Why are my fish dying?

[Anankee]

Hi all,

I have recently inherited 2 aquariums and have never owned fish before. The only surviving fish (by the time I got the tank) is what I'm fairly certain is a Siamese Algae Eater. I placed him in the smaller 80L tank where he has been for a out 6 weeks while we cleaned the 200L tank. He was healthy enough in the smaller tank but didn't have room to swim so I wanted to get him out ASAP. We also purchased 2 guppies, 2 red tails, 5 tetra, 2 silver shark, a clown shark and a few sucking catfish. A couple purchased initially as company for the algae eater and the rest after we got the bigger tank going. They all seem to be getting along well enough. Some have been in the bigger tank a week and a half , the rest 3 days, and I've lost 3 fish already. (Clown shark, red tail and catfish).
We have treated the water with prime and stability for a week before putting the fish in and levels seem fine (although ammonia is about 0.01 which was same as the other tank and they were fine in there.
I don't know why they are dying. The only thing I can think of is that we filled the tank and the water sat there for about 2 weeks give or take before we turned on filters and treated the water. I don't know whether that's a problem.
Any advice I can get to help stop all my fish from dying, especially my Siamese algae eater as he belonged to my brother who I recently lost.
Also, we noticed yesterday someone has had 2 babies, we are almost certain they are guppies.
Please help!!

 

[FroFro]

Hi all,

I have recently inherited 2 aquariums and have never owned fish before. The only surviving fish (by the time I got the tank) is what I'm fairly certain is a Siamese Algae Eater. I placed him in the smaller 80L tank where he has been for a out 6 weeks while we cleaned the 200L tank. He was healthy enough in the smaller tank but didn't have room to swim so I wanted to get him out ASAP. We also purchased 2 guppies, 2 red tails, 5 tetra, 2 silver shark, a clown shark and a few sucking catfish. A couple purchased initially as company for the algae eater and the rest after we got the bigger tank going. They all seem to be getting along well enough. Some have been in the bigger tank a week and a half , the rest 3 days, and I've lost 3 fish already. (Clown shark, red tail and catfish).
We have treated the water with prime and stability for a week before putting the fish in and levels seem fine (although ammonia is about 0.01 which was same as the other tank and they were fine in there.
I don't know why they are dying. The only thing I can think of is that we filled the tank and the water sat there for about 2 weeks give or take before we turned on filters and treated the water. I don't know whether that's a problem.
Any advice I can get to help stop all my fish from dying, especially my Siamese algae eater as he belonged to my brother who I recently lost.
Also, we noticed yesterday someone has had 2 babies, we are almost certain they are guppies.
Please help!!

We need to know all your water parameters. Hardiness, Ph, Nitrates, Nitrites, Ammonia. It sounds like you didn't have a properly cycled tank and you added way too many fish at one time. Any beneficial bacteria you might have is not enough to take on the bio load of all those fish at once, resulting in spikes in the water and then stressed/sick fish, which results in them dying. Also when you cleaned one of the tanks did you use soap/bleach? Chemical cleaners are known to kill fish, so it's best not to use them when cleaning a tank. Is your tank heated? Do you add other things to the water besides water conditioner?

 

[Anankee]

Thanks for your response. PH is 7 - 7.2, ammonia is about 0.01, nitrate is 0 and nitrite is about 10-20.

I have no idea about hardness.... or how to measure it.

I have kept the filters going on their smaller tank and am considering moving some back to that tank, but they have moved a few times recently and I'm worried about stressing them out.


When we cleaned the tank , we only used water and the aquarium scrubbing brush I found amongst my brothers aquarium equipment

 

[Anankee]

Also our tank is heated to 24 degrees Celsius . We have not used anything in the water other than conditioners, although we have a few bottles of various plant nourishes and multi cure , but are not using these yet

 

[Byron]

I agree with FroFro, this is almost certainly a cycling issue. There are articles on cycling in the "Cycle Your Tank" section of this forum,
http://www.fishforums.net/forums/cycle-your-tank.291/

With nitrite at anything above zero, you must do frequent water changes, I would say every day or at the very least every other day, half the tank volume, and use Prime to condition the water. Ammonia and nitrite is deadly to fish. Prime detoxifies both but only for 36-48 hours, after which any detoxified/bound ammonia or nitrite will again become toxic, plus there will be more being produced during the establishment of the nitrification cycle. The articles I linked will go into all this further.

Leaving that momentarily, and just as a caution for later after the immediate issues are resolved, please research intended fish carefully. This is something all of us initially fell into, and we lost many fish along the way. I mention this because some of the fish acquired are totally unsuitable here, either because of aggression, tank space, or numbers. Any surviving "shark" whatever the species should go back to the store ASAP. I won't go into all the reasons, the main thing now is to save what fish you can, but once this is settled down I will gladly explain why these sharks are not suitable. The tetras should have more, but without knowing what species I won't advise this, they may be problem fish or not, depending.

Welcome to TFF, it is good you joined us. There is much for all of us to learn, but things will work out and then this hobby is indeed spectacular.

Byron.

 

[Anankee]

Thanks Byron. I do have one more question. When we first filled the tank we had trouble getting it set up due to size. In hindsight we shouldn't have filled it until the equipment was plugged in! Anyway, the water was in the tank about 2 weeks give or take before we turned on filters and started using conditioners. Is this a problem?

