Why Isn't The Message Getting Through?

[ColR1948]

A lot of fish forums are getting new posts everyday of new fishkeepers who have got a tank added fish without cycling and then wondering why they have problems.

I know a good percentage of the time it isn't their fault so I'm not picking on them in any way, so to my question, 'Why isn't the message getting through?"

Obviously a lot don't research, they go in the fish shop and see the fish and get the bug and buy a tank, filter, heater and fish.

I think one of the biggest problems here is the fish shop, how many of you have bought a tank or fish and never been asked if you already have fish or keep fish by the shop personnel, I bet not many?
Is the reason the shop personnel don't ask because it is a sale and in asking might put someone off buying or are they just not interested?

Thinking about it, if someone went in the shop and wanted to start off by buying the tank and the bits and the shopkeeper gave them the the fishless cycle advice would they not bother and think again or would they go elsewhere?

We have all been in the shop and overheard bad advice and you know what will happen, I stepped in once when I heard bad advice and was told to mind my own business by the shopkeeper.

I'm sorry if sounds like a rant but something has to be done to get the message across, I know we advise on here but it would be good if we hardly ever needed to, do shops need lobbying more to do the right thing?

 

[DrRob]

I think there is a perception difference when it comes to fish. A lot of people think of them as decorative rather than as pets. Even vegetarians will eat them and think that it fits in with their ethical view points.

If a pet shop told you you could keep a kitten in a shoebox then the RSPCA would be shutting them down pretty quickly, however the general public view is that we deal with decorative objects with 3 second memories that feel no pain. Win that one and the message will get through.

 

[freshwaterfishlover]

One thing I see is people think they don't need to do water changes because they have a filter.

 

[CezzaXV]

Here, here.

I've been in a shop before and bought a single cardinal tetra. It was cool, I was adding to my shoal. The shopkeeper didn't know that though. He must have known that you can't keep these fish individually, but never asked.

I know a lot of people on here moan about Pets At Home, but in all honesty it's the only shop I've ever bought livestock from and been asked how long the tank has been set up, if it's cycled, how many other fish I've got, when I last added fish etc etc. I get an inquisition from P@H, but never get asked anything anywhere else!

 

[fluttermoth]

I think Rob's hit the nail on the head there.

To the average 'man in the street', fish (especially the poor, hardy goldfish) are an easy option. So many people have had a goldfish that lived in a bowl, cleaned out in the sink once a week or when the water went green that lived for years.

Of course, goldfish inadvertently bring it on themselves by so often refusing to die! Imagine people trying that with something like a seahorse? None of them would last an hour, so people wouldn't do it.

It pains me to say it, but we really need a celebrity (i hate celebrity culture, but It's what gets the attention in the press) to head some sort of campaign, and for animal welfare to educate themselves about fish, because, much as I admire the RSPCA, for example, on fish they're still 30 years out of date.

As for cycling, we need shops to really get up to date as well, start giving out decent information and working out some sort of 'instant cycle' product that actually works as, let's face it, while fish do survive fish-in cycles, people will continue to do them, and not many people will have the patience or commitment to do a fishless cycle. It can't be that hard; it could be as simple as keeping a separate tank with cycled media in it, along with a diagram of the nitrogen cycle. The MA in Plymouth sells cycled media for a penny, so it can be done.

 

[Mikey1]

sadly, we live in a world of "here and now", people want things immediately, just look at overnight shipping,

if a store owner tells a "newbie" they have to wait 6-8 weeks before they can add fish, that person is going to look for a different hobby to pursue which equals lost sale, and lost money.....although i dont nessessarily agree with it, from a business point of view it makes perfect sense....also dying fish equals the customer coming back to buy more fish....get it?

 

[ColR1948]

Coming back in the discussion, fluttermoth mentioned adding cycled media to the filter, again I have had it myself and heard from others a lot of shops won't give you a sample of cycled media, just think if they sold the tank and bits and said as soon as it is ready we can give you the media to add fish then you won't have to wait, they would be more or less sure of the sale plus, or even if they sold the media it would be an extra few pounds for the till.

 

[fluttermoth]

sadly, we live in a world of "here and now", people want things immediately, just look at overnight shipping,

if a store owner tells a "newbie" they have to wait 6-8 weeks before they can add fish, that person is going to look for a different hobby to pursue which equals lost sale, and lost money.....although i dont nessessarily agree with it, from a business point of view it makes perfect sense....also dying fish equals the customer coming back to buy more fish....get it?

