Ph And Hardness Troubles

[Ralphw62]

Hello,
I had a problem about 5 days ago,,,, my PH dropped to below 6 and my KH and GH are almost non existant
 
I managed to get the ph back up using a comonation of Fritz PH higher and crushed coral in a small in the tank plastic corner filter.
 
here are my latest readings all API tests
 


 
Livebearer Tank-only Fry in it now, all my fish were mover to my big tank and all are doing great
ph                  7.4
nitrites            0
ammonia        .25
KH                  3
GH                  3
Nitrates           20

50% change
3:15 after change
ph                   7.2
nitrites             0
ammonia         0
KH                   3
GH                   2
Nitrates           10-20
 
NOW... how do I raise the hardness without raising the PH?
 
My Tap water is so soft it dont register on the test kit
 

 

[mark4785]

Calcium carbonate can be added to raise both KH and GH but will have little effect on the PH. 
 
However, the higher the GH, the more able your filter will be able to process ammonia and nitrite; when your filter bacteria gains this ability to convert more ammonia into nitrite, a secondary effect occurs by way of the PH dropping since the ions of nitrite have acidic pH properties. You could counteract this and keep your pH more steady by oxygenating your water more by increasing surface flow as oxygen when dissolved in water, increases the PH of the water.

 

[Ralphw62]

I got this stuff called "KH Carbonate" made by aquavitro, I can go a slow as I want with it
 
almost got 4 drops on the test tube API
 
This tank almost acts like its needs cycling again...weird
 
I bought 3 baby livebearers to go with the handful I have inthere now as I want some life in there, they are too small to bother my baby fish. I think they might be guppies... not sure..
will be checking and changing soon

 

[mark4785]

This tank almost acts like its needs cycling again...weird

 
That is happening, without a doubt, due to the fact that your filter bacteria need a stable pH to thrive. Your water's carbonate hardness (KH) helps to keep the pH stable by releasing two kinds of hydrogen ions which help counteract dips or peaks in PH respectively, thereby keeping it stable. If your KH is non-existent or very low (as yours most certainly is/was) your PH can crash and kill your fish in addition to your filter bacteria. A symptom of filter bacteria that has been battered and bruised in this way would be increases in ammonia which you experienced ("0.25 ppm").
 
My tap water KH and GH is 4 ppm. I top my KH up in my pond to 6 ppm knowing that metabolic processes of the fish, plants and filter bacteria will be high and that they will be using the KH up to metabolise (i.e. extreme algae growth / lilies growing & lots of fish waste as I have Koi). As your tap water KH and GH appears to be very low, you will need to continually add dissolved salts/chemicals to keep it at a level that is convenient for your fish / plant growth and fish waste. In any case, you will want a KH of 4 ppm to stop stressful PH swings. People who claim to keep fish in water that has a lower KH value will most likely do bi-weekly water changes to higher the KH (only if their tap water naturally has a high KH content) or will frequently add a KH buffer (i.e. calcium carbonate).
 
 
So to clarify, I think you should do the following:
 
1. Add a source of calcium carbonate (i.e. crushed coral or begin using manufactured buffering agent such as this: http/www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Waterlife-7-2-Buffer-60g-Lowers-Or-Raises-pH-to-7-2-Mixed-Freshwater-Aquariums-/200823895915?pt=UK_Pet_Supplies_Fish&hash=item2ec209776b ) to increase your KH; will indirectly increase the pH (a KH reading of 70+ ppm / 4 dH is recommended)
2. Add a source of magnesium sulphate (i.e. epsom salts) to increase your GH; does not increase pH. (a GH reading of 6-7 dH / up to 125 ppm is recommended)
 
 
Note: The manufactured buffering agent above will only work in reverse osmosis water with a KH and GH level of zero. 

 

[Ralphw62]

this may sound stupid....example only
ok I test(API KH test kit) my KH it takes 4 drops to change color..soooo what is my KH  4dh  ?
 
 
 
what is a good  KH for mollies platys swords?
 
GH?
 
BTW the crushed coral did work for the low PH but didn't do much for raising the KH so I took it out as the ph was getting too high with no hardness
 
This is what I'm using, the KH carbonite ta 1/4 -1/2 doses
 
http/www.aquavitro.com/

 

[mark4785]

this may sound stupid....example only
ok I test(API KH test kit) my KH it takes 4 drops to change color..soooo what is my KH  4dh  ?
 
 
 
what is a good  KH for mollies platys swords?
 
GH?
 
BTW the crushed coral did work for the low PH but didn't do much for raising the KH so I took it out as the ph was getting too high with no hardness
 
This is what I'm using, the KH carbonite ta 1/4 -1/2 doses
 
http/www.aquavitro.com/

 
The Aquavitro carbonate product will definitely raise your KH so definitely use that. You should aim to increase the KH slowly (by 1 dH per day) to prevent shocking the fish.
 
As for your other query, 4 drops does equal 4 dH. At this level your pH will be quite stable, but the KH is not high enough for you to completely forget about. The KH level in my 1400 litre pond reduces by 1 dH every 1-2 weeks, so I check the KH of the water every 1-2 weeks to see where it's at. I think you should do the same and get a feel for how often your KH changes.
 
GH refers to general hardness and is a measure of the total salt concentrations of your water (i.e. iron, magnesium, calcium etc). So it is important to keep the GH above 0 dH because you will need, for instance, to have a bit of calcium in the water so your fishes can grow new strong bones, and iron, so that your plants stay green. Your plants are very green in your signature so you must be dosing iron (which is known to keep the chlorophyl in plant leaves fully green) however iron is used up or degrades very quickly.
 
Found a link below for you regarding fish care:
http/www.americanaquariumproducts.com/livebearers.html#molly .
 
Sadly, I've never kept livebearer's so I don't know how to advice you on keeping them.

 

[Ralphw62]

Thanks man

 

[TwoTankAmin]

The following measurements are approximate; use a test kit to verify you've achieved the intended results. Note that if your water is extremely soft to begin with (1 degree KH or less), you may get a drastic change in pH as the buffer is added.
 
To raise both GH and KH simultaneously, add calcium carbonate (CaCO3). 1/2 teaspoon per 100 liters of water will increase both the KH and GH by about 1-2 dH. Alternatively, add some sea shells, coral, limestone, marble chips, etc. to your filter.
 
To raise the KH without raising the GH, add sodium bicarbonate (NaHCO3), commonly known as baking soda. 1/2 teaspoon per 100 Liters raises the KH by about 1 dH. Sodium bicarbonate drives the pH towards an equilibrium value of 8.2.

From http/fins.actwin.com/aquariafaq.html
 
I have used a mix of pretreated water using crushed coral packed into a pair of H.O.T. Magnums and run on a 20 gal. can of water for 18-24 hours. I then add magnesium (Epsom Salt) and a small pinch of baking soda. This should be held to a minimum in non rift lake tanks and to prevent any real change in pH. Together these three things should get you wherever you want to be. The Epsom wont help with buffering (KH) but will raise hardness. I was most interested in my TDS so i was able to dose and test to achieve the level I needed. The Epsom raised the TDS the most effectively. I think I added 3 tablespoons per 20 gals. But I was using my mix on multiple tanks so I made it overly strong and diluted it as it went into the tank.