Also just to clarify, it was nitrite at 0, nitrate 10-20. Sorry for confusion

 

[Byron]

Thanks Byron. I do have one more question. When we first filled the tank we had trouble getting it set up due to size. In hindsight we shouldn't have filled it until the equipment was plugged in! Anyway, the water was in the tank about 2 weeks give or take before we turned on filters and started using conditioners. Is this a problem?

Also just to clarify, it was nitrite at 0, nitrate 10-20. Sorry for confusion

On the nitrate, is this occurring in the aquarium itself, or is nitrate present in your tap water? Test the tap water on its own for nitrate if you haven't already, just to pin this down.

As for the water sitting in the tank for two weeks, this is not a problem other than it would no longer be fresh water. And by the way, re the hardness, this you should be able to ascertain fro the municipal water authority if you are on city water (and not a private well). Check their website, it may have water data somewhere. The GH, KH (Alkalinity) and pH would be helpful to know.

 

[Anankee]

Hi guys, unfortunately I lost most of these fish. I put the survivors back into the smaller tank where they are doing great, and removed all of the water from the bigger tank (its 220L) and refilled. Im sure my tank is cycled
Here are the conditions:
PH : 6.8
Ammonia 0.1
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10-20

I turned off the heater and put 3 small goldfish in . Within 3 days 2 of the goldfish died. They were swimming near the top of the tank and appeared to be gasping for air, Then they started sitting near the bottom of the tank

I started doing 30% water change every other day. I lowered the water level so the filter seems to be agitating the surface better as I read that this improves oxygen.
This helped somewhat as the last goldfish now swims up to the top for air but doesn't stay there. He still bottom sits and seems quite lethargic. It's really hard to tell if he will make it.

I have kept up the water changes every other day. I also fill a huge bucket and let the water sit for 24 hours before I put in the tank and treat with prime and stability right before I fill the tank.

What is confusing me is that the conditions of both tanks are identical yet in one fish die and the other they thrive. I'm so confused. I also read that because the filters were used by my brother that they should already be cycled. I'm really lost. I removed the air pump as I was told it was not necessary and wanted To go as basic as possible and try to systematically rule things out.

I haven't tested the hardness yet as my test kits are expired and I need to buy, but it would be the same as the water in my smaller tank and that is going great.

I really need some advice!!


I did want to put my tropical fish back in this tank but I can't seem to get it right

 

[Anankee]

I did also go on my water provider website but wasn't able to find the hardness

 

[Essjay]

Anankee, which country are you in? If it is the UK, tell us which water company you use and I'll see if I can find the page for you. Most UK companies have a page somewhere where you type in your postcode to find the water quality and hardness but some don't give it.

 

[Anankee]

I live in Australia.
Here is my provider https://www.barwonwater.vic.gov.au/

 

[Byron]

I live in Australia.
Here is my provider https://www.barwonwater.vic.gov.au/

If you open the report on this site and scroll down to page 49, there is a chart with the GH and pH. The values vary a bit, and there are 11 testing reservoirs, but the highest GH for only 2 is 114 mg/l [= ppm] which is roughly 6 dGH. The other tests are much lower, so we can conclude your water is soft to very soft. The pH range is in the 7's, a couple of 8.

The fish mentioned in post 1 are mainly soft water species (guppies the exception), and the pH does not seem too high, so this should not be the issue. At least, now you know more about the water. Avoid livebearers in future, and stay with soft water species.

So back to the dying fish in one tank. I would have to wonder if there is something toxic in this tank; what decor do you have? And what is the substrate composed of? FroFro mentioned toxins previously too, other possibles.

 

[Anankee]

View attachment 82065 Thanks so much for your help with the water, I really struggled to find and understand it. I do have guppies in the small tank and so far they are doing well but at least I now know that I should avoid buying more (which is a shame as I really love them!!)

So the larger tank is a little bare at the moment as I took out most of the decor and put it in the smaller tank. In hindsight I probably shouldn't have done that but it was some weeks ago now and at that stage I thought it was purely a cycling thing.

I'm not exactly sure on the type of gravel, but there are two kinds. One is a finer gravel and the other is chunkier. They were rinsed a number of times and agitated in water before going into the tank. Then there are a coupe of rocks and driftwood that were in the tank when my brother (original owner) had it:

I forgot to mention, the plant is a new addition and is only a few days to a week old and a couple of the leaves are browning already(only slightly) I don't know if this is due to the water or how I have it set up.

 

[Byron]

I think the plant is a terrestrial, not an aquatic species. Unfortunately many fish stores, especially chain stores, sell terrestrial plants as aquatic. Some may last for a while, but none last long.

I still can't say what might be toxic, if those rocks were used previously for some time with no fish problems.

 

[Anankee]

Ok unfortunately my last goldfish didn't make it through the night. I'm really frustrated and sad and I wish I at least knew what the problem was so I could fix it.
I tested water and got
pH 6.4
Ammonia 0.1
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10-20

I am leading towards something toxic in the tank. Everything EXCEPT the gravel was already in the tank. So maybe gravel is a good place to start.

IF it is the gravel, how would I best deal with this?