This Is Horrid! Look!

[fenwoman]

I am a big rat fan and have 2 ratty boys which I adore. However, wild rats are vile. They kill baby birds in the nest, are perfectly capable of catching and killing a bird on the feeder, they carry leptospirosos which is very dangerous to animals and children. They pee as they walk and spread the lepto everywhere they go. You cannot trap and release it somewhere else as the somewhere else will be another rat populations territory and it will get attacked and die slowly if it manages to escape. Get the council to come out and bait your garden. They do it for free. You have seen one rat, but there will be at least 20 more around. Each female will breed every 8 weeks, each female she prodices, will start to breed at 12 weeks old .You simply cannot be sentimental about killing wild rats.
Being a poultry keeper I have to have permanent bait boxes on my land. They chew their way into poultry houses, kill bantams and one even chewed its way into the aviary shed where I kep my pet barn ow and attacked her, blinding her and causing brain damage. Wild rats are poisoned here, while Roger and Bodger get petted and handles and fed the best of everything. You won't keep the rats down with a humane trap but you will cause the rat immense stress and suffering by releasing him onto another rats territory and may also remove a nursing mother rat and leave her babies to starve to death. You could make it so it cannot get to the feeder by suspending the feeder with string further away from the main tree trunk and making a cone lid to hang above it.
Here is one of mine.

 

[t.ropical_m.istx3]

aww cute picture. good quality too. as it has been said, with one, there will probably be alot more around.

 

[gsta13]

not the best news but he does look good
Greg

 

[kev350d]

fenwoman has just answered your dilema, being a fellow animal lover she has stressed how important it is to keep a balance (she keeps rats as pets so obviously likes them) but unlike some on here who jumped down your throat gave you a warrented reply.

Rats as well as feral pigeons, magpies and grey squirrels all look fluffy / (feathered) and cute but once out of control play havoc on their surroundings and need to be culled and if everyone took the same approach as some of the members i'd hate to see the state of the wildlife in our neighbourhoods.

Due to a huge influx of grey's and magpies in our nearby parks we have seen just about all the finch/linnet population depleated.

As for WILD rats you certainly dont want them around your kids play area, the brown rat can be lethal when in indirect contact with young children as toys and other items (sand pits etc) are often left in our home gardens and kids being kids dont always wash right after handling something "well mine dont".


I really feel alot of folk on here just dont understand why certain animals are labled vermin (pest) and stop tripping when someone wishes to try and eliminate them from their immediate area.

 

[k.o.d]

Kev

Some of us do understand why some animals are labelled as vermin, we live on a farm, rats and other vermin that some of you may not even see as vermin ( weasels and stoats ) abound here. Have you ever tried pest control measures to stop them coming into the garden when there are acres and acres of farmland around? I will not put poison out as we have cats to help with the rat population, it is a fairly natural way for limited population control

What i was trying to put across was, if you put out food, expect what you don't want as well as what you had hoped for.

I have less time for stoats and weasels than rats, they are horrible things and will quite happily attack cats if hungry enough.

To be honest though Kevin, rats WILL have been in your garden even if you live in the middle of town, it is a fact of life.

 

[Mr.September15]

If you get a cat, you could just be giving the cat a free meal. That's the problem that fixed our rat problem, we got one cat and they were getting free meals each week. Except they just attacked and started playing with there dead bodies. Then sometimes they bring it in to the house to show off there kill

 

[newtankgirl]

Hi
Do you mind squirrels? Squirrels are rats - they just have fluffy tails and better PR! Also pigeons? rats with wings?
Hey only joking with you - can see it may freak you when looking for feathered friends you see mickey mouse at your feeder..

 

[julibob]

I have been watching your replies with interest, and can see all sides. As I said before, I am a vegetarian who loves all animals, especially small furries, but when I have 2 small children I cannot run the risk of having rats in the garden whilst they are out there playing. I feed the birds because we have starlings and sparrows in our garden which are endangered. I clean up any spilled food every day, and I am very careful about it! I have a culvert at the bottom of the garden behind the fence, and beyond that the railway, so there will always be rats there, but in 4 years of living here and always feeding the birds, I have never had them set up camp in the garden before.

Although I have rabbits and guinea pigs, I am actually allergic to cats, so that form of pest control would never be an option.

Due to all the debate it has caused I will not be divulging information on how I am dealing with the problem, but appreciate all your replies.

Julia

 

[fenwoman]

Kev

Some of us do understand why some animals are labelled as vermin, we live on a farm, rats and other vermin that some of you may not even see as vermin ( weasels and stoats ) abound here. Have you ever tried pest control measures to stop them coming into the garden when there are acres and acres of farmland around? I will not put poison out as we have cats to help with the rat population, it is a fairly natural way for limited population control

What i was trying to put across was, if you put out food, expect what you don't want as well as what you had hoped for.

I have less time for stoats and weasels than rats, they are horrible things and will quite happily attack cats if hungry enough.

