Fishless Cycle

[ryan136]

Hey just cin wot u all no bout a fishless cycle.to my knowledge u have to have fish in a tank to cycle it cus u need ammonia so the bacteria colony can reproduce.and adding like filter pads from another tank can help cycle ur tank n speed it up but can still take weeks.i no a fishless cycle as a myths i have heard ppl sayin that they do a fishless cycle for a week b4 add any fish.for me that week has done notting at all.u c things in ur lfs in bottels sayin live bacteria in bottle add to cycle ur tank and there hav a used by date of like a year i no that bacteria cud not live that long on a shelf at room temperature. so dont no y ppl do a fishless cycle.

 

[fluttermoth]

Chemically, ammonia is exactly the same and will feed the bacteria, whether it comes from a bottle or from fish, it makes no difference, it's all NH3.

Certainly running a tank empty will do nothing useful, apart from check everything's working properly, but that's not a fishless cycle.

Fishless cycles involve adding a measured amount of ammonia to replicate what would be produced by fish.

People do fishless cycles because, until you have a good colony of nitrifying bacteria, any fish added to the tank are in serious danger of being killed or having long term health problems from being exposed to high (and that's any level over about 0.25ppm) ammonia.

Fishless cycling is most certainly NOT a myth, if done correctly, and has prevented very many fish deaths and a lot of unneccessary suffering, which I'm sure is every fishy enthusiasts aim.

 

[ryan136]

Wot is the ammonia were dus it cum from wud like to learn more bout that. only ammonia i no cums from poo. So putin that ammonia in cycles the tank all the tanks ihav cycled all took tank bout 4-5 week maybe more to cycle and till all tested cum bk at 0ppm. so do u use it n wot do u do.

 

[ryan136]

And i c ur from uk were u get ammonia from.i just put like one fish or two to cycle the tank.i cin on a web site that it was a myth on #114###.co.uk maybe he didnt no that u can get ammonia n put that in ur tank.hav a look on site c if wanna eles on there is bull***

 

[fluttermoth]

You can buy 'pure' ammonia as a household cleaner. It's actually a solution of ammonia in water, as 'real' pure ammonia is too powerful to be sold to the general public! It's usually 9.5% ammonia and the rest water.

Some of them have soap and other cleaners added: obviously you can't use those, but the pure ammnoia is fairly easy to get hold of.

Boots do one, if you're in the UK, although you have to order it online to be collected from the shop; 'KleenOff' is a brand that I believe is widely available in the US, and they are plenty of other suppliers too; you can even buy it on Amazon and Ebay.

A fishless cycle, to explain it very simply, invloves adding enough ammonia to the tank to get to around a 4 or 5ppm concentration, then waiting for the ammonia to disappear.

Once it has, you keep adding and testing, until all the ammonia has gone when you test 12 hours after adding it.

Of course, you have to wait and test for nitrite as well, as that is the second part of the nitrogen cycle, which goes;

ammonia > eaten by bacteria > nitrite > eaten by bacteria > nitrate > water change.

I don't personally use it, because I started fishkeeping a long time before fishless cycles using ammonia were known about.

I did do a fishless cycle, but using fish food left to rot in the tank, which also produces ammonia, but that's a very messy and rather smelly way of doing things, though it does work.

Nowadays, I just 'clone' filters for new tanks, but I always recommend fishless cycles to newcomers to the hobby.

If I ever had to get rid of all my tanks and start again for some reason, I would do a fishless cycle with ammonia, no doubt about it at all.

It's a lot less hard work than a fish-in cycle, which can invlove a lot of water changing to keep the ammonia at a low enough level to be safe for the fish and there's always a risk of killing fish if it goes wrong, which just can't happen in a fishless cycle.

Edited for spelling!

 

[ryan136]

My link try this link thats the site

 

[fluttermoth]

I'm afraid that link just takes me to a page of search results...but I'm guessing you want me to look at this page;Fishkeeping myths[/url]?

It quite clearly, having read the page, states that you cannot cycle a tank without a source of ammonia, and, near the bottom of the page;

I would strongly suggest that you carry out a fishless cycle rather than cycle a tank with fish.

