Nitrogen Cycle Collapse?

[Bgcat249]

Hello,

I am at my wits end now 4 weeks into cycling my tank.Hope someone can help. Everything was going along right on schedule...ammonia was being processed into nitrites (which were as high as the chart goes) and nitrates were starting to creep up (5) Have not changes out any filter material or biowheel. Jus topping off water due to evaporation but no water changes. Did I say this is fishless cycling?

Well last week I tested and my nitites were almost gone, nitrates still at 5 and ammonia 0. Next day : ammonia 0, nitrites 0 and nitrates 5. I realized I had neglected to keep adding ammonia and started immediately "feeding" the bacteria with fishfood flakes daily for the last 3 days. Today ammonia STILL 0, nitrites 0 and nitrates still 5 (tap water nitrates 0). Since I have been adding ammonia why isn't it detectable? I understand I may have to start all over but nothing seems to be detectable (I have master API test kit) In the midst of this I had to leave the apartment for 24 hours due to a tub being re-surfaced (bad fumes) I have no idea if that is relevant at all.

Does anyone have any ideas what is going on?Would appreciate any feedback you can give me. Thanks

 

[DP1981]

How long are you leaving between adding Ammonia and then testing?

If it's over 12 hours you could be cycled no?

 

[fatheadminnow]

Hello,

I am at my wits end now 4 weeks into cycling my tank.Hope someone can help. Everything was going along right on schedule...ammonia was being processed into nitrites (which were as high as the chart goes) and nitrates were starting to creep up (5) Have not changes out any filter material or biowheel. Jus topping off water due to evaporation but no water changes. Did I say this is fishless cycling?

Well last week I tested and my nitites were almost gone, nitrates still at 5 and ammonia 0. Next day : ammonia 0, nitrites 0 and nitrates 5. I realized I had neglected to keep adding ammonia and started immediately "feeding" the bacteria with fishfood flakes daily for the last 3 days. Today ammonia STILL 0, nitrites 0 and nitrates still 5 (tap water nitrates 0). Since I have been adding ammonia why isn't it detectable? I understand I may have to start all over but nothing seems to be detectable (I have master API test kit) In the midst of this I had to leave the apartment for 24 hours due to a tub being re-surfaced (bad fumes) I have no idea if that is relevant at all.

Does anyone have any ideas what is going on?Would appreciate any feedback you can give me. Thanks

Sounds like you are off to a good start.

When the ammonia is down near zero you should add it back up to 5 ppm.

The reason you are not getting any ammonia readings is because your autotrophic bacteria are processing it into nitrite.

You should not add fish food instead of the ammonia you have been adding. It is very hard/near impossible to measure how mush ammonia fish food will give off, and that is why you should not add it as a substitute for ammonia.

Leaving for 24 hours without adding ammonia should not be too big of a problem, as the bacteria start to die off at a rate of about 1-2% a day, and gradually increase that rate exponentially with each passing day. So you should be fine there.

What you should do is, add up to 5 ppm of ammonia right away, check in 12 hours and post your results with the readings!
-FHM

 

[rdd1952]

The lack of ammonia and nitrite could mean you're cycled but the low nitrates probably means that you aren't. Do you have live plants that could be using the ammonia in it's pure form rather than it being processed? Also, when using fish flakes for your ammonia source, it takes a while for those to be broken down and for the ammonia to finally show up. Could be a couple days before they show and in that time frame, if you have bacteria present, it's possible they will handle the ammonia produced by the decaying flakes before it is high enough to register on your test kit.

 

[Bgcat249]

The lack of ammonia and nitrite could mean you're cycled but the low nitrates probably means that you aren't. Do you have live plants that could be using the ammonia in it's pure form rather than it being processed? Also, when using fish flakes for your ammonia source, it takes a while for those to be broken down and for the ammonia to finally show up. Could be a couple days before they show and in that time frame, if you have bacteria present, it's possible they will handle the ammonia produced by the decaying flakes before it is high enough to register on your test kit.

Thanks for your reply. No don't have any live plants=all plastic. I have been adding fish food for 4 days now and still no ammonia. (I put a piece of shrimp in originally and I had ammonia in 2 days) I fully expected to have a nitrate spike but they haven't budged higher than 5. I really don't know what to make of this.

