Tiger Shovel Nose---lateral Line Disease

[edvedr]

hi guys i need your help in gettin rid of the lateral line disease in my tiger shovel nose. at first i wasn't sure if it was just sensory pits but now its hittin the lateral line pretty good so i'm sure its it. i have had him only a few weeks, he is about 5 inches. i house him in a 75 gallon with a arowana (7 inches) and a royal pleco (5 inches. the tank itself is only about 5 months old. filtration is a whisper turbo 500 and a magnum 350 canister. ammonia is 0, nitrites are 0, and nitrates are 10-15ppm. i do a 15 gallon water change once per week. the fact that i feed these guys nothing but feeders is the cause i'm sure, stupid i know. i need to get them on a better diet. does anyone have any experience gettin carnivorous fish off of feeders onto frozen foods. the arowana i'm sure will be somewhat easy, but i nevered had a tiger shovel nose before, anyone accomplish this with one? i also realize i need to get him extra vitamins, what do you guys suggest i do to do this? should i remove the carbon from my filters? once it gets better will those nasty little pits go away, or its like hole on the head where they are pretty much skarred. thanks for your help, i hate when my fish get sick.

also yes i realize the 75 gallon will only hold them for so long, and yes i will be prepared for whatever size tank they need. next step up will be 200-250.

 

[edvedr]

oh and ph is 7.0

 

[WILDER]

Stop feeding your fish feeder fish as they can be deseased.
No the writer of this information below.
Head & Lateral Line Erosion



Symptoms:

This disease is marked by open pitted wounds around a fish's head and along the lateral line, as if something is slowly eroding away the flesh. It is very similar to the freshwater disease Hole-In-The-Head. Head & Lateral Line Erosion (HLLE) is not fatal in the short run, but if the disease continues to progress, the fish will stop eating and become lethargic. Furthermore, the open wounds caused by HLLE make the fish susceptible to other infections which in turn leads to the further deterioration of its health. These secondary infections are usually the cause of death.



Cause:

Unknown cause, although it is thought that there may be several contributing causes including stray voltage in the aquarium, poor water quality and environmental conditions, high nitrate levels, lack of vitamins and poor nutrition, stress, parasitic infestation (the protozoan Octomita necatrix), or using carbon. Some fish, like Tangs and Surgeonfish, seem to be genetically predisposed to this disease.

The lateral line aids fish in detecting small microvoltages emmited by prey or predators during muscle contraction. The induced voltages from any submerged coil device such as a powerhead, heater, and pump can all add voltage to the tank. This stray voltage can irritate a fish's lateral line if it's constantly stimulating it and eventually lead to erosion of the skin overlying this structure.



Treatment:

Medications do not seem to do much for this disease, although the use of medicated food is recommended to prevent bacterial secondary infections. The best intervention, however, seems to be improving the water quality and supplementing the fish's diet with vitamins, particularly vitamins A, B, D, and E as well as iodine. This can be done several ways. Food can be soaked in water with a drop of liquid multivitamins, such as Selcon or Zoe. Alternatively, fish could be fed fresh or frozen vegetables, such as broccoli, zuchinni, and peas.

The importance of good regular aquarium maintenance cannot be stressed enough. Eliminate any stress-inducing factors. It might also be a good idea to add a grounding probe to the aquarium if you suspect that there may be stray voltage in the aquarium.

 

[edvedr]

thank you, i am aware of the feeders being the problem, like i said in my post, did u read it? i was hopin for someone who has gone thru what i said in my post. thanks for the article, i have read plenty, again lookin for someone with first hand experience.

 

[tttnjfttt]

I don't have personal experience with this exact problem, as none of my fish are big enough for feeder fish, but this trick may work for you. Start by draging your finger tip across the water so the he is starting to hunt it. Then when he is close, drop the food in, so he is still catching it as it is moving. I know this can work for stubborn bettas who are sick and refuse to eat, so it might just work.

 

[edvedr]

I don't have personal experience with this exact problem, as none of my fish are big enough for feeder fish, but this trick may work for you. Start by draging your finger tip across the water so the he is starting to hunt it. Then when he is close, drop the food in, so he is still catching it as it is moving. I know this can work for stubborn bettas who are sick and refuse to eat, so it might just work.

thanks for the tip, something along those lines will work on the arowana. the TSN is a little more tricky. when i have brought other fish off of feeders in the past my first step would be dead feeders. ya know to try and get them away from the hunt but still have the same food. the arowana has been taken them on some days others he hasn't, stubborn little guy. but if he is hungry enough he waits at the top of the tank for me and pounces on what i throw in the tank, so him i know i can do it with. he was however the first fish in the tank, been in there for a few months and thru a couple of problems. so he is use to me and my shadow near the tank, doesn't get spooked. the TSN feeding habits are a little different. in order to trigger a feeding response for him the food has to enter his little area, within reach of his whiskers, then he attacks. he is still a baby and newer to the tank and gets spooked when i move to fast or put my hands in the tank on his side. once he gets spooked he stresses a bit and won't eat for a few minutes till he calms down. the minutes seem to be gettin longer each time. so as i'm gettin him use to me gettin my hand closer and closer so i can drop food in his trigger area i wanna make sure i'm using food he will like. so i was hoping someone is familar with these guys and what they like and don't like to eat. i don't wanna do the dead feaders with him since he has LLD and i gotta get him some vitamins fast. also lookin for someone who has been able to rid a fish of LLD. one i'm curious about the skarring and two the carbon. i've read many conflicting articles on what role carbon plays in the diease. seems like the carbon dust can cause or aggrivate it. i do rinse my carbon first, but of course i'm nervous maybe i didn't do it enough. so if anyone did rid their fish of LLD i was curious if they removed the caron or not.

 

[tttnjfttt]

honestly i haven't seen many posts in here about LLD, so i don't know how much help you can get from people who have been there in the emergency section. Have you tried posting in the species section? You may have some more luck there. I know i've heard of people usuing liquid vitimins and soaking food in that to help with HITH.

Also, you don't need to keep carbon in your filter. I only add it when i need to remove meds, so most of the time i go without it.

 

[CFC]

Tiger shovelnoses will scavenge pieces of fish and other aquatic meaty foods like mussels and clam meat when they get hungry, its part of the natural behaviour in the wild so replicating it in the aquarium isnt hard. Just dont feed the fish for a week and then start trying them with the frozen foods until they eat them, it usually only takes a few days of being offered for them to take the hint.

 

[edvedr]

Tiger shovelnoses will scavenge pieces of fish and other aquatic meaty foods like mussels and clam meat when they get hungry, its part of the natural behaviour in the wild so replicating it in the aquarium isnt hard. Just dont feed the fish for a week and then start trying them with the frozen foods until they eat them, it usually only takes a few days of being offered for them to take the hint.

thanks CFC. i actually had some success last night with some silver sides. i took a clear plastic tube and speared the silver side. then when the lights were off i came in for the opposite side of the tank and put it in front of him, he pounced on it. ate 2. which i did soak in vitamins first. so you are sayin i don't need to really be so anal about puttin the food in front of him? just leave them there and he will seek it out?

 

[CFC]

Putting the food somewhere near insures that the TSN will find the food and it wont become lodged under decor where it can rot and pollute the tank but you dont have to litterally put it in its mouth.