Aargh Flicking And Rubbing Without Other Symptoms?

[KingKenny]

Right before I begin this has nothing to do with water quality. The tnak is fully cycled with ammonia and nitrite 0 and Nitrate about 10-15 at most.

I'm getting fed up with this now. My wild caught Mbuna and Petricola catfish have been flicking against the gravel for three weeks now, from just a week after coming into a newly cycled tank with no other fish. There are no symptoms other than this, however it has caused a secondary infection of Septicemia.

I am currently trying to stave this septicemia off with Interpet's Anti Internal Bacteria, and have Maracyn 2 on order which hopefully should clear that up after a five day course.

Still, I will be left with the annoying problem of having an undiagnosed illness. Surely it can only be a protozian parasite or fluke etc. Once thing I have noticed is that the fish appear to flick in the area of their gills each time, but that may be as they always flick against the coral sand as the rocks are sharp.

There are no white spots, no great increase in mucus production etc. Sometimes it appears as if the catfish are breathing heavily but this may simply be a reaction to medication in the tank.

Once I have treated for the Septicemia I have to diagnose the cause of this flicking and rubbing or I'll end up going down the same route.

I haven't handled the fish to check actually behind the gill flaps. Should I be looking for here for flukes etc?

Is there a catch all treatment that would work.

 

[KingKenny]

Right before I begin this has nothing to do with water quality. The tnak is fully cycled with ammonia and nitrite 0 and Nitrate about 10-15 at most.

I'm getting fed up with this now. My wild caught Mbuna and Petricola catfish have been flicking against the gravel for three weeks now, from just a week after coming into a newly cycled tank with no other fish. There are no symptoms other than this, however it has caused a secondary infection of Septicemia.

I am currently trying to stave this septicemia off with Interpet's Anti Internal Bacteria, and have Maracyn 2 on order which hopefully should clear that up after a five day course.

Still, I will be left with the annoying problem of having an undiagnosed illness. Surely it can only be a protozian parasite or fluke etc. Once thing I have noticed is that the fish appear to flick in the area of their gills each time, but that may be as they always flick against the coral sand as the rocks are sharp.

There are no white spots, no great increase in mucus production etc. Sometimes it appears as if the catfish are breathing heavily but this may simply be a reaction to medication in the tank.

Once I have treated for the Septicemia I have to diagnose the cause of this flicking and rubbing or I'll end up going down the same route.

I haven't handled the fish to check actually behind the gill flaps. Should I be looking for here for flukes etc?

Is there a catch all treatment that would work.

The scratching symptoms as I see them are:

1) The Mbuna will swim near to the bottom of the tank, turn to their side and scrape/sctach their gill area along the coral sand. They will do this every few minutes if I stand back and watch, less if they think they'll get food.

2) The Syno's do a more aggressive flcking motion. Again in the general gill area.

3) No noticable attachments to the fish. No gold dusting or white spots. At one stage one of the fish had a cloudly/grey area (just colour not raised or fluffy) on his right gill near to the 'chin' This went overnight so I assume it was excess mucus.

4) Their fins are up and they are all eating well.

Any ideas?

 

[WILDER]

Sounds like flukes to me, any red gills on the fish, plus septicemia is hard to cure once it has progressed.

http/article.dphnet.com/cat-02/flukes1.shtml

Flukes are nasty as they ahve sucker that pierce the skin and in the suckers they have a nasty bacteria, which can cause fish to come down with bacterial infections on top.

 

[KingKenny]

They don't have red gills though.

What's best to treat flukes if it is that?

 

[WILDER]

This is the best med.
http/www.aquaessentials.co.uk/index.php?...bb88ecadf913bd8

http/www.jbl.de/uk/aqua/uk_10038.html

 

[KingKenny]

Thanks. Do you think i'd have seen them by now if my fish were suffering with that.

The Mbuna aren't hanging at the surface and their gills don't appear red really. Their gills aren't moving quickly either.

I may go with Sterazin and Flubenol 15. At least that's a catch all for flukes and a fair few parasites.

 

[WILDER]

You can't see flukes with the naked eye, plus you can get skin flukes, eye flukes, gill flukes,.
Waterlife meds are crap for flukes had them with my fish.
If the fish are flicking on objects and water quality is good, i would definately say you have flukes of some kind, if there is no grains of salt like white spot, or a dusting of yellowish colour on the fish.
Plus parasites can cause bacterial infections on top which you are now seeing.

plus if they are wild caught the chances are high that they have fetched a parasite with them into the tank.

http/www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/flukes.htm

You could try the waterlife med for now, as it dosn't sound like there to infested with them yet, but it could take two round of treatment.

http/www.waterlife.co.uk/waterlife/sterazin.htm

 

[severina]

They could still have ich. You might have just caught it before the spots appear.

 

[KingKenny]

Wilder, is the med you suggested and posted a link to what you would use in my scenario?

 

[black angel]

Your fish can have ich and not show spots.
It is more likely to be a parasite but maybe your ph is different to what they had in the store? I would go back and check the ph with them and look at the tanks again to see if any others are flicking.
You have tests for ph, kh and gh dont you? what other additive is going into the water?

 

[WILDER]

He's had them three weeks, so i doubt it ich would of show itself by now, plus i think they should of adapted to the water by now too.
But you never know with fish.
Go in with the waterlife med for now, but i would order the jbl one just in case, good luck.