fish after using Algaefix in a tank with bad green algae. I should have cut back on light and relied on water changes.

Two years ago I treated ick using salt, aeration and temperature because I was aware that the high pH made Africans especially intolerant of chemicals. Big mistake here.

2. Watch pH. I knew my well water was acidic but it didn't really sink in. I should pay much closer attention to this, especially during water changes. The two 50% water changes likely caused pH swings that stressed the fish and helped kill the other 10. Which leads me to...

3. "Keep your tools sharpened." In other words, throw out the old pH kits and replace them. Ditto the buffers. While I'm not sure, the buffer I had been using Microbe-Lift may be old. I've bought Perfect pH 8.2 and will use that from here on out. I need to trust my tools and I can do that only if I maintain them - e.g. keep them fresh.

 

[Crystal90]

I just wanted to mention a product that I use for algae problems. It's called Algone and I've used it for over 10 years. At one point I had horrible algae problems and this was a life saver. It's a packet that you place in your filter (either HOB or canister) and replace once a month or so. I currently have one in my eheim canister filter and I only change it when I clean the filter media. It contains natural ingredients, no chemicals. They have a website algone.com and I believe Pet Solutions is also selling it. I do not have a financial interest in this product only that I've used it and I swear by it. Just thought you might want to check it out.