Nitrates/ Ammonia Ect. Levels & Cycling

[chickennuggets123]

1. When I do a testing, and they all read 0 (i know the pH doesnt) do I have to do that cycling stuff?

2. Can I just add a bit of ammonia, to gradually get the filtre to get used to it (if all other levels read 0)?

 

[ZoddyZod]

1. When I do a testing, and they all read 0 (i know the pH doesnt) do I have to do that cycling stuff?

2. Can I just add a bit of ammonia, to gradually get the filtre to get used to it (if all other levels read 0)?

1 - yes you do - you are getting 0's because you have no fish in the tank. No fish = no waste = no ammonia & nitrite

2. you really need to follow the dosing method for ammonia, you can't just drop a bit in a hope for the best.

 

[Louiseness]

1. The levels read 0 because it's just tap water. As soon as you have an ammonia source (fish, household ammonia) they will soon stop reading 0.

2. That's basically what cycling is.

 

[Rickzayne]

If nitrates read 0 means you havnt cycled yet.

Read the fishless cycle guide it takes 3-6 weeks adding ammonia every few days.

 

[chickennuggets123]

2. That's basically what cycling is.

Really? Thats made it a whole lot more easy to understand!

 

[Louiseness]

Really? Thats made it a whole lot more easy to understand!

it;s a bit tricky to get the hang of at first isn't it!

But in the most basic terms, you add ammonia which feeds the growing bacteria. You just keep feeding until there are enough grown to process all the 'food' in about 24 hrs - then it's safe for fish. Water tests jsut let you know whats going on in there.

However, I'd follow the recommended dosing because adding too much or too little can affect the growth and mean the cycle takes even longer.

 

[chickennuggets123]

Really? Thats made it a whole lot more easy to understand!

it;s a bit tricky to get the hang of at first isn't it!

But in the most basic terms, you add ammonia which feeds the growing bacteria. You just keep feeding until there are enough grown to process all the 'food' in about 24 hrs - then it's safe for fish. Water tests jsut let you know whats going on in there.

However, I'd follow the recommended dosing because adding too much or too little can affect the growth and mean the cycle takes even longer.

Thanks, so what's all this about changing nitrate levels and stuff...? dropping it to 0... another level rises... then another drops ect.

 

[ZoddyZod]

Thanks, so what's all this about changing nitrate levels and stuff...? dropping it to 0... another level rises... then another drops ect.

in a nutshell this is the bacteria cycle that happens in your filter

Fish waste = ammonia
Ammonia eaten by bacteria and produces nitrIte
NitrIte eaten by bacteria and produces nitrAte
NitrAte is removed from the tank by weekly partial water changes.

So it all begins with ammonia and ends up leaving the tank as nitrAte during your water change.

 

[Louiseness]

Thanks, so what's all this about changing nitrate levels and stuff...? dropping it to 0... another level rises... then another drops ect.

Ok, here's my best attempt at explaining cycling simply.

Fish produce waste, which is ammonia (or you copy this by adding ammonia yourself).

Ammonia-eating bacteria (a-bacs) are slowly formed, which eat the toxic ammonia. but they also produce waste, which contains nitrite. This is still toxic to fish.

Then, a second type of bacteria which eat nitrite grow (n-bacs). They absorb all the nitrite and produce nitrate, which is fairly safe and you just remove by changing water.

But the bacteria grow fairly slowly. So you'll get a 'spike' of ammonia, which goes down as the a-bacs eat it. But then you get a spike of nitrite from their waste. This goes down as n-bacs grow and eat it.

Once you've had your ammonia spike and nitrite spike, you know you have both of these bacteria in your filter and that you have a 'cycle' in place

 

[chickennuggets123]

[

in a nutshell this is the bacteria cycle that happens in your filter

Fish waste = ammonia
Ammonia eaten by bacteria and produces nitrIte
NitrIte eaten by bacteria and produces nitrAte
NitrAte is removed from the tank by weekly partial water changes.

So it all begins with ammonia and ends up leaving the tank as nitrAte during your water change.

Thanks, its more understandable now.

Ok, here's my best attempt at explaining cycling simply.

Fish produce waste, which is ammonia (or you copy this by adding ammonia yourself).

Ammonia-eating bacteria (a-bacs) are slowly formed, which eat the toxic ammonia. but they also produce waste, which contains nitrite. This is still toxic to fish.

Then, a second type of bacteria which eat nitrite grow (n-bacs). They absorb all the nitrite and produce nitrate, which is fairly safe and you just remove by changing water.

But the bacteria grow fairly slowly. So you'll get a 'spike' of ammonia, which goes down as the a-bacs eat it. But then you get a spike of nitrite from their waste. This goes down as n-bacs grow and eat it.

Once you've had your ammonia spike and nitrite spike, you know you have both of these bacteria in your filter and that you have a 'cycle' in place

thanks, I really understand it now... but does this process take weeks?

 

[Louiseness]

thanks, I really understand it now... but does this process take weeks?

