Plants Keep "malting" Leaves

jameshunter63

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Set a new tank up a fair few weeks back. Planted 40% of the substrate, used sand. but some of the plants keep loosing leaves and im constantly fishing the leaves out of the tank. The plants have grown roots since being put in as cuttings but just cannot keep hold of their leaves. I dont know what to do, should i bin and start over or is there other ways??
 
it will help the plant pros on here if you can list the following

types of plants affected
lighting in the tank (type of bulbs and wattage)
amount of hours the lights are on per day
what fertilizers (if any) are being used
Filter turnover rating (5x, 8x, 10x tank volume etc.)
Any carbon source (liquid or gas) being added
 
sorry iv been away for the day. Thanks for your reply,
have a 180l juwel vision all the original fixtures, just an added bubble bar. i hate it but the parents say it looks good so has to stay unfortunatly.

types of plants affected - fittonia "mini white" is loosing leaves like no tomorrow, the lysimachia nummularia isnt growing well, and the acorus variegatus keeps unrooting and drifting to the surface!! :S argh!!
lighting in the tank (type of bulbs and wattage) - 2x35 watt juwel nature and day bulbs.
amount of hours the lights are on per day - 12
what fertilizers (if any) are being used - tetra plantamin (once a week)
Filter turnover rating (5x, 8x, 10x tank volume etc.) - 6x juwel i think, when i can will upgrade to an external
Any carbon source (liquid or gas) being added - no, to much hassle for the parents when i go back to uni.

thanks for any help given!
 
We need a plant expert to help here please!

However, the bubble bar will not help your plants, this will remove a fair amount of carbon dioxide and thus be detremental to your them.

For water ciculation you should be aiming at 10x the volume of the tank per hour if you want to keep plants healthy....although this is a general rule and some plants can mange without it. I've not heard of your plants before so can't comment.
 
thanks. The bubble bar as i said was to please the family, i hate it. know all the co2 has to go to the plants and the bubbles just take it all out. argh. Also am going to upgrade to an external filter to get the circulation up but was thinking for now to buy a small "fan" that marine users use. really wish i could make the tank how i want it to look but the family have to interupt and give their ideas which are just messing all mine up.
was thinking of adding co2 for now till the plants get root and a firm foot hold but cant be relied upon in the long run, also the tank may be too large for a makeshift one. Not suprised about the plants not being heard of, iv bought them at the local maidenhead but havent seen them talked about or used anywhere on the foorum, but do have a plant in my 80l that is growing well.
just stumped really
thanks
james
 
good idea on the 'fan' (powerhead) that will probably be much cheaper than an additional filter.

You can add liquid carbon. That wont get taken out by the bubble bar. There are a few on the market. EasyCarbo is an example.
 
aha!! great. i am goin to the lfs tomorrow so will look at some of this liquid co2. thanks for your help
james
 
sorry guys but 'fittonia' is a non aquatic plant, so its gonna die. Take it out of the aquarium. A pic would be good, just in case the LFS has sold you some more non aquatics.
 
sorry guys but 'fittonia' is a non aquatic plant, so its gonna die. Take it out of the aquarium. A pic would be good, just in case the LFS has sold you some more non aquatics.

problem solved, case closed. Where were you yesterday??? :lol:
 
sorry guys but 'fittonia' is a non aquatic plant, so its gonna die. Take it out of the aquarium. A pic would be good, just in case the LFS has sold you some more non aquatics.

No way!!! Im going to complain then. thats awful. its in the aquatic plants submerged so why their selling it i dont know!!! Thanks mate, as long as i know im not killing these. :) ill try some bunched foreground plants, any "small bush" plants that anyone can recomend??
thanks guys, much appreciated
james

edit, ill get up a pic tomorrow. still need alot more planting though. any websites that do cheapish good plants?
 
Just a quick tip. A picture of the tank would've got you replies a lot quicker. People can see from a picture the non aquatics but may not know the names :)

types of plants affected - fittonia "mini white" is loosing leaves like no tomorrow

Never heard of it so had to google. Non aquatic garden plant. No wonder it is shedding leaves like no tomorrow.

lysimachia nummularia isnt growing well
This should be doing fine in any tank.

acorus variegatus keeps unrooting and drifting to the surface!! :S argh!!
Non aquatic. This can be planted in water gardens but not submerged.


lighting in the tank (type of bulbs and wattage) - 2x35 watt juwel nature and day bulbs.
Lighting seems OK for non CO2 tank.

amount of hours the lights are on per day - 12
Too long. 8-10 hours for planted tanks.

tetra plantamin (once a week)
This is trash - 2 elements from their blurb:

Tetra Plant PlantaMin is a liquid fertiliser containing all the nutrients required for good plant growth and health.

Excellent just what we need then :)


Free of nitrate and phosphates

Erm I thought the above statement said...where are trading standards when you need them eh?