.

so, I'm quite sure what your point is?

Edit; removed url, as from a competing site, apologies

 

[ryan136]

I think bk n rember the water changes every two day i hated doin them lol i started off fish keepin bout 10 years ago read all the books bk then.i started up agen bout 1year ago now shud of read up agen bout fish cycle mite of save a lot of time not doin all them water changes lol.i sold all the fish i had last week and startin a planted tank soon mite look in to that way b easyer like that thaxs

 

[fluttermoth]

You're very welcome

Best of luck with your new tank, and your cycle

 

[ryan136]

Yea i think its that page wen i click the fishkeep myths u put on it dusnt load up put thats wot the page was called was just cin if anyin eles on that myths page isnt a myth like that one

 

[fluttermoth]

I'm sorry, I've just realised that must be a banned (from here) site, as it has a competing forum.

Resonably enough, the owner of this site doesn't want other forums to be able to 'poach' members by being able to advertise here.

 

[gregswimm]

I just use fish food to cycle my tank. Feed the new tank every time I do my fish. The bottles of 'live bacteria' are a BS product. There is no shortcut to growing a bacteria colony. I also know people that cycle tanks with goldfish, as the can withstand a lot of ammonia, and #106### a whole lot.
Hope that answers your question, I have a lot of trouble understanding your writing

 

[afremont]

...The bottles of 'live bacteria' are a BS product. There is no shortcut to growing a bacteria colony. ....

I probably shouldn't put it like this, but the only BS about bacteria in a bottle is what you just said. I know of at least one product that does exactly what you say can't be done. I've done it seven times now, and it has worked every time. I once bought an expired bottle and I thought it didn't work, but it actually did; it was just a bit sluggish to get going. Usually, I can take a 48 hour old tank (long enough to let Prime undo the binding) and then put all the fish I want into the tank and dump in a bottle. Works great.

In case you are wondering, I use the API Master testing kit for my water, and I test religiously on a new tank. Every time I've done this, I see something in the range of .25ppm ammonia (which is how my waters starts off after treatment) for a couple of weeks, but it doesn't rise. After a couple of weeks, it turns pure yellow. I never see any nitrIte spike myself, others have reported blips but nothing extreme that I've heard. The "sluggish" cycle let ammonia reach 1ppm before it started dropping. Surprisingly, still no issue with the nitrIte portion.

On the other hand, I've seen some people try to use it in a fishless cycle and surprisingly it doesn't seem to work that well when you don't follow the directions. The product contains enough live bacteria to immediately assume a largish fish bioload (my personal record was 11 DG rescue fish in a 10g hospital tank for a week then I started two more 20g's the exact same way to relocate the fish). I also started several other tanks the same way. I did a fish in cycle with my daughters betta (10 gallon) with water changes just to see how long it would take. It takes too long, I'm going to keep using the bacteria in a bottle method.

I'll agree that there may not be a shortcut to "grow" a colony, but you can certainly dump a large prepared colony in from a bottle.

 

[CezzaXV]

...The bottles of 'live bacteria' are a BS product. There is no shortcut to growing a bacteria colony. ....

I probably shouldn't put it like this, but the only BS about bacteria in a bottle is what you just said. I know of at least one product that does exactly what you say can't be done. I've done it seven times now, and it has worked every time. I once bought an expired bottle and I thought it didn't work, but it actually did; it was just a bit sluggish to get going. Usually, I can take a 48 hour old tank (long enough to let Prime undo the binding) and then put all the fish I want into the tank and dump in a bottle. Works great.

Care to share what this product is? From experience from the many members here, none of these bacteria in a bottle products seem to work, but if you have one that you believe works, it'd be good to share it.

 

[afremont]

Care to share what this product is? From experience from the many members here, none of these bacteria in a bottle products seem to work, but if you have one that you believe works, it'd be good to share it.

Tetra Safe Start. Just read this and you should have no problems with it:

http/www.fishlore.com/fishforum/aquarium-nitrogen-cycle/58116-q-tetra-tetra-safestart.html

Be sure to look at expiration date on the bottom of the bottle. Don't buy it if it doesn't look like it was handled properly, heat will ruin it.