I wish they could see how counterprodcutive that is! Most of those people spend £50 on a little tank, a fiver or tenner on a few goldfish, until they get sick of replacing them, then give up. If they started people off the right way, they'd stay in the hobby and end up spending hundreds on huge tanks, discus and marine set ups!

Coming back in the discussion, fluttermoth mentioned adding cycled media to the filter, again I have had it myself and heard from others a lot of shops won't give you a sample of cycled media, just think if they sold the tank and bits and said as soon as it is ready we can give you the media to add fish then you won't have to wait, they would be more or less sure of the sale plus, or even if they sold the media it would be an extra few pounds for the till.

Exactly

 

[Mikey1]

I wish they could see how counterprodcutive that is! Most of those people spend £50 on a little tank, a fiver or tenner on a few goldfish, until they get sick of replacing them, then give up. If they started people off the right way, they'd stay in the hobby and end up spending hundreds on huge tanks, discus and marine set ups!

i disagree....i would say they learn by experience, which doesnt mean giving up

i have been in the hobby over 25 years, i have kept and bred almost every tropical fish possible and have bought and sold hundreds of tanks....and i will fully admit i started out being an uneducated, ignorant fool who knew nothing about cycling or keeping fish....it was probably a good 2 years or more before i learned "cycling" and how bacteria worked....

 

[fluttermoth]

I've known an awful lot of people, over the years, start and give up fishkeeping very rapidly though, many more than I know still keeping fish now.

My cousin killed a couple of goldfish bought for her daughter last year and ended up getting a cat. She never even thought to ask me for advice, even though she's seen and admired my tanks numerous times over the years. She honestly thought you bought a tank, ran it for three days and put some fish in.

My mum talked one of her dog walking friends out of buying a bowl for her dining room table and putting a goldfish in it only a couple of weeks ago. Again, she didn't think there was anything wrong with that.

 

[basboi85]

Swallows aquatics in Rayleigh Essex ask what fish you have ect ect and depending on the staff they won't sell the fish but advise you on others that are compatible.

Happened to me by refusing to sell the fish as they wasn't compatible with some of my stock I had at the time

 

[ColR1948]

Well like already stated (not many) shops do that, I don't want this thread to get in to naming bad shops because the thread will get closed, it is more to get the point across of getting the right message to new fishkeepers and hopefully keeping them keeping fish.

 

[Livewire88]

Here, here.

I've been in a shop before and bought a single cardinal tetra. It was cool, I was adding to my shoal. The shopkeeper didn't know that though. He must have known that you can't keep these fish individually, but never asked.

I know a lot of people on here moan about Pets At Home, but in all honesty it's the only shop I've ever bought livestock from and been asked how long the tank has been set up, if it's cycled, how many other fish I've got, when I last added fish etc etc. I get an inquisition from P@H, but never get asked anything anywhere else!

I agree with you 100%, P@H seem to be the only fish store that I go to that question you about your tank and ask all the correct questions. Every other shop just sells you what you want and a lot give poor advice on what fish should be in your tank.

 

[JT-SCFC-1912]

I'll be honest, I didn't know a lot about tropical fish keeping when I bought my first tank which was a few months ago.My Dad & Uncle have kept and still have tropical fish, which in turn got me interested!. But I did ALOT of my learning as I was going through it. More bad than good, but it only made me even more determind to get it right!.

I'm not going to name and shame a certain 'well known' company that has various branch's across the UK, but the level of service I received was quite poor tbh. They only care about the sale!, recieved some majorly bad advice from this place which resulted in numerous visits back and forth!

I think the problem is that the people they have working there don't give a crud about customers (££&pound / and in turn give bad advice because they cannot be bothered.

I personally think your local small fish stores are the best!, I'll be honest when I started going to my LFS I didn't know about 'fishless cycling', the staff there are excellent, and they have taught me a lot along with this forum - I think that staff at that unnamed shop should educate beginners more about fish less cycling because you could save a lot of money and fish life's in the long run!

Lol Rant overr, really really dislike that shop!!!

 

[ColR1948]

@ JT above, that is a good post, this kind of proves a point, you realised you got bad advice and found a good shop now you go there instead, so the bad advice shop lost another customer.