Tech Corner

[MaloK]

I don't think M$ can do that... But I could remain on Win10 for the next 15-20 years without hassle.

EOL does not mean stop working... W10 might just be that new W7 that will last a long time.

M$ game playing and years of wasted development. have lead them to one of the least appreciated yet forcefully pushed complete aberation of an operating system.

Great way to go... The numbers proves it, they are losing speed and market.

I will never be able to leave Windows but Linux has always been something very useful.

But lately I see it is very easy to install top notch desktops on pure server editions that can be switched on... On demand with remote GPU acceleration, And none of these software had any "limitations" in operating behaviors and blown up large 3d models on 2 gig video card in real time.

But still... I would need a windows somewhere to do something.

 

[jaylach]

Latest attempt to do Win 11 again failed.

I wonder if it could be that I'm attempting to install on my clone M.2 drive instead of system. The reason I wonder this is that my clone drive is mounted on a pass through adapter plugged in my second PCIe slot as the drive is gen 4 and will not work in my second M.2 slot as it is gen 2. Since I can boot to win 10 from either the normal system drive or the clone I guess the next step will be to try the upgrade on the system drive plugged in an actual gen 3 M.2 slot instead of the clone that is in an adapter. If it, again, fails I can just clone from the clone back to the normal system drive. A gen 4 drive will work in a gen 3 M.2 slot but not a gen 2 M.2 slot hence the adapter in my second PCIe x16 gen 3 slot.

May not be true but I think it possible that the upgrade cannot finish as, after the reboot, the installer can no longer see the drive in the adapter. This is indicated as my BIOS boot order changes from the clone drive to the install media. I can change to the clone drive but it just goes to a boot loop. This is likely caused by the install not being finished and the adapter not being fully seen.

I don't know if I'm making sense on this but it seems possible to me and is worth a try before trying an old video card for the install or doing clean; both of which would be a bit of a pain.

 

[MaloK]

When does it black screen in the boot process... Right at boot time ? later in the loading of drivers ? can you see the uefi entry in bios setup ?

Not sure because if your installer see the drive during installation it should be able to install them for windows to work at the same time...

What can and surely will.. Is if the pcie card is unable to present the uefi firmware correctly as a boot device... The drive will disappear from the boot entry or erroneous one or two sometimes are created. Even if the installer succeeded completely the firmware cannot load UEFI partition on target drive.

The install cannot verify if your device is bootable how it is installed. But it can have all required drivers to install.

Your board must support nvme booting natively and yes older version are not passing often the test of time. Newer drive requires drivers in the uefi boot rom to be able to boot from them. And trying to update uefi drivers is quite an adventure.

I have something a little like you and I was never able to boot in uefi with it, bios worked like a charm.

So at some point I wont start putting boot managers on sd cards to bypass something that is just refusing everything, loll.

If it was working with W10 is because the security got tightened solidly and for some reasons.

Some genius hacker was able to use uefi to make armor crate install anything he wants... loll..

 

[jaylach]

Oh yes, I can see the clone drive in the UEFI BIOS even though it is removed from the boot order. I can also set the drive to boot but it does not boot as I don't think the install is actually finished when it reboots. This is why I believe that the M.2 to PCIe adapter is the cause. My next attempt will be to try installing to what is my current system drive. This is safe as I can always use my clone drive with win 10 to restore the system drive.

Yes, NVME is supported. If not I would not have been able to do a clean install of 10 quite a while back as my system drive is NVME.

I am thinking that my mistake was likely trying to install to the M.2 drive in the PCIe adapter. Next attempt would be to try installing to my current system drive. This thought is due to the clone drive being mounted on an adapter.

Another option I haven't mentioned would be to make a clone of one of my systems that is properly running Win 11 and restoring to one of my main system's drives. Of course, even if it boots, there would be driver issues as the hardware would be different but, if it would boot, I could add the proper drivers.

