New baby swordtails

[fatguppy]

Just sat for 3 hours watching our swordtail pump out fish after fish after fish after.....................................

She was in a birthing tank thingy and is now back home whilst the fry are in the nursery. She had about 40 - 50.

Will the lfs take them off my hands, and if so at about what age? The nursery is only about 35 litres so it's not huge. I assume that there will be some fatalities but my main problem at the mo is that if she is likely to produce as often as suggested from everything I've read - what is the best thing to do?

My mother had a name for the kind of girl these swordtails are

Any advice?

 

[LuBear]

well... for now, the 25L will have to do. But when they get bigger, you'll need a bigger tank or they will probably undergo stress. You can give them to the lfs when they reach maturity... I'm not sure what time that will be for sword tails. But you can also keep them if you want. It's all up to you.

 

[OrkyBetta]

(assuming all of the fry make it,) finding any LFS that will take 40-50 fry is slim to none. I don't mean to come off as rude sounding, as I'm sure you want to be responsible for these babies, but maybe you should have a clear cut plan for the kids next time. Like, tank arrangements, permanent homes, etc etc.

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

Whatever livebearer you should always have posible planned homes for fry before you actually get them, because fry are inevitable in mixed gender groups of livebearers and you will always get them basically. A lfs may accept your fry, but only when they are at least half grown and most likely won't give any money for them as lfs's get livebearers for pennys from breeders unless they are rare specimens.
Personally, i'd put down half the fry if you cannot upgrade to a bigger tank for them as in the current tank they won't have enough space to grow to any decent size and naturally in the wild only a 3rd of them at best would survive- which is why livebearers have evolved to have large batchs of fry. Alternatively you could just put them in the main tank and let nature take its course with your current adult fish.
Feed the fry TetraMinfry or "first bites" by hikari for the first couple of months- i suggest you read up on raising fry in the pinned topics at the top of the livebearer section too .

 

[fatguppy]

No problems with the honestly folks, but what does everyone else do? It appears to me that these lfs (!) sell swordtails without any understanding of the consequences. Is it normal for peeps to allow livebearers to have their young in the tank and allow "nature to take it's course" as in they all get eaten?

I am not sentimental - it is obvious that I would like us all have an ideal scenario whereby these babies are farmed out to be looked after by someone else, but in all honesty with the live bearers - it cannot be practical.

Do peeps whose fish have fry just not bother with all the fuss and let them be eaten - and allow the professional breeders to do it properly?

If that is the case so be it! I have to say the the first brood our swordtail had was completely missed - we were so new to the game - and it was impossible to tell that she was pregnant. She just looked plumper. We put it down to better tank conditions! About two weeks later I saw a fry happily swimming round the tank. He was obviously happy, well fed and had avoided predators. He is also in the nursery tank - being about 4 weeks old and we will keep him. He must be fiesty to have avoided all those predators!

I think I just have understood that it is totally impractical for any lfs to take all the fry - I do realise that some will simply die because they are not healthy enough. I do not expect to make any money out of it!

I suppose my bottom line question is - do peeps who keep live bearers as a hobby rather than a commercial venture actualy bother to look after the fry or do they allow the "survival of the fittest" scenario to come into play and leave the females to give birth and the fry to be eaten, apart from the absolute super healthy speciments.

I have enjoyed the experience of watching the fry be born and was totally fascinated, but realise that live bearers are so prolific and the chances of them achieving adulthood with our limited resources are slim. And obviously we are not the only keepers of live bearers in the area!

My personal feeling is that given our resources we cannot in all honesty become serious breeders (nor would I want to) therefore we must let the swordies have their young as often as they choose and just ignore the whole process?

Comments anyone - I would be interested!

 

[fatguppy]

Just a PS - I have read everything on the forum and other stuff as well - I am not uninformed - just trying to be realistic.

