What Am I Doing Wrong?!

[ilovejack]

Alright everyone. So as soon as Jack was recovering from his very minor bout of fin rot, he decided to get worse. This morning he was looking just fine when I fed him. I came home from shopping and noticed about 1/3 of his tail was ragged. It looks terrible. If I could take a picture I would. All that's left in that part are the stringy like parts of the tail. I did a 100% water change yesterday so I could clean out anything stuck in the gravel. I started him on blood worms and they sank to the bottom because he didnt eat them. I wanted to get them out so they wouldnt contaminate the water. I think I might have put too much pH regulator in it when I did the change. Would that have any affect?

Here are the water stats as of like 10 minutes ago:
pH: 7.2ish
ammonia: 1
nitrate: 0-5
nitrite:.25-.5


I am in the process of a 40% water change with water I prepared, as usual, two days ago. How do I fix the ammonia? The normal level that we have here is about .25. I understand that it should be zero, but how do you fix that? The nitrate is normally 0, as well as the nitrite. pH is normally around 7.4-7.6. I dont know what made these numbers jump so much!!!If anyone can help please do so fast. This happened within a time of 3ish hours. I can't imagine what more time will do!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[sparky_555]

You reduce the ammonia just by changing the water, what size tank is Jack in?

 

[Taridan]

I don't know what to say about the PH regulator, as I don't use the stuff myself. on the water changes, , though if you did a 100% water change I'm not sure why your amonia would be up... do you use declorinizer or just let the water sit for two days? You could try adding some metafix or betafix, I'd have to look to see which one and I'm not home at the moment, but it says on the bottle. You could also add a pinch of aquarium salt and sunbath... I'm not sure what else you can do except keep his water clean, which it sounds like you're doing.

 

[ilovejack]

He's in a 2 gallon tank. I am testing my tap water right now, and the ammonia level is at 1. I can't do anything about that. I have no reason why our ammonia is that high, because we shouldnt have ANY in our water. Like I said, I am doing a partial change now. Should I change all the water or keep up with the partial changes???

I added aquarium salt in there when I did the change. I use the pH regulator becuse the pH of regular tap water here seems to be 8.8 or above (tested a minute ago). I conditioned the water before I added it, and I am doing a change with conditioned water that has been sitting for a couple days.

 

[Bloo]

I do not have knowledge of using chemicals such as pH regulators - because they can notoriously mess with your water and hence fish health and life
What is your pH without it ? Mine can be up to around 8.4 with absoltely no ill effects on the fish at all (including bettas when I kept them).

A stable slightly high pH is far better than lower unstable / fluctuating one.

What size is the tank ?
Does he share his tank with anything else ?
Is the tank filtered & heated ?

Edit: if it's only 2 gallons - do a 100% change to get rid of all nitrite and ammonia.

 

[ilovejack]

Answers to your questions:
pH is 8.8 or higher. The reading only goes to 8.8
he is alone
i have an under gravel filter-4cm thick gravel
no heater, but the temp has been in the 80s lately with out one


The ammonia levels are high in my tap water lately for no reason. It's at .5 right now.

 

[wodesorel]

Does your tap water have cloramine rather than clorine? That'll throw off your ammonia readings. It also threw off my pH readings as well - with Seachem Prime the pH reads at around 7.2. Straight from the tap it's somewhere around 9.5.

 

[ilovejack]

Does your tap water have cloramine rather than clorine? That'll throw off your ammonia readings. It also threw off my pH readings as well - with Seachem Prime the pH reads at around 7.2. Straight from the tap it's somewhere around 9.5.

I have a conditioner that takes out both chlorine and chloramine. I have no idea if the tap originally had the chloramine. If my conditioner removes it, will it still affect the pH and ammonia levels?

 

[Tiggle]

I have the same problem with my tap water, high pH and an ammonia reading of about 1ppm. If you have a large cycled tank i would transfer water from it into the betta bowel, or else there is a product called Prime by Seachem, whose lable reads: "Removes Chlorine, Chloramine, Ammonia, Detoxifies Nitrite and Nitrate, Provides slime coat." I only use the product when i have no other way of dealing with ammonia but it seems to help perk up ammonia affected fish.

Prehaps you could transfer your betta into a larger cycleable tank (which is where i now keep my bettas) so that you dont have to do water changes so often and the ammonia from the tap water is diluted and is delt with by the filter or maybe you could try running a cycled filter in your bucket of water you use for water changes, i have no idea if this would work or not, but if your doing water changes every few days there may be enough ammonia to keep the bacteria alive.

ive never had problems with my pH, but then all my fish are kept in cycled tanks, and while the taps pH is 8+ the tank pH rarely goes above 7.4.

