Nitrites rising!

DaneeF

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Hey all.

I've recently cycled my fish tank and the results where at 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite and 5ppm nitrate. Tested the water at maidenhead aquatics who said it was all good to go.

I then picked up my pleco and cherry shrimp as the first lot of fishes last week and they are doing really well however on testing the water a couple of days ago, my nitrite levels have crept up to around 0.25ppm. Ammonia is a little bit more green than yellow and looks like its between 0-0.25. Nitrates are still on 5ppm.

What's gone on here?? Does this mean my tanks not cycled correctly??

I did a 25% water change last night and the night before which dropped the nitrite levels but it's still continuing to spike the following day.

Is it the case of doing water changes everyday to resolve this? Or will this just keep the bacteria from growing?

Please if anyone has any suggestions that'll be great! I don't know whether to keep doing the water changes or not 😟😟
 
How did you cycle the tank?

it does sound as though it wasn't properly cycled; since ammonia (and nitrite? You don't give a reading for that) are rising, it does suggest the tank wasn't properly cycled.

Now that you have fish, I suggest you read this, it was written to help with a fish-in cycle. The first part deals with ammonia, the second with nitrite.
 
Fishless cycle, the tank took over a month to show any sign of nitrates. I used fish food as the ammonia source and then waited for the nitrites and ammonia levels to drop before adding any fish.

Maidenhead then said it was good to go and now the nitrites and ammonia are slowly starting to rise until I carry out 25% water changes everyday.

Thank you, I'll give that a read
 
Maidenhead would say or was good to go if ammonia and nitrite were zero. They don't know whether you have done a proper fishless cycle, or even a fishless cycle at all.
The problem with using fish food is that you have no idea how much ammonia was made from the food so you have no idea how many bacteria have grown. That's why it's preferable to use ammonia and with that you know exactly how much has been added.

You are now doing a a fish-in cycle. I'm afraid. The link I gave you will help see you through that and hopefully the fish & shrimps alive.
 
OK thank you.

Can this just by resolved by doing regular water changes instead of salt? I only ask because I'm not exactly confident with the correct measurements of salt I need and because I have to convert it into teaspoons instead of grams. I can't get it so accurate
 
Yes, water changes can be done, it'll just take longer for the cycle to finish. The water changes need to be done whenever either or both ammonia and nitrite read above zero and the amount needs to be as big as necessary to get the readings down to zero. Depending how fast they go up, it may mean daily water changes for a while

When both ammonia and nitrite stay at zero, you'll have enough bacteria to cope with the ammonia made by the plec and shrimps. When you add more fish, they'll make more ammonia than the current livestock so ammonia and then nitrite will show up again until more bacteria have grown.


Do you have live plants or intend them in the future? These can help a lot as plants take up ammonia as fertiliser and they don't turn it into nitrite. I use floating plants and stems of elodea when I quarantine new fish and they keep the readings at zero for the duration of quarantine.
 
Amazing news thank you. I'm happy to keep doing water changes every day, I just didn't know if I was doing the correct thing.

During the water changes, am I meant to be removing the fish waste at the same time? Or shall I leave that in there for a couple of days for the bacteria?

I haven't cleaned out the filter either for about a month. Is that OK?

Yes the aquarium has many live plants and bogwood. It took ages for any nitrates to show because of it! I'll look into getting some floating plants too 😁
 
I would remove the solid waste; fish breathe out ammonia so there's plenty in the water from that.

Floating plants are particularly good at taking up ammonia because their other two needs are plentiful - they are closer to the lights than lower down plants and they can get CO2 from the air - CO2 is more plentiful in air than water.
 
Fishless cycle, the tank took over a month to show any sign of nitrates. I used fish food as the ammonia source and then waited for the nitrites and ammonia levels to drop before adding any fish.

Maidenhead then said it was good to go and now the nitrites and ammonia are slowly starting to rise until I carry out 25% water changes everyday.

Thank you, I'll give that a read
Fish less cycles are usually a little more complicated than most people realize. After the 1st cycle, which can and often does, take from 4 -8 weeks the 1st time. Then each time a re dosing is administered, it take less and less time. Ultimately getting down to 24 hours, after the 2 groups of bacteria, (nitrosomonas, or nitrospiras, then nitrobacters)- have fully colonized. How long did your cycle take to remove all ammonia and nitrites? It needs to get down to 24 -36 hours , (ideally 24 hours) before fish are introduced. Unfortunately, the place that tested your water, probably should have informed you on these areas of fishless cycling.

As Essjay stated, i would leave the plants in as they consume nitrates and usually keep that under control. Also, make sure you have plenty of water agitation , ie, air stone(s) Bacteria thrive in moving water. Wisteria plants are amazing nitrite vacuums, 1 decent plant will consume a heap.
Have you noticed any biofilm in the tank too? Biofilm is great to have as the bacteria that converts nitrites stick to it. So make sure to leave that in there. Once the cycle is done they usually disappear in its own time, but by that time anyway, your filtration media should have a good sized colony in there.

