Slight Confusion Over

[chishnfips]

Hi folks,

I have a newly set up vision 180, still cycling and I am thinking of getting a figure of 8 puffer, I looked them up on the internet and spoke to the lfs about them but thought I could do with some extra knowledge in terms of tank mates etc....

what other fish could I house with it? the tank is 47 gallons (uk), it seems there are conflicting opinions with tank mates. Some say they are really viscxious and should be kept alone, other people say they have never had a problem, so what do you experts reckon?

cheers chish

PS I know figure of 8's are brackish, but I noticed on the "about" website they can be kept in freshwater as well, also the lfsa owner has his in FW and has no probs.......

 

[nmonks]

I have a newly set up vision 180, still cycling and I am thinking of getting a figure of 8 puffer, I looked them up on the internet and spoke to the lfs about them but thought I could do with some extra knowledge in terms of tank mates etc....

Puffers should be -- in my opinion -- the *last* fish added to the aquarium. Usually when people have added stuff after the puffers are settled in, at the very least the curiosity of the puffer has led to a few nipped fins as the puffer works out if the new thing dropped into the tank is food or not! At worst, new fish are viewed not as landscape (as the other fish might be) but as interlopers in the territory, and the puffer tries to drive them off.

what other fish could I house with it? the tank is 47 gallons (uk), it seems there are conflicting opinions with tank mates. Some say they are really vicious and should be kept alone, other people say they have never had a problem, so what do you experts reckon?

I'd tend to go with a group of figure-8s in a big tank rather than one, in the theory that these mildly territorial fish will bicker among themselves but won't bully any one fish to death (this is what often happens when fish like these are kepts in twos or threes, and one becomes hyperdominant). Failing that, gobies can work well (if there are plenty of rocks to hide in) and maybe even mosquitofish (nasty little beggars) for fun at the top. Quite a variety of stuff has *sometimes* been kept with figure-8s, but there don't seem to be any 100% reliable combinations, except perhaps small gobies.

PS I know figure of 8's are brackish, but I noticed on the "about" website they can be kept in freshwater as well, also the lfsa owner has his in FW and has no probs.......

The About.com web site fish section is nice but very "old school". Historically fishkeeping authors (e.g. Baensch) viewed figure-8s as freshwater, and this does seem to be how they live in the wild. But the balance of experience seems to be that they do better in brackish water than fresh. Since they aren't kept in community tanks, adding salt is a no-brainer: it may do some good, and certainly won't do any harm.

Cheers, Neale

 

[chishnfips]

Mr monks you are a diamond in the fish hobby, cheers for the reply.

So say I got four puffers, But wanted to add maybe two or three top surface fish.

1: I am best to get the other fish first

2: If I got fish for the top level is that possible?

3: add some salt to the tank, (is this a total must) or just an experienced opinion, will it harm them if I didn't?

4: would I need any extra equipment for brackish tanks (salinty checker??), are they hard to maintain?

questions galore, sorry. last one,

5: I take it gobies are bottom dwelling fish, would there be enough space on the tank floor for them as well

 

[ac106]

47 UK gallons is about 56 US gallon. that is pretty big tank for figure 8s.

If i were you, i would get a cheap hydrometer and add salt until you get the the SG around 1.005. At that tank size and that salinity you could have:

4-5 Figure 8s
+
15 Bumble Bee Gobies
or
2-3 knight gobies, but not both as the knights will eat the Bees

+ a combo of the following:
orange chromides
Florida Flag fish
Dragon Goby
glassfish
archerfish, maybe eat Bees so i wouldnt mix the two

all *should* get along but as stated, some puffers are more aggresive then others so you have to keep an eye on it

 

[nmonks]

AC106 is giving some good advice there. The one thing I'll add is archers *will* eat small fish like gobies given the chance. They do feed from the bottom as well as the top, though admittedly not so readily.

Yes, get other fish first, then add puffs. I'd not chance any other variation. Mixing fish with puffs is difficult enough without making things more risky.

Adding salt is total must. SG 1.005, about 1g per litre.

Yes, a salinity checker (as you nicely put it) is very, very useful. I've known marine biologists who can estimate salinity very acurately by taste, but if you're not one of them, use a hydrometer. A basic one costs about a fiver. Just make sure it's calibrated down to 1.000 and set for 25 degrees C.

Cheers, Neale

 

[chishnfips]

magic info there thanks guys.

So just to be clear, the only extra equipment I would need to add to a FW setup is: salt and a hydrometer. To make it brackish.

I am going to add mopani wood and granite too, I also have some clay pipes for hidey holes and stuff, and loads of rocks to use as well.

What live plants will survive in a brackish setup or can I use the same plants as a FW setup?

Thanks for being patient with me I dont want to mess this up as it will no doubt prove costly, another thing I am unsure of is how easy these types of tanks are to maintain. When it comes to water changes is it just a matter of getting your new water, mixing in the right amount of salt and then pouring it in. or do you pour in your new water to the tank and then add the salt to the tank.

 

[nmonks]

Salt is always added to the bucket of water, dissolved, and then put in the aquarium.

Most hard-water tolerant freshwater plants will do okay at SG 1.003, a few up to 1.005. There's a good pinned topic on brackish water and plants in the brackish forum.

Cheers, Neale

 

[chishnfips]

okey dokey I am going to look into this further,

cheers for the help, I will keep you up to date with what happens,

 

[demonmagus]

are you going to get toxotes microlepis for the archers in your tank?

 

[fishfishfish]

i had bbgs,didnt care for em a whole lot.now i have a "freshwater" flounder and i love him.so does my entire family.great fish.i just have to make sure he gets to some bloodworm since he doesnt really take off cross tank for em.

 

[chishnfips]

right I reckon I have decided what I want, so here it is:

10-15 bumble bee gobies, 4 figure of 8 puffers and some orange chromides. How many ornage chromides do you reckon I could fit in, 4-5?


Demon: I dont think I will now get archer fish as someone above said they may eat the gobies


fishfishfish: are flounders not cold water?

 

[fishfishfish]

i dont really understand ur question but they are warmwater brac if thats what ur asking.ur probably thinking of hillstream loaches.

 

[chishnfips]

I thought flounders were like flat fish, (plaice, halibut etc....)

 

[nmonks]

Yes, flounders are coldwater. The name is used -- erroneously -- by hobbyists for fishes that are actually soles (family Soleidae) or American soles (family Achiridae). The North Atlantic and Pacific flounders belongs to a number of other families but in particular the Pleuronectidae (among which is the European flounder Platichthys flesus).

Trying to explain to hobbyists the differences between the half dozen or so flatfish families is rather hard work, and most fishkeeping authors don't seem to bother. But they are different, so calling a sole a flounder is rather akin to calling a Corydoras a plec or a gourami a cichlid.

Cheers, Neale

I thought flounders were like flat fish, (plaice, halibut etc....)

 

[chishnfips]

Thats what I thought, lol, so in answer to the orange chromide question would 4-5 be ok?