Hello,

I am at my wits end now 4 weeks into cycling my tank.Hope someone can help. Everything was going along right on schedule...ammonia was being processed into nitrites (which were as high as the chart goes) and nitrates were starting to creep up (5) Have not changes out any filter material or biowheel. Jus topping off water due to evaporation but no water changes. Did I say this is fishless cycling?

Well last week I tested and my nitites were almost gone, nitrates still at 5 and ammonia 0. Next day : ammonia 0, nitrites 0 and nitrates 5. I realized I had neglected to keep adding ammonia and started immediately "feeding" the bacteria with fishfood flakes daily for the last 3 days. Today ammonia STILL 0, nitrites 0 and nitrates still 5 (tap water nitrates 0). Since I have been adding ammonia why isn't it detectable? I understand I may have to start all over but nothing seems to be detectable (I have master API test kit) In the midst of this I had to leave the apartment for 24 hours due to a tub being re-surfaced (bad fumes) I have no idea if that is relevant at all.

Does anyone have any ideas what is going on?Would appreciate any feedback you can give me. Thanks

Sounds like you are off to a good start.

When the ammonia is down near zero you should add it back up to 5 ppm.

The reason you are not getting any ammonia readings is because your autotrophic bacteria are processing it into nitrite.

You should not add fish food instead of the ammonia you have been adding. It is very hard/near impossible to measure how mush ammonia fish food will give off, and that is why you should not add it as a substitute for ammonia.

Leaving for 24 hours without adding ammonia should not be too big of a problem, as the bacteria start to die off at a rate of about 1-2% a day, and gradually increase that rate exponentially with each passing day. So you should be fine there.

What you should do is, add up to 5 ppm of ammonia right away, check in 12 hours and post your results with the readings!
-FHM

If I had ANY nitrites at all I agree with you about it being processed. BUt I have no nitrites and virtually no nitrates. I forgot to add ammonia for about 7 days so I am concerned I had a bacteria die off.

 

[fatheadminnow]

The lack of ammonia and nitrite could mean you're cycled but the low nitrates probably means that you aren't. Do you have live plants that could be using the ammonia in it's pure form rather than it being processed? Also, when using fish flakes for your ammonia source, it takes a while for those to be broken down and for the ammonia to finally show up. Could be a couple days before they show and in that time frame, if you have bacteria present, it's possible they will handle the ammonia produced by the decaying flakes before it is high enough to register on your test kit.

Thanks for your reply. No don't have any live plants=all plastic. I have been adding fish food for 4 days now and still no ammonia. (I put a piece of shrimp in originally and I had ammonia in 2 days) I fully expected to have a nitrate spike but they haven't budged higher than 5. I really don't know what to make of this.

Hello,

I am at my wits end now 4 weeks into cycling my tank.Hope someone can help. Everything was going along right on schedule...ammonia was being processed into nitrites (which were as high as the chart goes) and nitrates were starting to creep up (5) Have not changes out any filter material or biowheel. Jus topping off water due to evaporation but no water changes. Did I say this is fishless cycling?

Well last week I tested and my nitites were almost gone, nitrates still at 5 and ammonia 0. Next day : ammonia 0, nitrites 0 and nitrates 5. I realized I had neglected to keep adding ammonia and started immediately "feeding" the bacteria with fishfood flakes daily for the last 3 days. Today ammonia STILL 0, nitrites 0 and nitrates still 5 (tap water nitrates 0). Since I have been adding ammonia why isn't it detectable? I understand I may have to start all over but nothing seems to be detectable (I have master API test kit) In the midst of this I had to leave the apartment for 24 hours due to a tub being re-surfaced (bad fumes) I have no idea if that is relevant at all.

Does anyone have any ideas what is going on?Would appreciate any feedback you can give me. Thanks

Sounds like you are off to a good start.

When the ammonia is down near zero you should add it back up to 5 ppm.

The reason you are not getting any ammonia readings is because your autotrophic bacteria are processing it into nitrite.

You should not add fish food instead of the ammonia you have been adding. It is very hard/near impossible to measure how mush ammonia fish food will give off, and that is why you should not add it as a substitute for ammonia.

Leaving for 24 hours without adding ammonia should not be too big of a problem, as the bacteria start to die off at a rate of about 1-2% a day, and gradually increase that rate exponentially with each passing day. So you should be fine there.

What you should do is, add up to 5 ppm of ammonia right away, check in 12 hours and post your results with the readings!
-FHM

If I had ANY nitrites at all I agree with you about it being processed. BUt I have no nitrites and virtually no nitrates. I forgot to add ammonia for about 7 days so I am concerned I had a bacteria die off.

