New To Shrimp And Hoping For Some Advice

[Jimjim]

Hi all,

I have always wanted some shrimp and my girlfriend bought me an Aqual 40cm/20g tank for Xmas.

She said she looked online and spoke to a few aquatic shops who said that this was a nice tank for shrimp

I have been reading various information online and am a little confused about what I am actually doing as there is so much conflicting information. The box the tank came in has pictures of shrimp on and the adverts say it is the perfect shrimp tank but some of the sites selling shrimp suggest this would not be big enough! I spoke to a man at the local aquatic store today who knew what tank we had and said that bamboo or armoured would be fine in there.

I have purchased a heater and have set it up with it set to 21 degrees. I have added a couple of real plants along with some hiding places (barnacle clusters) and substrate.
I have added a themometer inside and the filter is all set up and running (Aqual mini)
I have also just ordered some ph test strips and will leave this running for a few weeks.

The questions I have if anyone can assist are -

1. Is anyone keeping bamboo or armoured in a similar sized set up?
2. Is there anything I can do to help the tank 'mature' with regards to getting more food ready for adding shrimp?
3. If I was to keep this tank, how many shrimp could happily live in it?


I am in no hurry and want to do this properly so am also open to selling this tank and getting a bigger one if necessary. Any help or tip very welcome.

Thank you all in advance

 

[RyanTheFishGuy64]

Are you sure thats 20g? is looks like 5...lol
Have you ever heard of cycling a tank? It is extremely important, and should be the first step to setting up any tank. It is also the way you get "food" ready for the shrimp. There are many kinds of shrimp that would be happy in there that are much cheaper, like Ghost Shrimp and Cherry Shrimp.

 

[Baccus]

First of all might I congratulate you on having such a wonderful Girlfriend that is happy to indulge your aquatic interests and congratulate you on choosing shrimp. I am a bit of a shrimp fan myself and keep a few species.
I can not comment on that exact tank, but I can tell you the smaller the tank the harder it is to keep the water parameters stable and when things go wrong in a small tank they go wrong quickly, usually with devastating effects. What will help you a lot in this regard too is having a good test kit, stripes are well known in the trade for being the least accurate way of testing water. I would suggest that while you cycle your tank/ filter in readiness for the shrimp you also save up for and get something like an API liquid test kit. Ideally you want to be able to test the cycling tanks water, but I know good test kits are not cheap and can be an expensive investment.
 
Bamboo shrimp are quite a large shrimp and need plenty of water movement to enable them to feed naturally. They will come down and feed on the substrate but its much nicer and better for them to get to eat naturally using their baskets catching floating food in the water currents. Armoured shrimp are generally bigger again and I would strongly suggest that both species of shrimp are better suited to people with more shrimp keeping experience
.
 The best shrimp by far for a new shrimp keeper are Cherry Shrimp, these guys are the least demanding, breed easily and readily. But keep in mind that because of all the selective breeding (line/ inbreeding)  that has occurred to stabilize certain colour morphs of cherry shrimp, notably Green, Orange, Yellow, Black and Blue these colour morphs often are not as "hardy" and forgiving as the original morph Red. I call the Red an original morph because wild Cherry Shrimp are not red, they are mottled brown and the red morph was painstakingly developed from them for the aquarium market. Red Cherry shrimp are only small but they can be amazing to watch and some of the best quality reds really make a wonderful show. If getting cherry shrimp (and this applies to almost all domesticated shrimp) always get the highest grade of shrimp you can afford. It is much easier to offload the resulting offspring if they are good quality rather than low grade culls. It also takes a long time and lots of spare tanks to improve low grades to high grades in your own tanks. Also when purchasing shrimp from a breeder ask them what pH and gH they are keeping the shrimp in. This will go a long way in determining the quality of the colour, and if you can match the breeders water parameters your shrimp are less likely to die off from "pH shock" and maintain the colour you saw on them in the breeders tanks.
 
Once you have the knack of the relatively easy red cherry shrimp then you could venture into the realms of other colour morphs, BUT and its a big one don't mix the various colour morphs together. They are not like paint where if you put red with blue you get purple, instead in the shrimp you will nearly always get brown wild type shrimp that people will generally only take as feeders for fish.
 
Other species of shrimp you could look at are Crystal Reds and Crystal Blacks (again keep these two separate but you can mix one or the other with cherry shrimp), Taiwan Bees, Sulawesi Shrimp, Red Nose Shrimp and even Chameleon Shrimp.
Just when mixing shrimp always make sure they have similar water requirements and they can not cross breed, that is why its so important to know the scientific name of a shrimp rather than some often made up name somebody has given their shrimp in order to make them sound rarer and worth more. Basically if you can find a few reputable sources all calling the shrimp the one name you can be pretty sure its an excepted name within in the trade, if however you can only find one reference and its from the original seller the best guess is its name has been made up.