 

[wodesorel]

The Seachem did the trick with my water. I tried three other conditioners and was having major problems not really with the ammonia, but with the buffering capacity of the water. Switched to Prime, and when I tested my water I went running through the house going WTF? I haven't had false positives for ammonia since I started using it either.

And I have to admit that the best thing about Prime is that you need two drops per gallon. Seriously, 0.1 mL per gallon! I can treat my 20 gallon tank with the same about I was using per gallon wit the other stuff.

 

[ilovejack]

Thanks so much for your opinions. Jack's tank is the only one I have, so there is no cycling of water. I will go see if there is some of that Seachem Prime at the store as soon as i can get there. I have a test in my class tomorrow night and i have to study. So maybe I can go as a break. I'll keep you all updated on how Jack is doing.

 

[ilovejack]

So I think I know why my ammonia levels are so high. I treated Jack with about 2 doses of tetracycline for what I thought was a bacterial infection. That is gone now, and I am guessing all bacteria in the tank is gone as well. I put Jack into his tank today after being in a vase(it had more room than those cups bettas are sold in) in order for my tank water to sit for a day, and so I could slowly introduce him to the new water. Will the benneficial bacteria come back if I do daily water changes???Tomorrow I am going to start doing 15% changes every day. Is this good or should I do bigger changes.

Stats as of this morning(water after 100% change and no fish):
Ammonia: .75-1ppm. Our tap water for some reason has this much ammonia in it already.
Nitrate:0 ppm
Nitrite:.25-.5ppm
pH: around 7.5ish

I just need to know if my plan is good or if I need to make some changes. Jack's tail is not getting worse, which is a good thing. It looks like it was ripped off as there is no discoloration at the end. It looks like chunks are missing. I have never noticed him nipping, and there isnt anything different in the tank that he could rip his tail on. I will be keeping a closer eye on him for the next few days or so to make sure things are fine.

Thanks,
-E

 

[Tiggle]

Tetracycline will kill your good bacteria and force you to re-cycle your tank. Yes your benifical bacteria will come back, slowly so your going to have to keep a close eye on your water stats to keep Jack comfortable.

Did you manage to get hold of any prime?

Have you got nitrite in your tap water? or is it only present in your tank?
if its not in your tap water your tank stats surgest your bacteria wasnt all gone since your ammonia level is lower then your tap water and youve got a nitrite reading. its just going to take some time to get them back up.

Nitrite is less toxic then ammonia, and ammonia is more toxic at high pH then at low pH, so your going to want to balance your water changes as 100% water changes with ammonia in your tap water is not going to work. 15% sounds a good percentage to start at. just check the chemestry every day or so and adjust as you need too.

once you get rid of the ammonia/nitrite problem youll probably fine jacks tail will grow back on its own. a small amount of aquarium salt and some bettafix may help the process along. For future notes, if the bacteria is only affecting his tail, try treating with bettafix/ weak melafix first as often this is enough to clear the infection without killing your good bacteria. if this doesnt work then hit the big guns.

Tig

 

[ilovejack]

Yes I do have nitrite in my tap water.

Here are the stats as of five minutes ago in the tank:
Ammonia: 1.0ppm
Nitrite: .5ppm
Nitrate: 0ppm
pH:7.8


I checked the petco website and they had the Prime there, but when I went to the actual store, I couldn't seem to find it. I bought some "Betta Bowl Essential" made by Kent Freshwater. I was forced to get this as I was not the one buying it and it was the cheapest stuff that neutralized ammonia, chlorine and chloramine. The reason I didnt want to buy it online was that the shipping cost more than the Prime. I did find another product that looked as though it did the same thing as Prime, but I cannot recall the name of it. If the Kent works, I will go back and get that, or look for Prime again.

It looks as though Jack's tail is growing back. Of course, I may have made it worse in my mind when I first saw it, but I really do think it's getting better.

I have some Betta Fix from last time Jack's tail was bad. Should I add that now or wait until my tank is cycled?

Thanks a bunch for your help!!!

-E

 

[wodesorel]

Is BettaFix just teatree oil? I can't remember what the stuff is, sorry!

The clean water by itself should be enough to help. I myself won't add anything to the tank unless I absolutely have to. If you feel more comfortable adding something, then tea tree oil shouldn't affect the tank any while it's cycling. Stay away from anything with anti-biotics, though, because that'll just kill off the good bacteria before it even gets a chance to form.

IMO, I would suggest waiting until his fins are healed before you attempt to cycle it again. Cycling puts a lot of stress onto a fish, and if he's currently healing from fin rot, he may have a really rough time with it.

Good luck!