Okay...7 days with no ammonia added....that probably effected the bacteria for sure.

Well, the only thing you can do to make sure if they are still around, or if they have died off is to add ammonia.

I would add 5 ppm of ammonia, just like normal, and test in 12 hours to see where you are at.

And don't forget to post the results!

Best of luck!
-FHM

 

[rdd1952]

My advice for now would be to continue to add flakes (I assume you can't find ammonia) for a few days and watch the readings. If the ammonia and nitrite continue to stay at 0 but the nitrate rises, then your tank is processing ammonia. If it isn't, you should start to see either ammonia or nitrite (if ammonia is being processed but nitrite isn't) rise.

 

[fatheadminnow]

My advice for now would be to continue to add flakes (I assume you can't find ammonia) for a few days and watch the readings. If the ammonia and nitrite continue to stay at 0 but the nitrate rises, then your tank is processing ammonia. If it isn't, you should start to see either ammonia or nitrite (if ammonia is being processed but nitrite isn't) rise.

Agree.

But if you have ammonia...I would add that, just because you will know how much you have added, and the time you did so as well.

-FHM

 

[waterdrop]

Yes, agree with rdd and fhm, let us know if you have both ammonia and fish flakes as it sounds, that part is confusing.

If you do have ammonia then why not measure 1/2 hour after you've added to 5ppm, just so we can see that yes it starts out being there. Then of course measure at 12 and 24 hours after the ammonia addition.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Bgcat249]

My advice for now would be to continue to add flakes (I assume you can't find ammonia) for a few days and watch the readings. If the ammonia and nitrite continue to stay at 0 but the nitrate rises, then your tank is processing ammonia. If it isn't, you should start to see either ammonia or nitrite (if ammonia is being processed but nitrite isn't) rise.

Thank you all for the advice. When I cycled my tank the first time (yes I've been through this before in Dec) I made the mistake of picking up ammonia with surfactants. DIdn't realize until I was 2 weeks into things. Then had to move and start all over after cleaning the tank with water as best as possible. SOO I really don't want to go down the "looking for ammonia without surfactants road" again. Hence the fish food route. So I will keep adding the flakes until either I see ammonia and/or nitrates. I realize it makes measuring difficult but I would be happy to see ANY ammonia at this point. Does anyone think the fumes from the tub repainting had anything to do with this? I would be happy to post my results when I get any! Thanks again-its always great to get another opinion and perspective! Great site!

 

[waterdrop]

I doubt the tub fumes would be strong enough to be much of a deal to your tank in another room and certainly even more unlikely to be a problem during a fishless cycle.

Yes, think I remember your case now and empathise with you as the fishfood route is a huge pain!

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Bgcat249]

My advice for now would be to continue to add flakes (I assume you can't find ammonia) for a few days and watch the readings. If the ammonia and nitrite continue to stay at 0 but the nitrate rises, then your tank is processing ammonia. If it isn't, you should start to see either ammonia or nitrite (if ammonia is being processed but nitrite isn't) rise.

To All who helped-thank you. The exciting news is that apparently my tank WAS cycled although I never got the expected nitrate spike. Not quite sure why. But after hanging a shrimp in my tank for a week and not getting any ammonia readings I thought surely this is the end. AND so I have started adding fish right away (after 3 months of waiting I'm a bit impatient) In my 60 gallon I have:
1 gold gourami
1 pearl gourami
1 opaline gourami
3 swordtails
6 platys
9 tiny cherry barbs
Today added: 4 rainbow fish

I know this way too many fish too quickly, but I am testing water every day and doing 10-15% PWC every day in hopes of avoiding any nitrate spikes (or ammonia) Do I need to test kH/Gh? I've heard that is an important measurement to know. what about adding aquarium salt? LFS suggested that. Thanks again everyone!

 

[fatheadminnow]

I would not add any aquarium salt to your tank.

Salt can be used as a remedy if any of your fish develop ick, but should not be added to a tank unless needed.

-FHM

 

[waterdrop]

Agree FHM, salt is good to have "on the shelf" (along with carbon, lol) because its useful in one of the ich remedy techniques, but otherwise should definately not be in the tank on a regular basis. There are plenty of long discussions of this to be found on TFF.

~~waterdrop~~