Unfortunately yep. Unless you can get a piece of mature filter media (sponge, ceramic bits, etc) from a tank that's already cycled, because that already has the bacteria you want on it. Then you can, in theory, add fish immediately.

 

[ZoddyZod]

thanks, I really understand it now... but does this process take weeks?

sadly yes, but it can often be much quicker than the fish-in method and you aren't risking dead fish (and wasted money!).

the good thing about waiting a few weeks whilst you do this, is that it gives you plenty of time to carefully chose the fish you want to keep and are suitable to your tank. This helps prevent mistakes when buying unsuitable fish. Again, this forum will be glad to help you picking the right fish for you.

 

[ParadiseGuerrero]

Really? Thats made it a whole lot more easy to understand!

it;s a bit tricky to get the hang of at first isn't it!

But in the most basic terms, you add ammonia which feeds the growing bacteria. You just keep feeding until there are enough grown to process all the 'food' in about 24 hrs - then it's safe for fish. Water tests jsut let you know whats going on in there.

However, I'd follow the recommended dosing because adding too much or too little can affect the growth and mean the cycle takes even longer.

Thanks, so what's all this about changing nitrate levels and stuff...? dropping it to 0... another level rises... then another drops ect.

The only one you change is the ammonia; the rest will change on there own. The levels will drop as the bacteria 'eats' itb but will at first rise as there is not enough bacteria to eat it.

You add the ammonia in, which feeds the first lot of bacteria and allows it to multiply. However if you think about it, if you feed an animal there will always be some form of waste- this is still true for the bacteria. So the first lot of bacteria 'eat' the ammonia, the waste they produce is called nitrite. This means that as the ammonia lowers the bacteria will are turning it into nitrite- it doesn't just disapear. This is why nitrite levels will rise but nitrite is still toxic.
Luckily there is a second set of bacteria that will eat the nitrite as so these levels will then drop once there is enough bacteria and the waste of these bacteria is in the form of nitrate (note the spelling- an 'a' not an 'i') this is safe for fish unless you let it get rediculusly high- so once the fish are in you just need to do the water changes to keep this down.

Once each set of bacteria has multiplied enough it will be able to process a full amount of ammonia and then nitrite in 24 hours. The tests let you know when the bacteris can do this as all the levels will read as 0 (apart from nitrate) which means you tank has cycled- it is able to eat all the waste a stocked tank would make

the bit about one level rising an the other dropping etc. is just the pattern it takes- if you find a graph thats been plotted to show a cycling tank it looks a lot clearer. In short, levels go up, bacteria eat it and multiply, level drops, they make waste, that waste goes up, differant bacteria eat the waste, waste drops. Last lot of waste is produced which rises slowly and is kept safe by water changes once the fish are in

Does that make any sence? I think I may have started to waffle sorry

 

[chickennuggets123]

Really? Thats made it a whole lot more easy to understand!

it;s a bit tricky to get the hang of at first isn't it!

But in the most basic terms, you add ammonia which feeds the growing bacteria. You just keep feeding until there are enough grown to process all the 'food' in about 24 hrs - then it's safe for fish. Water tests jsut let you know whats going on in there.

However, I'd follow the recommended dosing because adding too much or too little can affect the growth and mean the cycle takes even longer.

Thanks, so what's all this about changing nitrate levels and stuff...? dropping it to 0... another level rises... then another drops ect.

The only one you change is the ammonia; the rest will change on there own. The levels will drop as the bacteria 'eats' itb but will at first rise as there is not enough bacteria to eat it.

You add the ammonia in, which feeds the first lot of bacteria and allows it to multiply. However if you think about it, if you feed an animal there will always be some form of waste- this is still true for the bacteria. So the first lot of bacteria 'eat' the ammonia, the waste they produce is called nitrite. This means that as the ammonia lowers the bacteria will are turning it into nitrite- it doesn't just disapear. This is why nitrite levels will rise but nitrite is still toxic.
Luckily there is a second set of bacteria that will eat the nitrite as so these levels will then drop once there is enough bacteria and the waste of these bacteria is in the form of nitrate (note the spelling- an 'a' not an 'i') this is safe for fish unless you let it get rediculusly high- so once the fish are in you just need to do the water changes to keep this down.

Once each set of bacteria has multiplied enough it will be able to process a full amount of ammonia and then nitrite in 24 hours. The tests let you know when the bacteris can do this as all the levels will read as 0 (apart from nitrate) which means you tank has cycled- it is able to eat all the waste a stocked tank would make

the bit about one level rising an the other dropping etc. is just the pattern it takes- if you find a graph thats been plotted to show a cycling tank it looks a lot clearer. In short, levels go up, bacteria eat it and multiply, level drops, they make waste, that waste goes up, differant bacteria eat the waste, waste drops. Last lot of waste is produced which rises slowly and is kept safe by water changes once the fish are in

Does that make any sence? I think I may have started to waffle sorry

haha it does thanks