What Are Your Views On Breeding Fish?

[Tokis-Phoenix]

Time and time again i see threads on people who want to breed fish.
Usually they know what type of fish they want to breed but have done no research into anything about breeding it at all and expect everyone to cough up the info on their behalf, but more than often its a thread on "i have a 10gal tank, what should i breed?".

What interests me though, is what is everybodys obsession with breeding fish, or any animal for that matter. As far as i see the plus's and minus's or whatever you want to call them on breeding fish(lets look at livebearers in particular) are these;

Plus's;
a. You get to know your intended fish species for breeding better in more depth, you get to see the mating and social behavior in more depth, watch the process of pregnancy or growing and fertilising of eggs, the growth and rearing of fry and how the fry mature physically into adults.
b. Fish fry tend to be very cute and enchanting, particualy livebearer fry like guppy fry for me, you feel like a parent to your fry and it feels like an acheivement as well to have successfully breed your fish and raised the fry into adults ready for the big wide world of aquarium life.
c. You might make some money from raising your fry which could pay for things in your aquarium like food and dechlorinator or new fish etc.
d. When you rehome your fry(if you decide to), you might get to know your lfs owner better or staff or even help a friend start up their own tank with your fry or to simply get to know people in your area better who want to buy your fish.

Minus's;
a. The vast majority of fish produce huge amounts of fry, that is partly because the vast majority of fish people decide to breed are small ones and one thing that many small fish seem to have in common is that they produce large quantitys of fry since most small fish are at the top of many predatory fish's menu's, so they need to breed on a much larger scale for the survival of their species.
The problem with this is that you need a large fry tank or alot of small tanks for rearing fry. Many fish eat their own fry and eggs so the fry often need to be removed after being born to prevent them from getting eaten. Also with fish like bettas, the male fry will obviously start to fight as they mature so you need alot of tanks to raise them.
I don't think i can think of one fish where it is highly beneficial to have a separate tank to raise fry in, and extra tanks means more money.
b. Some fish, particualy livebearers, will produce mass's of fry on a regular basis- a single guppy female has the ability to produce over 40fry a month. Livebearer females can even get pregnant for up to 7 pregnancys in the absense of a male as they can store sperm in them. Mollys can easily produce oevr 100fry in a single batch. You are talking about a 100gal fry tank at least to raise 100molly fry in.
c. Many fry take a long time to raise, the problem with this is that the main way of rehoming your fry is via a lfs and the vast majority of lfs's will not take tiny fry off you due to the fact that no one will buy them in comparison to the adults and also the extra care fry need in their early stages and how fragile they are.
Molly fry take a year to mature and your adults can have many batchs of fry during this time.
The novelty of raising fry can easily wear off when you discover that you will be having to do 3times weekly water changes, 3-4times+ a day feedings with special fry foods and you will be having to do this for the next year of your life non stop.
d. Breeding your fish does not nesarsarily make them happier/better off by an means, many people feel the need to breed their fish because they feel sympathy for them in some way or another, but the fact of the matter is that breeding fish can be very stressful for the parents.
Male and female bettas can try to kill each other when introduced for breeding and female livebearers can often die trying to give birth to large batchs of fry or die shortly afterwards- male livebearers will harrass the females a great deal while the females are trying to give birth to eat their fry and mate with them sooner or cause the female to abort a rival males fry etc.
e. Ive noticed with many people that own mixed gender groups of livebearers say they will cull the fry if they get out of control.
But then you find 30fry in your tank and you think "ahhh...they are so cute!" and suddenly the prospect of culling them seems utterly heartless to kill such tiny innocent baby animals. The problem with raising large quantitys of fry in too smaller tank is that as they grow, the tank will no longer be able to cope with the bioload you will eventually get an ammonia spike killing everything in the tank.
Even if you have contacted your lfs and they have agreed to take your fry off your hands, no lfs will take 40 adult fish whatever they may be in one day, so always be prepared to hold onto your fry for much longer and have the space to do so.
f. Inbreeding and genetics is another factor, many people don't see anything wrong at breeding related fish at first glance but the fact of the matter is that inbreeding has destroyed many types of fish in many ways. With livebearers and their breeding abilitys, its easy for breeding to get out of control. Many people do not consider that their cute 3month old guppy fry could have the ability to mate like randy little rabbits with each other under your eyes.

There are many factors of fish breeding to discuss, but on the whole i don't see what all the hype is about breeding fish.
Its a learning experience yes, but never cheap or easy all the way through.
The thing is though, it appears many people who decide to breed fish have no real idea of much effort/work, time and what goes into the process of breeding the fish is like. Breeding any fish should be somthing you think deeply about and research into every factor, its not supposed to be a spur of the moment idea.
I guess im ranting here a bit, but i wish people would think more deeply about breeding fish.

What are your views on fish breeding or breeding particular fish?
Do you wish less people bred bettas or perhaps didn't attempt to breed particular fish at all?
When you first bred fish, did it happen unexpectadly in your tank or did you do it deliberatly?
Have you bred fish before or would consider breeding any particular type?

