trouble in paradise?!?

[pica_nuttalli]

Please select the option that best describes your experience with the paradise fish.

I have a male paradise fish in my 60 gallon (4'x1'x2') and I love him. I've had no problems with him hurting any of the guppies or dwarf platies (except for eating itty-bitty fry). He also doesn't start any of the fights with Mr Krib. I think my paradise fish is a lovely, friendly, intelligent fish.

But I've heard a lot of other people recently report total failure on keeping the paradise fish in a community. Since the paradise fish is such a hardy, readily available and attractive fish, I'd hate to see it gain an unfair reputation as unsuited to community keeping. I'd also hate to continue making recommendations based on the exceptional behavior of a single fish.

Please elaborate on the size tank, level of planting, number of each gender paradise fish, tankmates, and perceived victims (if any). These are key variables to identifying what is an inappropriate tank for keeping a paradise fish. I'd really like to collect any and all details of your experiences with keeping the paradise fish. I'd also really like to read about why you originally decided to try keeping paradise fish.

Thanks! (Also, I've posted this in Chit-Chat so that I can get responses from the largest cross-section of members. Not many people swing through Gouramis unless they are actively involved in keeping anabantoids.)

 

[MegTheFish]

I've had my male paradise fish for approx. 2 years, he lived in my non-planted 10 gallon with a bunch of other small fish (I don't remember what they were, maybe platies for sure, oh and white skirted tetras). He attacked them from the beggining, and I finally moved him to his own 1 gallon tank when he killed one of the white skirts and left a platy eyeball-less. He lived in there for awhile but a few months ago I moved him back to the DIVIDED 10 gallon, he now has about 3 gallons of the tank.
I wanted him because when I saw the paradise fish in my lfs I thought they were so cool...was told they would get along with my current fish, but that didn't work out too well! He's about 1.5-2", hasn't grown much. So I think I'd keep them solitary from now on.

 

[rdd1952]

I've never had them before but they really are beautiful fish. Can they be kept in a tank together (not with other fish) or are they like bettas that muct be seperated? I would love to have a small 10 gallon with a pair (or maybe 3) in it. Ithink they only get to about 4".

 

[Weaver]

Ive never kept a paradise fish because of their reputation even though there is a lovely one for sale at the lfs and Ive been really tempted.Therefore I will be keeping a really close eye on this thread--and an even closer one when my first pair of glasses arrive this Friday!!! B)

 

[IMCL85]

Anti paradise mess my tank up like hell.

 

[OohFeeshy]

I wouldn't mind one in a tank on its own.

 

[pica_nuttalli]

Anti paradise mess my tank up like hell.

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could you please tell of your exact experience (tankmates, tank size, number & gender of paradise fish involved)? these parameters are very important for determining whether its the fish being overly agressive or you keeping it improperly. there's a big difference between one paradise terrorizing a 100 gallon tank and a breeding pair killing off female bettas in a 5 gallon.

I've never had them before but they really are beautiful fish. Can they be kept in a tank together (not with other fish) or are they like bettas that muct be seperated? I would love to have a small 10 gallon with a pair (or maybe 3) in it. Ithink they only get to about 4".

As far as I know, paradise fish are very similar to bettas in temperament but are much less likely to confuse body-shapes and much larger. the profile says that you need a 20g minimum tank, which is probably due to the territorial nature of the fish. a 10g should be suited to a single individual, but a 20g might be used as a community. *shrug* the fact that i don't really know how to answer that question is why i wanted to post this poll.

 

[Briarmoor]

My female is in a 10g divided (see sig line). The LFS guy said she would not get along with other fish despite being in the tank at the store with juvenile males. I had her alone in the 10g, but she seemed bored and stayed on the bottom a lot unless I was feeding her.

I got a tank divider to be safe, but first tried floating a giant (fasciata not real giant) gourami in her bag to acclimate her without the divider in. The female Paradisefish flared and swam around and around the bag, very aggressively. The Giant was freaking out and trying to get away, banging around inside the bag, so I quickly moved her bag to the 55g to float.

So then I split the tank and added (temporary) the Giant to the other side. The Paradisefish still charged the divider and flared at first, but quickly settled down. Now she only goes over when she sees the Giant doing something, but is not nasty about it. Still, I would not trust her at all without the divider. She will not be going in my community tanks for sure.

The Giant swims back and forth a lot at the front, so I don't think she is happy. She goes over by the divider like she is not scared of the Paradisefish now, but maybe she wants other gouramis. I will move her to either the 55g or to the 20g when the Gold moves. Then I will add a Beta to the other side of the 10g because although she is territorial, I think the Paradisefish likes to see other fish doing things.

One other thing to note, the Pardisefish does some weird stuff like sleeping on the java moss on her decoration, laying on the gravel on her stomach, things that might make someone think a normal fish was sick. But she just likes doing this.