The install, I believe, has never actually finished as between 73% and 92% of the install it wants to reboot. This is where the install fails and will go to a boot attempt loop.

 

[anewbie]

To be honest i don't believe the clone drive has an mbr (boot track installed). The OS can be installed on drive but another drive can contain the boot track; I've had this problem before when trying to 'clone drives'.

 

[jaylach]

To be honest i don't believe the clone drive has an mbr (boot track installed). The OS can be installed on drive but another drive can contain the boot track; I've had this problem before when trying to 'clone drives'.

Of course the clone drive does not have MBR. MBR is obsolete and GPT is the norm. Hmmm, Windows 10 will actually work with MBR but 11 requires GPT. I'll have to look at the drive structure to see but would think that the 11 installer would report such an issue. I'd have to check but I DO believe that both my system and clone drives are GPT so I doubt that is the issue.

 

[anewbie]

Of course the clone drive does not have MBR. MBR is obsolete and GPT is the norm. Hmmm, Windows 10 will actually work with MBR but 11 requires GPT. I'll have to look at the drive structure to see but would think that the 11 installer would report such an issue. I'd have to check but I DO believe that both my system and clone drives are GPT so I doubt that is the issue.

I used the wrong term MBR/GPT are partition formats but the drive has to have a boot partition with a boot track installed.

I've never had an installer point out if the disk lacks an installed boot partition.

 

[anewbie]

To check if a Windows GPT disk has an installed EFI boot loader, you can examine the partition table and boot entries. Specifically, look for the EFI System Partition (usually FAT32) and verify the presence of boot files within it, like those in the EFI\Microsoft\Boot folder. You can also use bcdedit to check the Windows boot loader path, which will end in .efi for UEFI systems.

Here's a more detailed breakdown:
1. Verify the Partition Table:
Open Disk Management (search for it in the Start Menu).
Locate the disk you want to check.
Right-click on the disk and select Properties.
Go to the Volumes tab.
Under Partition style, if it says GUID Partition Table (GPT), then the disk is GPT.
2. Identify the EFI System Partition (ESP):
In Disk Management, find the partition with the EFI System Partition label. It's usually a small partition (e.g., 100MB to 500MB).
The ESP is typically formatted as FAT32.
It usually does not have a drive letter assigned to it.
3. Check for Boot Files within the ESP:
You can use diskpart to assign a drive letter to the ESP temporarily:
Open Command Prompt as Administrator.
Type diskpart and press Enter.
Type list volume and press Enter to see the list of volumes.
Identify the EFI partition (usually FAT32, no drive letter) and select it using select volume <number>.
Assign a drive letter using assign letter=<drive letter>.
Exit diskpart with exit.
Now, navigate to the assigned drive letter in File Explorer (e.g., S.
Look for the EFI\Microsoft\Boot folder.
4. Use bcdedit to verify the boot loader:
Open Command Prompt as Administrator.
Type bcdedit and press Enter.
Look for the "Windows Boot Loader" section.
If the Path value ends with \winload.efi, then your system is booted in EFI mode. If it ends with \winload.exe, it's likely a legacy BIOS boot.
By following these steps, you can confirm whether your Windows GPT disk has an EFI boot loader installed.

 

[jaylach]

To check if a Windows GPT disk has an installed EFI boot loader, you can examine the partition table and boot entries. Specifically, look for the EFI System Partition (usually FAT32) and verify the presence of boot files within it, like those in the EFI\Microsoft\Boot folder. You can also use bcdedit to check the Windows boot loader path, which will end in .efi for UEFI systems.