 

[Jimjim]

Are you sure thats 20g? is looks like 5...lol
Have you ever heard of cycling a tank? It is extremely important, and should be the first step to setting up any tank. It is also the way you get "food" ready for the shrimp. There are many kinds of shrimp that would be happy in there that are much cheaper, like Ghost Shrimp and Cherry Shrimp.

Thank you Ryan
Apologies it is a 20litre not gallon!
Thank you Baccus for such an in depth response.

the size of the shrimp do not matter to me as I find them all fascinating, I just want to be good responsible owner.
The ph kit I will certainly look at and get one so thank you for that advice.

I am happy to spend on high grade so if I was to go for cherry shrimp, how many do you think I should go for? Should I get the water right first and then try a couple adding more from the same supplier if they are doing ok?

This may sound a silly question but are all those you and Ryan mentioned freshwater?

 

[StevenF]

 
 
Apologies it is a 20litre not gallon! 
Thank you Baccus for such an in depth response.

the size of the shrimp do not matter to me as I find them all fascinating, I just want to be good responsible owner.
The ph kit I will certainly look at and get one so thank you for that advice.

That is good to hear because the two shrimp you listed are the largest in the hobby and a 20 liter is probably too small for armored shrimp.  Both of the ones you mentioned are filter feeders  They have baskets for hands and simply Waite in the current for a microscopic bit of food to get caught in the basket. Getting enough diatoms and floating algae in a 20 liter tank to support them might not be easy to do.  Other shrimp actually have very small small hands (you cannot see them) and feed on algae or biofilm on plants and the substrate.  
 
I would recommend starting with  cherry shrimp or Amano shrimp.  Cherry shrimp come in red blue, yellow, and black colors.  Buy only one color of cherry shrimp otherwise they will cross bread and you might end up with a undesirable color.  Cherry shrimp will breed and it should be possible to support a couple of dozen in a 5 gallon.  Other sites state 10 cherry or similar sized shrimp per gallon.  Amano shrimp  in comparison  will not bread in fresh water,  Amano shrimp only bread in b rakish water.
 

 
 
always get the highest grade of shrimp you can afford.

Color grading of shrimp is typically done for multi color shrimp such as Crystal shrimp species.  Solid color shrimp are typically not color graded.  If you want to sell shrimp you may want to pay attention to grading them.  But If you just want an aquarium with shrimp I would worry about color grading.
 
PH is not necessarily the most important water parameter to monitor.  Total alkalinity is important.  If there is no calcium and magnesium in the water the shrimp cannot molt and will die.  So to prevent very low alkalinity it is probably a good idea to have so sea shells in the tank.  You also need to keep an eye on  ammonia, nitrite and nitrate (forms of nitrogen).  These are toxic to all animals.  Many people cycle new tanks with ammonia to insure bacteria that can process nitrogen are present before adding animals.  However you have added plants.  Plants will process nitrogen if they have enough light and nutrients.  If your plants are growing well you they will likely remove all nitrogen.  Before adding any animal make sure your plants are actively growing  for a couple of weeks before adding shrimp.  Cycling a tank is very important if you add fish because fish produce more waist which generates ammonia.  Shrimp are generally smaller than fish and don't produce much waist. meaning nitrogen problems of a shrimp only tank are lower but you still need to keep an eye on it.

 

[Baccus]

All the shrimp I mentioned are fresh water, although the Rednose shrimp that you are most likely going to be able to get require brackish for their offspring to survive, while the parents remain fresh water. I am lucky in that I have access to a true fresh water rednose shrimp that does successfully have its young in fresh water, but this species I don't think is available readily (if at all) overseas.
 
If you can find a suitable supplier close to you then I would ideally look at around 10 shrimp to start off with. But I would get the tank and filter cycled first before attempting any shrimp. 10 shrimp will give you an easy number to start with and from there it will be relatively easy to check on numbers expanding with breeding.
 
I would not get low grades as the first shrimp for the tank, simply because the low grades will invariably breed and it is nigh on impossible to remove all the tiny shrimplets before they in turn reach breeding age. I as speaking from experience here

, in one tank alone were I am trying to establish a colony of black cherry shrimp, and regularly remove undesirable wild coloured young, I keep finding yet more adult wild colours that have evaded capture, even the odd red one that also avoids any nets. Even if you totally strip the tank removing all plants, gravel and ornaments I can almost guarantee that shrimplets will be left in the last mm of water and will be hidden in the gravel removed as well as hitch hiking on the plant life.
 
If you do get to see the suppliers shrimp take special note of the health of the shrimp. If you see any shrimp (excluding snowball shrimp) with a white milkiness to their body, do not buy any of the shrimp. The white milkiness is a disease that can spread quickly through all the shrimp, has no cure and always eventually means death to the affected shrimp.
 
With the shrimp you may also wish to look into some nice interesting snails that can be kept with the shrimp, snails will help keep the glass algae free and wont bother the shrimp. Snails to avoid are Pond or Bladder snails, most if not all Ramshorn snails and usually Malaysian Trumpet Snails, and with shrimp I also wouldn't keep Assassin snails. The other snails I say to avoid because they can quickly become a pest especially in shrimp tanks.
Which leads me to my next point, any plants you get you want to make sure if they have been treated to kill snails. Usually the chemical used to kill the snails is copper and this is also lethal to shrimp.

