Have You Overlooked These Fish?

[Lynden]

May I remind you the point of this list, taken from the second paragraph.

my article is not necessarily showing fishes that will be safe with every different type of invertebrate; but it will show what and what not they will eat in a reef setting.

To be really honest, I doubt you are ever going to see anyone else's point than your own

I find this statement very interesting as it would appear that you are one of only two disagreeing with me... which would indicate that you are the one ignoring everyone else's view; certainly, in fact, because you have so greatly missed the point of this list.

Please enlighten us to exactly how having a reef tank makes you impervious to anything

I thought you meant impervious to the "ick factor" that takes hold of many people when they are dealing with bacteria, or insects, snakes, eels and other "gross" animals. I didn't mean to imply that I was invincible or anything... I dare not adhere to any more stereotypes.

 

[Tommy Gun]

 

[Lynden]

Are you absolutely sure about that? I ask because it looks as that another pinned topic, which is more than a year older than yours, echos much of the same points that I am bringing up here. Check it out for yourself:

Risky Stocking Options For Your Marine and Nano Tanks: Rolling the Dice

....now, if those two topics could be combined somehow, then you would hold much more gravity for reefers, especially those 'soon-to-be' versions.

That topic actually led to the creation of this one, and the above topic is very limited in it's information given. This one was made to expand on that one, as it made numerous generalizing statements; this topic was made to show the exceptions to those statements. I would very much dislike the combining of the two topics and I fail to see how it would benefit this one.

 

[Tommy Gun]

 

[Lynden]

...no.

The list is to explain what and what not fish that are otherwise branded as veritable "biocides" will eat in a reef setting. It accomplishes that very well and most (if not all) of the others will agree with me on that. You have missed the point entirely.

 

[Tommy Gun]

 

[Lynden]

....and that's what we call a 'double post'.

 

[Lynden]

It is not misleading at all. You are still completely missing the point. This list is not a gigantic care sheet; nor is it a novel, nor is it an ethology report. It is a list showing what and what not fish will eat in a reef setting, and that point it fulfills perfectly well. It is highly informative and doesn't need any changing or rewriting at all. Can you not understand that? Everyone else can, and I'm starting to get the idea that you know that and are just trying your hardest to be a pain in the a$$.

 

[Tommy Gun]

 

[Tommy Gun]

 

[STD]

Man you are great! This is exactly what I wanted to hear. I am going to buy a dragon wrasse tomorrow!!! That stupid liveaquaria said that they are disruptive because they not only burrow in the sand, they will move rocks...which I wonder, if my corals are well attached, that means they couldn't get hurt in a rock slide? What exactly do you mean by 'well attached'? Most of the corals that I have attach themselves to live rock...how can I make sure they are holding on tightly?

I also noticed that liveaquaria says the dragon wrasse will eat some of my clean up crew members as it gets older, so how does buying it when it is small help if they don't get this 'taste' for some inverts until later? Since they can reach almost a foot long, how big do my crabs and such need to be? I need to keep some smaller hermits in my tank because the larger ones can't fit between some of the rocks...and Tommy told me that the larger hermits are sometimes hard to satisfy with food so they might go after certain tank mates. Oh yea, did you know that some of the conches are not reef safe either? In a couple of those cases, they might even eat corals!!!!!!!!!! Good thing I checked into that because I would have had no idea otherwise. But geeze, those idiots on live aquaria say that they might eat my star fish (I named it Lynden, after you, because you are a star in my book!) and small fish...how small of a fish can they eat? Certainly not my neon gobies, right?

I also noticed on fishbase that they will turn over smaller rocks...should I have some extra rocks just for them to turn over so they don't mess with the rocks stacked up on the back wall of my tank?

dragon wrasses are great characters but they can be very disruptive - they will move rocks bigger than themselves

They will move the rocks that they want to move and make piles of sand

THey are quite capable of eating small fish and starfish and as they are very bold feeders can intimidate more nervous fish so be careful what tou put them with

below is a picture of the rock and sandpile made by my small dragon wrasse - about 2"

 

[andywg]

Clown Triggers can be docile until
they reach lengths of about 8''

Man oh man...I am soooooooo glad I bumped into on this forum!! For the past year or more I have used online LFS websites as an information source and passed up buying a clown trigger because liveaquaria says it can grow to 1'8" and that is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy too large for my tank. What sort of fools can make that kind of typo and more importantly, why hasn't anyone set them straight? Maybe you should write them an email Lynden. Oh, and while you are at it, the thought to check multiple websites for information and almost ALL of them say that it grows to a foot longer than you say. In fact, fishbase says it can grow to 50 cm...not sure what that is in inches, but it sounds like more than 8. Oh, by the way, when fishbase lists the clown trigger as "reef-associated" as its environment, this surely means that it has to be reef-safe, right? I am confused because they don't really mention aquariums too much, but I trust you.

Intentional misquoting is bad.

The above points out that most people have little aggression issues until the clown reaches 8", at which point they develop quite the attitude. I'm not seeing Lynden say they only reach 8".

By the way, I also noticed that many of these fish that you say won't eat inverts should be feed stuff like krill (aren't these a lot like shrimp?), frozen shrimp meat, clams, squid, and stuff like that. How can I be sure that feeding my...clown trigger, for example, hard shelled shrimp doesn't mean it will eat my peppermint shrimp? Its ok if you don't answer that because I am sure you already told me everything I need to know.

Actually, many fish will only eat the food items if they are well fed. People have even had success keeping other fish with the truly amazing appetites and eating abilities of frogfish. My ribbon moray eats prawns that are about the same size as my shrimps, and certainly larger than my feeder shrimp, yet has never touched any "shrimpy" tank mates.

But let's not let facts get in the way of your childish rant, eh?


It's a shame really, you were starting to form a cogent argument, but then went and intentionally misquoted statements making your argument look far less intelligent than it could have been. For some stupid reason I thought you might want to contribute to the thread, rather than demand that it is exactly as you would write it.

Also finally, many of the points made by Lynden echo my own reading of the Reef Fishes books by Scott W Michael. With the greatest of respect, I know who I am going to trust to advise me on fish out of "Tommy Gunn" and Scott Michael

 

[STD]

whoops - I think I should have read Tommy Gins post more carefully before replying to it

 

[Tommy Gun]

 

[Lynden]

Wow, I leave for half a day and all hell breaks loose.

I was gonna try to get Steelhealr to thin this out a bit (to keep it more on topic) but I think I won't seeing as it pretty much solidifies all my above points.

Andy pretty much said it all on this one. As an addition, my puffer, benthic-feeding trigger and morays all eat table shrimp; these are a fair bit larger than my peppermint shrimps, which have not been touched. Some fish actually prefer dead items, which you would have known if you had researched as much for your counterpoints as I did for this list.

The list will remain as is, as so far I am less than convinced that it needs a change. Those last few posts certainly didn't help that.