The other thing to note too, is the bacteria that converts the nitrites to nitrates, (Nitrobacter, or sometimes Nitrospira depending on the system,) is a lot slower to build up colonies than the bacteria that converts ammonia to nitrites (Nitrosomonas) are. So patience is needed having to wait for them to get their slow butts into gear lol.
 
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Just so you do not make the mistake again, cycling with fish food is not a good way to go. You cannot control ammonia. There are inexpensive sources of ammonium chloride you can use for this purpose. Both Dr. Tim's Ammonium Chloride and Fishless Fuel from Fritz Aquatics will do the trick. The below is from Dr. Tim's Aquatics. He is the scientist who identified the bactieria we need in our tanks to handle ammonia and nitrite. He also sells the right bacteria to use to speed up cycling by weeks.

Using shrimp or fish food​


One of the more popular fishless cycling methods is to buy a few dead shrimp at the grocery store, cut them up into chunks and add them to the aquarium. The shrimp decay, which produces ammonia to feed the nitrifying bacteria. There are a few drawbacks with this method, one being that the hobbyist really has no way to know how much ammonia is being produced by the decaying shrimp, and the aquarium does not look very good with dead shrimp laying on the bottom. Also, the organic material of the shrimp can cause bacteria blooms which turn the aquarium water cloudy. This method works but it takes time and patience and you will probably see a spike in ammonia and nitrite if you add a medium to heavy load of fish after the initial cycling. Note that some people use flake fish food instead of shrimp but this is not recommended because flake food does not have much organic material compared to shrimp and so does not add a lot of ammonia to the water, but you can use cut fish instead of shrimp. Hint: to speed up the decay of the shrimp/fish and produce more ammonia, add some DrTim’s Aquatics Waste-Away sludge busting bacteria to the tank.
from https://www.drtimsaquatics.com/resources/fishless-cycling/


Changing water for nitrite is not the way to go. The reason is that the cycling process will produce nitrite for a number of days in a row. Unless you are almost continuously changing water, you will have some nitrite in the water. Once it enters a fish, it takes 24-48 hours to work its way out. As long as it is present in the water and there is no chloride. Every time a fish breathes it is taking in more nitrite.

And I wrote the article on rescuing a fishless cycle. I wrote the instructions for it so they are not hard to follow. I also realized that many people could not weigh the salt so the very end of the article tells you how to convert grams into teaspoons

Hint: We have calculated a handy conversion from grams to volume so one can measure in tea or table spoons which most folks are likely to have while a gram scale is not. The following calculations were made using an Ohaus triple beam scale: ¼ teaspoon of salt shaker sized table salt weighs 2 grams.

So, follow the directions to get the amount of table salt, (which is safe to use) and you can determine what you need in treaspoon sizes. If you do not have a set of measuring spoons in your kitchen most super markets have so many of these that they are selling them.

All of the math calculations ares basic and can be done on a calculator or with a paper and pencil/pen.

Here is how to covert the grams into teaspoons. since 2 reams of salt = 1/4 teaspoon, this also means 1 gram - 1/8 of a teaspoon.

So, dived the number of grams you calculated by 8. This will tell you how many teaspoons or partial teaspoons you will need to add.

If you read the section of ammonia, you need to know the pH and temperature of the water as well as how many ppm of ammonia you have. With all these numbers and not having salt in the tank, you can enter those numbers into the ammonia calculator linked in the article. The number you need to know is the one for NH3 Concentration. As long as it is not above .05 ppm, your fish should be safe at that level for some time. You do not need to change water as this slows a cycle.

Also, the amount of salt required to block nitrite from entering a fish is minimal. It is way less than the amount we would use when it is a medication. So almost any fish can tolerate that level of salt for more time than it should take to finish a cycle.

Water changes slow a cycle and are only a last resort. By that I mean when they must be done because to protect the fish and the levels are above the danger line for ammonia and, for nitrite, zero is best or else having enough chloride in the water to prevent the nitrite from entering the blood stream of the fish via the gills.

I can also tell you that for the cycling articles on the site the danger levels I used are at lower levels than many fish need them to be . But, since I have no idea of what levels of ammonia or nitrite are going to be involved and I have no idea about the pH and temps involved. I chose to err on the side of safety.

When it comes to the amount of salt used, it is OK to use a bit too much safely. So if your amount of salt contains an eighth and your measuring spoon set dowsnt cont tain an 1/8 spoon, it is safe to estimate at what lloks to be one half of the 1/4 spoon. Sets usally contain a 1/4, 1/2 and 1 teaspoon and then a tanblespoon one. Just anf FYI, 1 tablespoon = 3 teaspoons.

Finally, if you are having problems figuring out the Nitrite shoot me a message on the site. Click on my name under my Icon and then choose "Start A Conversation" And I will help you with it.
 

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