Here's a more detailed breakdown:
1. Verify the Partition Table:
Open Disk Management (search for it in the Start Menu).
Locate the disk you want to check.
Right-click on the disk and select Properties.
Go to the Volumes tab.
Under Partition style, if it says GUID Partition Table (GPT), then the disk is GPT.
2. Identify the EFI System Partition (ESP):
In Disk Management, find the partition with the EFI System Partition label. It's usually a small partition (e.g., 100MB to 500MB).
The ESP is typically formatted as FAT32.
It usually does not have a drive letter assigned to it.
3. Check for Boot Files within the ESP:
You can use diskpart to assign a drive letter to the ESP temporarily:
Open Command Prompt as Administrator.
Type diskpart and press Enter.
Type list volume and press Enter to see the list of volumes.
Identify the EFI partition (usually FAT32, no drive letter) and select it using select volume <number>.
Assign a drive letter using assign letter=<drive letter>.
Exit diskpart with exit.
Now, navigate to the assigned drive letter in File Explorer (e.g., S.
Look for the EFI\Microsoft\Boot folder.
4. Use bcdedit to verify the boot loader:
Open Command Prompt as Administrator.
Type bcdedit and press Enter.
Look for the "Windows Boot Loader" section.
If the Path value ends with \winload.efi, then your system is booted in EFI mode. If it ends with \winload.exe, it's likely a legacy BIOS boot.
By following these steps, you can confirm whether your Windows GPT disk has an EFI boot loader installed.

I know all this and both drives are GPT. That is not the issue. I THINK the issue is that I'm trying to install on a drive that is in an adapter.


It is also possible that the system is just not able to run current versions of 11. It has to be remembered that this system has previously had 11 installed but, after an update it died.

 

[anewbie]

I know all this and both drives are GPT. That is not the issue. I THINK the issue is that I'm trying to install on a drive that is in an adapter.


It is also possible that the system is just not able to run current versions of 11. It has to be remembered that this system has previously had 11 installed but, after an update it died.

You said that the format is gpt but did you verify it has EFI boot info on the drive ?

 

[MaloK]

If your setup fails before completion.

Boot a Windows PE. And got to C:\Windows\Panther\ pull off the setupact.log and setuperr.log for examination.

If the Windows directory is not already created look for C:\$WINDOWS.~BT\Sources\Panther\

These files should help give you an idea on whats going on.

 

[jaylach]

You said that the format is gpt but did you verify it has EFI boot info on the drive ?

Has to have the boot info as it WILL start to boot with the spinning dots.

If your setup fails before completion.

Boot a Windows PE. And got to C:\Windows\Panther\ pull off the setupact.log and setuperr.log for examination.

If the Windows directory is not already created look for C:\$WINDOWS.~BT\Sources\Panther\

These files should help give you an idea on whats going on.

That is an issue as the install logs folder is empty.

 

[MaloK]

That's ugly...

 

[MaloK]

Server Setup Update...

I got the proXmoX booting in zfs mirror from NVME addon card at X8 in slot #1... I installed 2 fat heat sinks on the cards.

I now have 16 bays free for TrueNas with direct hardware access I have 4x1tb bays dedicated for acceleration and 12 bays used for a whooping 22 tb in zfs Raid Z2 double parity

And installed a completely paravirtualized Windows 7 setup that has direct block access to virtual disk and is connected to a 10Gb/s virtual I/O TCP network.

The rest of the drives are coming in soon, no vendors want to ship 12 drives at once.

The really fun part is going to start soon. The big jump into TrueNas and Ubuntu server.

 

[jaylach]

I give up and am done trying to install Win 11 upgrade to my main system.

The reason I’m done with all these attempts is that I had total success and am running Win 11 Pro on my main system. Seems to be that I was right and the M.2 to PCIe adapter was the issue. Did the install on my main system M.2 drive that does not use a PCIe adapter and the install went perfect. Seems a bit odd to me that I can do a clone to the drive in the adapter and it is fine, but I figure that a clone is different than an install… Well of course it is.

I will leave the clone drive as Win 10 for a while to proof things but, so far, all seems good. I just want to keep a win 10 boot intact until everything is proven fully.

Hey, you have to give me credit for persistence. I just don’t know how to give up. Actually, I’m sending this post from Firefox in Win 11.

Needless to say that I’m a pretty happy camper right now.