To be honest though Kevin, rats WILL have been in your garden even if you live in the middle of town, it is a fact of life.

I have 10 cats who control the rats but not efficiently enough. I live in the fens and breed poultry. Ergo I have rats. There is no secondary poisoning from the bait I use. Also a poisoned rat will go into the nest to die, cats cannot get them then. Also , cats will not catch obviously sick prey, so they avoid poisoned rats even if they did find one in the open which is very rare as the natural instinct for any sick animal is to get to its nest.
When I didn't use poison, I still had 10 cats, and the rat problem was so massive they were damaging buildings and killing my livestock. Cats are an inefficient way to control rats.

 

[fenwoman]

Hi
Do you mind squirrels? Squirrels are rats - they just have fluffy tails and better PR! Also pigeons? rats with wings?
Hey only joking with you - can see it may freak you when looking for feathered friends you see mickey mouse at your feeder..

Squirrels are NOT rats. The rat is of the species rattus rattus, the squirrel is Sciurus vulgaris completely different species. However, both are rodents. That refers to the teeth, not the species.
A pest is not a particular species, but a species which is causing a problem in a particular area. Rats, foxes, stoats, weasels are a pest to me. Wood pigeons are not as I don't have a problem with them, nor do I have a problem with squirrels here.Lots of poultry keepers consider magpies and crows a pest. I like both species and since they don't cause me a problem, I don't consider them to be a pest.

 

[fenwoman]

I have been watching your replies with interest, and can see all sides. As I said before, I am a vegetarian who loves all animals, especially small furries, but when I have 2 small children I cannot run the risk of having rats in the garden whilst they are out there playing. I feed the birds because we have starlings and sparrows in our garden which are endangered. I clean up any spilled food every day, and I am very careful about it! I have a culvert at the bottom of the garden behind the fence, and beyond that the railway, so there will always be rats there, but in 4 years of living here and always feeding the birds, I have never had them set up camp in the garden before.

Although I have rabbits and guinea pigs, I am actually allergic to cats, so that form of pest control would never be an option.

Due to all the debate it has caused I will not be divulging information on how I am dealing with the problem, but appreciate all your replies.

Julia

Julie debate is good. It shows people the options. Being a vegetarian is your choice. However your choice of diet should not affect your common sense in dealing with a danger to your children. If you refuse to poison, do you also refuse to give your children medications which have been tested on animals? Do you refuse to drink milk? Thousands of cows have to be put in calf to produce milk. Baby bull calves are often killed before they are a day old as they have no value. Calves are immediately seperated from the cow who cries for them for days. That's the milk industry. You are already part of the food chain using animals which are lower.
I could go on but I won't. There is a balance in life. We have to be sensible about maintaining that balance.
My son is a vegetarian and I understand and respect his reasons. However, he understands that I have to protect my animals and put down rat bait. Honestly, I think that the reason a lot of the veggie/vegan movement get such flak, is because they seem to be overly sentimental with no compassion. They would rather live trap a rat and move it away, regardless of the fact that the rat will them be attacked by the rats in the area which he has been moved to.Rat bites are terrible and if not killed immediately, the rat will die a horribly painful slow death from infected deep puncture wounds. I'm not getting at you, honestly, just pointing out that if someone said "oh no, I could not take a life" but then did something which caused far worse suffering, I would consider them not only a fool, but a cruel irresponsible one too.
Now I am not directing this at you because I don't know which road you have chosen.
If the culvert is on railway land, contact them too as it is likely that the rats actually live there and come into your garden to feed, while going back to breed.
There is no short term solution to rats I'm afraid. You may get rid of the one you saw, but you simply create empty territory for a new lot to move into. You will always have rats on your land. You can choose to leave them, or to start a programme of elimination by whatever means you choose, to keep the numbers down to a safe level. Rats are as erious health risk and case plenty of damage with their chewing and gnawing. If they get into your home or outbuildings it's a headache. Do you have a garden shed? They may be nesting under there too.
As I said before, I like rats, adore my 2 pet ones. I admire the species for being such good survivors and so intelligent and adaptable. When the human race dies out, rats will still be around.However, I have seen first hand, the carnage, sickness and damage they cause. If they have peed on the seeds you put out for the birds, you may be interested to know that those protected species sparrows, will likely die too and those same rats will raid nests and steal eggs and kill aby birds to eat.
Understand the species, admire the species, then take whatever steps you feel you can to control the species.
I wish you luck

 

[k.o.d]

I have 10 cats who control the rats but not efficiently enough. I live in the fens and breed poultry. Ergo I have rats. There is no secondary poisoning from the bait I use. Also a poisoned rat will go into the nest to die, cats cannot get them then. Also , cats will not catch obviously sick prey, so they avoid poisoned rats even if they did find one in the open which is very rare as the natural instinct for any sick animal is to get to its nest.
When I didn't use poison, I still had 10 cats, and the rat problem was so massive they were damaging buildings and killing my livestock. Cats are an inefficient way to control rats.