She is quite pushy about taking flakes and will really nab fingers. I don't think it is meaness, just she wants the food real bad. She will come out of the water, head and part of her body for food, if you try holding your finger out of the water to keep her from nabbing you. She also cuts her eyes and watches you which is kind of cute. She comes right over to the front of the tank as soon as she sees people, seems intelligent. This is my only experience with one of these fish.

 

[gwlee7]

I had a male in my 30 gallon long and he was gorgeous but mean. He picked on all of my fish: platies, pristellas, harlequins, and especially my cories. He pecked at and hit them relentlessly. So, I decided to move him to my 29 gallon that had tiger barbs in it. That was an even worse mistake. The tigers immediately pinned him down in a corner and nipped him terribly. So, I put him in a "hospital" 10 gallon by himself but that is not enough room for him so, I took his very gorgeous but mean self back to the LFS.

They are beuatiful fish and pica, I love that picture you posted in the index. But, if I ever get another one , it will be in something like a 20 long for just him and maybe a girlfriend.

 

[sylvia]

I'm going to vote 'other' because I've had mixed experiences.

The only certain thing with this species is that each fish is an individual. Predicting their behaviour is difficult. Like others have said, they are like bettas in this sense as well as in a lot of their behaviour.

Like with bettas, I've never found mature males who will live together peacefuly. However, most will do fine if mixed with females provided the tank is big enough (30 gallons or more). I have had pairs live peacefuly in a 20 gallon but I've also had males who can only co-exist with other paradisefish if there are at least 3 females and plenty of gallonage for each individual fish. In general, females do ok together but they can still be aggressive. Like female bettas, when you keep just 2, one picks on the other. Still, if the tank is large enough and the hiding places plentiful, I've had plenty get along in two's. I'd personaly go for 4 or more if you want to go for a female-only set-up and keep them in a heavily planted tank of at least 20-30 gallons depending on the exact number, tankmates and set-up.

As for how they do with other species; I'll never mix them with smaller gouramies again. Sometimes they'll do ok with three-spots or some of the larger gouramies that can handle themselves but, for the males at least, I'd stick to non-gourami tankmates.

Non-gourami tankmates are a different matter. Most semi-aggressive fish are fine but nothing too big or nippy as the paradisefish is big in character but only small in size and the long fins can make it prone to being nipped by fish like tiger barbs. I've kept them with things like sharks, medium-sized barbs, larger rasboras, certain danios, fast-moving tetras, cories, plecos, dwarf cichlids, swordtails and other active livebearers, loaches etc. Of course, very small tetras like neons or vulnerable fish like hatchets or guppies don't usualy make good tankmates. A single female will usualy work even with very peaceful fish though. I would never risk mixing them with a sexualy mature, highly territorial male though. Also, any mixed groups that may go into 'breeding mode' are a danger to their tankmates.

Having said that, sometimes aggression in a species-only tank can be reduced by adding another species just like cichlid owners do when they introduce fast-moving giant danios or rosy barbs as target fish. It all depends on the individual fish in the end though and on the environment they are living in.

It always helps to plant the tank heavily, provide plenty of floating plants, tall rooted plants, lower fine-leaved plants, caves etc to offer retreats both to tankmates and other paradisefish. I also preffer to have a strong current in the tank to discourage breeding and a not-too-high temp for similar reasons.

Oh and you asked why I first decided to get a paradisefish. Well, originaly, I was looking for an especialy hardy fish that would be ok in an aquarium with no filter or heater. As I love gouramies, this seemed the obvious choice. At first, it was only these qualities that attracted me to them but then I actualy saw some and was struck by how beautiful they actualy are. The particular one I ended up with was a male from a blue strain and he lived in a heavily planted 10 gallon until I decided to try breeding him and moved him to a 20 with a (wild color) female and converted the 10 to a breeding tank for them. There were some cories and a trio of cherry barbs in with them as well which they got along with fine. I eventualy had to devide the 20 gallon as he was too aggressive for her but I did get them to breed and raised some fry. The paradisefish' tankmates (cherry barbs and cories) were also confined to the females side as, in the smaller space, the male picked on the cories and (when I switched them around) later on the cherry barbs. I now enjoy this fish' character more than anything else. They aren't just beautiful and practical. They also recognise you, can be hand fed, have individual characters and are just over-all a very interesting fish to keep.

I've since kept others both with these two in a larger tank and seperately but, like I said, my experience was different with the addition of every new fish. Regardless of how unpredictable they can be, these are surely one of the hardiest labyrinths you can own so I deffinately reccomend them and they are beautiful and individual enough to please most people and not so large that they are impossible for your typical fish-keeper to accomodate. Just watch what you put them with and they'll be extremely rewarding.