Basically this fert says it has ALL the nutrients required and then states that they leave out the 2 most important. Bin it or use it as traces. Never buy a fert that tells you there is no N and P and links these to algae. If they do they are talking *****

However, the bubble bar will not help your plants, this will remove a fair amount of carbon dioxide and thus be detremental to your them.

We need to clear this up for all to read, a little refresher for many :)

There is a level of CO2 in water called 'equilibrium'. This is a natural level of CO2 that the water will contain. As CO2 is used then more comes in via gaseous exchange just as O does and therefore equilibrium is maintained.

Similarly if none is used and CO2 builds up then some will be expelled. The water is returning to equilibrium.

Now if we want more O in the tank we create water turbulence to promote the gaseous exchange....to help it. Same process for CO2. You are not going to gas off CO2 in a non CO2 tank because the tank will maintain the equilibrium level.

A CO2 injected tank is different. This is why it is hard to maintain 30ppm because the natural gaseous exchange is trying to return to equilibrium. water turbulence means you promote gaseous exchange and therefore some prefer to keep turbulence to a minimum in order to minimise the gaseous exchange. I on the other hand prefer to maintain turbulence and inject a little more to counter as I want the higher O as well :)

So in a non CO2 tank no worries about that bubble wall (although not great to look at IMO. One of those chintzy gimmicks that I hate. lol) It will not hurt your tank.

The level of CO2 @ equilibrium is argued over. Some say 3ppm,others 8ppm. Lets say it is 5ppm. Now you inject CO2 aiming for 30ppm. The water will try and expel the CO2 to return to 5ppm and so this is the battle.

If you are non CO2, guess what happens? Not a lot. You start with 5ppm. You put a wave maker in and ......... blimey still 5ppm.

For water ciculation you should be aiming at 10x the volume of the tank per hour if you want to keep plants healthy

This is a rule for high tec (fast uptake). Not really applicable in a low energy non CO2 tank. The turnover is to keep nutrient (including C) moving around because in 'deadspots' the plants are using it all up very quickly. In a non CO2 tank its much slower. It isn't such a problem as the uptake is so much slower. My non CO2 tank is incredibly heavily planted however it just has 5.6x turnover and noooo problems :)

know all the co2 has to go to the plants and the bubbles just take it all out.
Nope read above ;)

Also am going to upgrade to an external filter to get the circulation up
Nope again read above (however externals are better filters in general.)

but was thinking for now to buy a small "fan" that marine users use.
Do they seriously use fans for circulation? or is this for cooling in high temperatures? If the former I must stop laughing at the thought.

was thinking of adding co2 for now till the plants get root and a firm foot hold but cant be relied upon in the long run
If you add CO2 you speed the system up and yes you guessed it, you speed the problems up too. If your plants are slowly getting worse at the mo, then with CO2 they will quickly get worse.

also the tank may be too large for a makeshift one.
Yep

Not suprised about the plants not being heard of, iv bought them at the local maidenhead but havent seen them talked about or used anywhere on the foorum
Print this off and have a good go at the maidenhead manager. Maidenhead's are pretty good in the main but they are franchises and maybe someone has put pond plants in the aquarium plants section.

good idea on the 'fan' (powerhead) that will probably be much cheaper than an additional filter.
Lol. The fan will move the surface around. Won't do much for the circulation unless it is pretty big. Then it will be splashing water everywhere.

You can add liquid carbon. That wont get taken out by the bubble bar.

Read above r.e. equilibrium and also why not to add CO2 at this juncture.


aha!! great. i am goin to the lfs tomorrow so will look at some of this liquid co2. thanks for your help
Don't


Sites for plants (and non aquatics):
http://www.plantgeek.net/plantguide_all_gallery.php

AC
 
Thanks AC.
next time i will definatly add some pics. as you see i am a complete plant noob, trying to learn but iv always struggled with keeping things with roots alive, even cacti!! just a plant killer. :p Im gunu order online next time and before i do may run the chosen plants by the forum to make sure there not "non aquatic".
also went to maidenhead, spoke to the manager, they moved all the fittonia plants and put them in the water garden section, and said that they would look into any other plants they had and make sure they are aquarium safe. They also said that they would givve me replacements but i said i didnt trust them and would prefer my money back so managed to get 15 pounds back for 6 pounds of fittonia. didnt turn out too bad.
thanks for your help and fantastic learning curve, great answers by AC
cheers
james
 
good idea on the 'fan' (powerhead) that will probably be much cheaper than an additional filter.
Lol. The fan will move the surface around. Won't do much for the circulation unless it is pretty big. Then it will be splashing water everywhere.

[/quote]

AC, the OP used the term 'fan' when he was obviously talking about a powerhead. Therefore I repeated the term and gave him the correct one.

as for the rest of the stuff where I was off the mark, seems I have MUCH more to learn.
 

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