As you have stated, you have livestock that will attract such pests, which is why your rats problem is so massive, a few peanuts from bird feeders will not have the same attractant power as poultry and the accompanying foods that go with them
The pig farm down the road has the same problem as you, the rats there are massive.

We have 6 Maine Coons, which are efficient hunters for what we require of them, we don't poison them as we have no need, so the hide and die syndrome isnt there either, for our needs and for most peoples who do not have the same conditions as you cats will usually suffice.

 

[fenwoman]

I have 10 cats who control the rats but not efficiently enough. I live in the fens and breed poultry. Ergo I have rats. There is no secondary poisoning from the bait I use. Also a poisoned rat will go into the nest to die, cats cannot get them then. Also , cats will not catch obviously sick prey, so they avoid poisoned rats even if they did find one in the open which is very rare as the natural instinct for any sick animal is to get to its nest.
When I didn't use poison, I still had 10 cats, and the rat problem was so massive they were damaging buildings and killing my livestock. Cats are an inefficient way to control rats.

As you have stated, you have livestock that will attract such pests, which is why your rats problem is so massive, a few peanuts from bird feeders will not have the same attractant power as poultry and the accompanying foods that go with them
The pig farm down the road has the same problem as you, the rats there are massive.

We have 6 Maine Coons, which are efficient hunters for what we require of them, we don't poison them as we have no need, so the hide and die syndrome isnt there either, for our needs and for most peoples who do not have the same conditions as you cats will usually suffice.

Actually there is no feed scattered around here. That is plain bad husbandry. All feeders are rat proof and in the poultry houses.Nothing is chucked on the ground and the feed is stored in a metal shed.Livestock by itself does not attract rats, spilled food does. The rats come onto my land from next door where they nest safely and get plenty to eat off their bird feeders, bits of sandwich, sweets etc dropped by the children. However, they smell my animals, they smell the food and eggs etc and come under the fence to investigate. I feed them with rat bait. I never find bodies because they go back next door to die.
My neighbours have more rats living on their land and they have no livestock, but they chuck bread on the lawn for the birds and the kids drop foodstuff.
Rats are always around, town or country, livestock or no livestock. My cats catch at least one rat per day so they are hunting, but the rats breed faster than they kill them.
nobod can be complacant about wild rats. See here:
rat diseases

a single pair of rats has the potential of producing 359 million descendents in just three year’s time!!

 

[demonmagus]

Hi
Do you mind squirrels? Squirrels are rats - they just have fluffy tails and better PR! Also pigeons? rats with wings?
Hey only joking with you - can see it may freak you when looking for feathered friends you see mickey mouse at your feeder..

Squirrels are NOT rats. The rat is of the species rattus rattus, the squirrel is Sciurus vulgaris completely different species. However, both are rodents. That refers to the teeth, not the species.
A pest is not a particular species, but a species which is causing a problem in a particular area. Rats, foxes, stoats, weasels are a pest to me. Wood pigeons are not as I don't have a problem with them, nor do I have a problem with squirrels here.Lots of poultry keepers consider magpies and crows a pest. I like both species and since they don't cause me a problem, I don't consider them to be a pest.

uuum just thought I'd say he probably meant they look like rats and can be annoying like rats, not that they actually are rats

 

[Neo8223]

sorry fenwoman, laying down rat poison is hardly a humane way of killing rats. Its exactly like using the trap method. The pain of having poison ouzing through their bodies, probably spasiming hard enough to break their own backs in a slow and highly painful death. its hardly a nice way to die. (although i dont condem using them... i got them in my loft)

but sacrifices must be made for the greater good, so culling is necessary. You cant let disease infested rats running around your garden, urinating every second on their path, for your kid to put down their lollypop on the ground and then pick it up and lick it again. Rats started the great plague that killed thousands or millions even. They might be cute but if you get bitten you and get rabies you wont think they are so cute now, would you.

Personally, i'd just shoot them. Get a scoped (sniper) air rifle and aim for the head. Instant death. I shoot squirells as their numbers got out of hand and i make sure they are dead within a blink of an eye. However, they are tough lil creatures and i wouldnt recomend it if you are a louzy shot. It bounces off their stomache! I dont particularly enjoy killing them and i dont say "hell yea" and start jumping for joy. I rrun towards it and shoot again at point blank range to make damn well sure that its out of its misery. I just leave it at the back of my garden for a fox to take it, so nature takes its call. (and they dont eat the bullet as its goes in 1 side of its head and out of the other incase someone wanted to accuse me of poisioning the fox population ) If you are to use this method though, make sure its a powerful air rifle, my dad used an air gun once and let off 15 rounds (1 magazine) into it and assumed it was dead. 1 hour later i came out to shift it and it was still alive


Final thoughts:
Who would think that such a cute fluffy animal would have caused so much mayhem lol.
And why oh why do sooo many vegetarians wear leather jackets! insane lol!