Tetra SafeStart and Purigen

[julielynn47]

I used this for my 10 gallon and it seemed to work pretty good. I tried this with my 75 and although it does appear to be working, it is not working as well.

I think it might be because I have Seacheam Purigen in my filter. I really like the Purigen because it does seem to clean the water pretty well. I know some people say it will effect the biological filtration while others say it won't. It seems to me like it does affect it somewhat.

I put ammonia in the tank a couple of days ago. I put the SafeStart in the tank last night. I wanted to see if the SafeStart would eat up the ammonia and the beneficial bacteria would indeed be in place for fish. I had the ammonia level at 1ppm and poured in the SafeStart. That was late yesterday afternoon. Now, almost 24 hours later, the ammonia is at .50. I know that it appears to be working, BUT...if I had just added the SafeStart and put some fish producing ammonia in there I would doing water changes right now.

Has anyone else had this happen?

So I am wondering if indeed the Purigen did somehow inhibit the bacteria from colonizing? It seems that it did. I really expected to see no ammonia today. I am going to give it until tomorrow and see if the ammonia is gone. If not, I will add another bottle of the SafeStart and take the Purigen out before I do.

I was going to add fish this weekend, but I can't do that until next weekend, so I have time to figure this out. I know I could cycle the old fashioned way, that is the fishless way that takes forever, not the fish in, but I really do not want to do that. I just don't want to wait another 2 months while the tank cycles that way. I seeded the 10 gallon from my 55 gallon and that did help any IMO, or if it did it sure wasn't much. That is why I got the SafeStart for it.

 

[AbbeysDad]

Purigen is merely a resin with an affinity to attract organic compounds. I've used it in the past, but frankly feel you can do just as well polishing the water with inexpensive polyester filter fiber (You'll find big bags at WM for about $4.00)! Purigen would not impact beneficial biology in any way.
The claim is that by 'trapping' nitrogenous waste, ammonia will be reduced, thereby ultimately reducing nitrates. I tend to think that by the time the organic material has decomposed to the level captured by Purigen, it's already done the evil deed. (Note: As mentioned, I used it for an extensive period and never found it to reduce tank nitrates!)

Most of the chemicals that neutralize chlorine and claim to detoxify ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, and heavy metals typically only do so temporarily (as in 24-48 hours). This does allow the beneficial biology time to process any new ammonia introduced in the system. However, there is no chemical I'm aware of that actually removes ammonia. The best I've seen, may convert ammonia to ammonium, which is not toxic to fish, but will still register as ammonia in standard test kits.

Now Safestart is a bacteria in a bottle product, but the bacteria contained is in a dormant, kind of suspended animation. As such, it takes some time for them to come back to life and begin building a colony.

 

[julielynn47]

Today it is down to .25 so the bacteria are working, but I guess just not as fast as I thought they would. The pour it in and add fish concept I am not so sure about. Maybe the Purigen does not affect it, but the bacteria are taking their time. But then again, this is still a lot faster than without the SafeStart

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Today it is down to .25 so the bacteria are working, but I guess just not as fast as I thought they would. The pour it in and add fish concept I am not so sure about. Maybe the Purigen does not affect it, but the bacteria are taking their time. But then again, this is still a lot faster than without the SafeStart

The reason they aren't working as fast, is that the amount of ammonia is MUCH higher. You did this same treatment with a 10 gallon tank, you said, right?

Well, you had to add 7.5 times the ammonia, but still added the same amount of safestart, right? So, adding the same amount of bacteria, but nearly 8 times the ammonia will take longer. its the same concentration, but in a larger tank, there's just more of it.

If this had been a 'fish-in' set-up, you would have had likely less ammonia produced (by concentration) in the tank... starting with a few fish, as they recommend.

The key is... patience, as it always is with a cycle.

 

[julielynn47]

That makes sense, and is probably the reason it is taking longer. But no, I didn't use the same amount of SafeStart. The ammonia was about the same in the 10 but I used less SafeStart. I used the the larger bottle of SafeStart that says it treats 500 gallons of water. So I just figured a whole bottle in a 75 gallon tank would work really fast. But I guess it does still just take time.

I have been thinking about the Purigen being a resin and nothing more. When you think about the Purigen that way, then it does not make sense that it would effect the beneficial bacteria at all. I did purchase some of the polyfil the other day at WalMart. It is a bit more than 4.00 here, but I probably got the larger bag of it. It was still only 7 something and that is wayyyy less than the ready cut filter floss. So I happy I learned about that.

Also, this Purigen is really good at cleaning the water. I recharged the bag I have in the 75 gallon and within a week it went from white to brown. But the water is crystal clear. It is just amazing to me how much "stuff" is in the water that you can't even see. And this is in a tank that still has no fish.

Well, it is extremely obvious that I for one am still learning! Hey, that is what I came to this forum for, so I am good with that.

 

[AbbeysDad]

Eaglesaquarium brings up a good point. In addition to being toxic to fish, ammonia (in higher concentrations) is also toxic to the very beneficial bacteria we need to process it into nitrite and then nitrate.
When we consider these bacteria in a bottle products, we have to be patient for them to develop a sufficient colony, but we need to go easy on any added ammonia as this can upset the balance. The fact is that a few fish in a fair to mid size body of water will produce only aa very small amount of ammonia.
When we're doing a fishless cycle with store bought ammonia, we might go easy on the dose. (Something more to ponder).

 

[julielynn47]

Yes, something to ponder on....

In my 55, when I set it up all those years ago, I had several fish and they had no problem creating enough ammonia that I was changing the water 3 times a day towards the end of the cycle. I may well have been overstocked, I don't know, but they created way more than 1pp . I knew nothing about cycling and had never heard of a fishless cycle. Heck, I had never heard of cycling period.

 

[flchamp89]

Purigen is most definitely not an issue.

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