 

[Jimjim]

Thank you fish fanatic and Baccus

When I purchased the plants I was told these 2 (along with a few others) were best for the shrimp tanks. They had been grown by the aquatic centre and I was told to just rinse throughly before adding to the tank but no chemicals had been used on them. They were kept in tanks on their own.

There is so much to this I am surprised anyone is able to keep shrimp with just the information given by aquatic stores as they really didn't go in to detail like you have in these posts. They did however say they provide a free water testing service and you just bring in a sample and they will give you a proper reading and a dive on how to change things if necessary. They will not sell fish or shrimp without a water sample which does seem very responsible so that is a good thing.

I am not planning on breeding or selling the shrimp but if they do breed I would much prefer they are given away as shrimp over feeder food so I will stick to a high grade I think.

I have read a lot on healthy shrimp so will make sure I check when I eventually buy them. There are a few specialist breeders within an hours drive so will be able to visit them and talk more.

Baccus - you mention snails but is there a general species that is suitable for keeping with shrimp as I am reading your post that all those you mentioned are a no no?

Thank you for your help, it really is great

 

[Essjay]

Nerite snails are fine with shrimps - and they can't breed in fresh water. If you have a male and female of the same species they will lay eggs but they don't hatch. The come in various species and colours. There are nerites that need marine water but any nerite in a shop freshwater tank will be fine. I have nerites in all my tanks, including the one with cherry shrimps.
 
You really do need your own test kit, you can't rely on a shop for testing - what happens if you need to test when the shop is closed?
And you can't cycle a tank without your own test kit. A tank needs to be cycled before putting shrimps in it.
 
If you have been talking to shops, you won't have been told about cycling a tank. Just to be certain you know what we mean by cycling, can I suggest you read http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/421488-cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first/
It tells you what cycling is, why it is important and how to do it.

 

[Baccus]

Snails will be fine with shrimp, just the more common ones I would avoid.
Nerites are nice and you can get some very nice fresh water varities, other options would be Japanese Trapdoor snails which from memory are in the Notopala species.
You could go with the tried and true apple/ mystery snails but I think they are now banned in the EU, if they are available then they are very common and in my opinion if your going to the effort of high grade shrimp why not go for that something else that's a bit more special.

 

[StevenF]

I have zebrra Nerite snails with shrimp in a  5 gallon.    Just one might be enough to keep the glass clean.  2 would do the job.  They are not agressive and don't ineract with the shrimp.

 

[Jimjim]

Snails will be fine with shrimp, just the more common ones I would avoid.Nerites are nice and you can get some very nice fresh water varities, other options would be Japanese Trapdoor snails which from memory are in the Notopala species.You could go with the tried and true apple/ mystery snails but I think they are now banned in the EU, if they are available then they are very common and in my opinion if your going to the effort of high grade shrimp why not go for that something else that's a bit more special.

Thank you Baccus, I will have a look at those and see what I can find

Nerite snails are fine with shrimps - and they can't breed in fresh water. If you have a male and female of the same species they will lay eggs but they don't hatch. The come in various species and colours. There are nerites that need marine water but any nerite in a shop freshwater tank will be fine. I have nerites in all my tanks, including the one with cherry shrimps.
 
You really do need your own test kit, you can't rely on a shop for testing - what happens if you need to test when the shop is closed?
And you can't cycle a tank without your own test kit. A tank needs to be cycled before putting shrimps in it.
 
If you have been talking to shops, you won't have been told about cycling a tank. Just to be certain you know what we mean by cycling, can I suggest you read http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/421488-cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first/
It tells you what cycling is, why it is important and how to do it.

Thank you Essjay
I have read the post and I think I understand the process but will read it through a couple more times.
I wasn't meaning I would rely on the shop to test the water, I meant that I was pleased they do not sell fish unless they are happy with the water test which i think is a good sign that they do care about their livestock. I will still look to get my own kit and as I said I am in no rush to add anything ( the water and noise of the bubbles is nice on its own)

I will start looking for test kits after work , thank you again

 

[Jimjim]

Hi all,
I have been looking at kits and wondered if the
API freshwater master liquid test kit would be okay to buy?

 

[Baccus]

The API fresh water master kit will be fine, just read all the instructions carefully and allow the proper resting time when testing the water to get a true indication of the water. Depending on the test being done the water can take a few minutes to settle on a final colour that you can then check against the chart supplied in the kit.

 

[Jimjim]

Thank you Baccus

 

[Jimjim]

Hi all,
I finally received the water test kits and the results are as follows -

Ph 7.5
Kh 5
Gh 7
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 2.5 I might have left this a little over the time as the door went but will retest.

The tank has been running now since 2nd January

Do these seem pretty standard for a new set up with 2 live plants?

Many Thanks