 

[WILDER]

Don't really believe in breeding fish for your own agenda, but at least it helps cut down on the wild caught fish which i don't tend to agree with, that about it really never really thought about it in great depth.

 

[GSD]

I think that you should really spend at least a year just looking after that particular species learning about them and how to care for them,doing alot of reserch the whole time.Then look and see if their is a market for those fish,because if not your gonna be stuck with 100s of little fish with nowhere to put them.This is especially true with bettas.Then once you know everything there is to know then concider your situation.'can i afford it and do you have the time?'come to mind as well as.'do i have the space?'then you can start to think about breeding.

 

[MAM]

You do make some valid points Tokis. So many fish keepers get caught up in the fry-madness. They see others are breeding, they ooooo and aaahhhhhhhh over the pics, and, because the breeder IS often quite experienced, they make it seem so easy. And so yes, many folks jump right in without much thought to it. They end up learning the hard way that breeding fish has its ups and downs. Sometimes, you can only try to beat this into people for so long before you just have to throw your hands up, sigh, and just let them learn the hard way.

Now, I'm all for breeding your fish, if you know why you're doing it, know what you'll need to do it successfully and are committed to seeing it through and can afford the cost, know what you'll do with the resulting fry, etc. For example, I've gotten in to betta breeding myself. But I'm keeping wild types and am becoming part of the Species Maintenance program. Many of these species are endangered in the wild, but species maint. programs can help to ease the demand for these fish by providing hobbist with a ready supply of tank bred and raised specimens. That aspect of it is part of why I got into wild bettas in the first place. I also plan to keep and breed domestic splendens, for the purposes of showing fish, but also to provide other hobbiest the chance to own some great fish they might not normally see in their LFS. In addition to bettas, I have plans for keeping and breeding a few specific species of killifish. I'm not into breeding for the money, but more for the experience (we get into this hobby to enjoy fish, but also to learn, and breeding is part of learning about your fish) and because I want to share my enthusiasm for the hobby with others. I feel that as long as you're in for the right reasons, and not just because everyone else is doing it, or you think its "cool", then more power to you, breed to your little heart's content.

 

[WILDER]

Well said mam as i don't like people who breed fish for money, same as pets.

 

[Synirr]

I think that you should really spend at least a year just looking after that particular species learning about them and how to care for them,doing alot of reserch the whole time.

I think this is absolutely one of the most important things a person can do when considering whether or not they should breed fish. Maybe it's just me, but I don't particularly like breeding for the sake of breeding... I like breeding for the love of the species! If you really love fishkeeping, are extremely familiar with the species you're planning to breed, and really understand what a drain on your time and wallet breeding can (and will) be, it can be a very, very rewarding experience. I owned bettas for years before having my first spawn several months ago, and I gotta say, I'm hooked. It just adds a new dimension to the hobby for me, and the sense of pride you get from seeing your little babies grow up into beautiful fish is fantastic.

I guess what I'm saying is that breeding, while it can be very rewarding, is something that you should do because you love the species and want to further it in the hobby, not something you should jump into just because you want to see little baby fish swimming around in your tank (as cute as they may be, hehe.) What you're going to do with all the little ones once they grow up is also important to consider. You either have to know for a fact that you can find homes for them quickly, or be willing to house them yourself until you do, for however long it may take.

Very good points Tokis, I wish more people would consider these things before jumping on the breeding bandwagon.

 

[The-Wolf]

I like my fish to spawn. I feel that is good for them to do what is natural.
Spawning fish is a good sign that the water conditions are ideal for that species.

Taking it the next stage and raising the fry, I have done several times with Zebra danios, Pearl danios, danio roseus and Moustached danios.
All have been given (not sold) to variouse lfs.

On the whole I'm just happy they spawn, except my kribs which keep eating the fry

 

[dwarfgourami]

I know what you mean; we seem to have had a lot of these threads lately.
Basically, breeding is like any other aspect of fishkeeping; it's about responsible planning. Having said that breeding can be a way of learning a lot about the fish.
I think a good piece of advice was wait and get to know your fish first. And try to avoid buying pregnant livebearers.
A lot of threads lately have read something like: "I am only just starting up, I know very little and have no money, but I want to breed in my tiny tank". Obviously not a good starting point. What one would like to hear is: "I have kept species X for some time now, and have decided I can afford to spend a little extra on learning about breeding; I have a plan for providing for the fry". Or alternatively: "I am just starting out and have little experience. Eventually, when I get more time/money/knowledge I would like to get them to breed, but I will give myself time to think and plan first".

 

[annka5]

People who have cats or dogs or whatever and breed them either because the babies are cute or, basically, becuase they feel like it are seen as being irresponsible. No different for fish.
If you don't know what to do with the offspring, you should do what you can to prevent your fish from breeding - e.g. not keep livebearers or whatever.
I've no problem with people who breed fish, for money or whatever, but I do have an issue with anyone who breeds anything with no realistic, properly planned out idea as to what they'll do with the offspring.