 

[Polardbear]

I breed swordies as a seriuos hobby. I try to save some of each batch as I'm breeding specifically for hi fin and lyretail traits however I do not try to save every single one of them. It's a gamble which ones I save though as usually only about 25% of a batch is going to have the traits I want and they don't show up for a couple of weeks. I am fortunate though in that I have several friends and coworkers that will take the non-keepers off of my hands. I also have lightly stocked 75 and 55 gallon tanks for the keepers to move into. I have 4 10 gallon fry tanks going most of the time. I haven't tried offering any to the LFS yet, mainly because of the abominal conditions they keep live bearers in. I have considered advertising in the local free papers and am also considering using aquabid in the future for at least some of the lyretails. I'm also quite willing to buy additonal tanks for my babies as needed down the road. I do realize that at some point I will run out of room for them and will need to either cut down on the numbers I save or get a bigger house. I hope the day never comes that I start arbitrarily putting them down simply because I can't find homes for them, I have no problem with culling deformed or sick ones but I think it's wrong to just kill them because I don't have room.

 

[paulthegreat]

I have been lucky enough to have three different stores in my area that actually buy them from me. I have sold 40 juveniles so far but the stores will only buy or even take them if they are 3-4cm or better. They are also not interested in buying more then ten to fifteen at a time. I have also been informed by the stores that they are going to be on a buying hold during the summer since fish sales go way down. I am going to let the mommies birth in the main tank and let nature take it's course. Hopefully in the fall I will have a good batch of nearly mature fish for sale.

 

[Iron Man]

I bought new swordtails about two months ago and one of the females has had her first fry a couple hrs ago after I did a major water change. I didn't plan on putting too many more in the main tank but I did save this one and I may save a couple more. If you don't want them all you have to do is put them back in the main tank. They will be gone before you know it.

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

Well...im running a guppy project in one of my tanks into the effects of inbreeding while also trying to breed high quality hardy strains of guppys as the species has been ruined in many ways by inbreeding.
In general though i let nature tanke its course to a certain extent.
a. All my tanks are very heavily planted and all mixed gender groups of livebearers has many females(gupps=6females to one male, platys are currently 1male per 4females) apart from my mollys which are 2females and a male but they rarely ever breed due to one of the females being sterile and the male being very docile/not agressive to the females at all.
The importance of this is that it allows me to let my females give birth in the main tanks without me having to worry about the males over-harrassing the females before, during and after giving birth- too much harrassment and the female can abort her fry and/or die. I select my male livebearers so they are the least agressive towards the females but also have good strong genes.
b. Guppy project fry pretty much all get saved- they are left in the guppy tank for 4-5days before being collected and put in the fry tank where from then on they get total protection.
My neon tetras, khuli loachs and female mollys gobble up any fry and can even the largest batchs can be devoured within a week so any unwanted fry are put in the main tank to be eaten.
c. As for raising fry i take great care so that no 2 related(even distantly related) can breed when they are older to prevent the effects of over inbreeding and help keep gene pools strong and healthy- this results in overall much healthier adult fish and future fry in the long term.
d. I have an agreement where my lfs takes my fry once they are half grown for free how ever many i have- this also contributes to me getting the once every now and then discount on pet/fish stuff
e. Even though my lfs takes fish i have bred off me i still end up with to many to raise once in a while which is why i do 2nd paragraph of .b.

 

[fatguppy]

Thanks for all that info peeps - I do appreciate it.

It seems so cruel but at the end of the day we do not have the facilties to cope with a major breeding programme. We do not know how healthy or otherwise the fry are - at present they are from two completely unrelated parents - we know this because we bought them from two completly unconnected lfs. However, I am fully aware that if we put any surviving maturish fry back into the main tank- then we have got major problems of interbreeding. I am also very aware of the fact that we have an established tank with (obviously) happy fish - and I do not want to upset that balance.

Whilst I take on the points from you polardbear, you do say that yours is a serious breeding hobby whilst ours is a desire to run a fully functional happy tank of fish without going any further into the hobby.

We have more or less decided to "let nature take its course" in the future. I have to say that it doesn't sit completely happily with me - but I can only put it this way - we have neither the resources nor the desire to breed seriously (I am talking about the fish ); I cannot guarantee to any lfs the quality of the fry that are being bred; breeding fry that are not healthy is completely pointless from any point of view; and finally if it distressed the female in any way I would have a different attitude, but as the mother happily eats her own offspring - why the hell should I worry!

I do feel bad at present - but from a totally practical point of view - I guess I will accept that we canot be all things to all fish.

And whilst I'm having this debate with myself and you - my corys have started to produce eggs!

And that's another story...................................

 

[Jen21]

I have livebearers and I try to save all the babies I can! I usually put the babies in a tank and then I give them away to people that I know will take good care of them. I also try to raise the babies... maybe you can find someone who will take the fry