My Celebes Fry Updated: 10 Fry Now

[mikev]

Whatever I have and can breed, sure. I don't have Kamaka -- it is just not possible to keep every species especially that I like to have large shoals in separate tanks and I did not like them all that much -- but I know a couple of people who can donate the eggs, so this should be possible. My current collection of smaller bows consists of parva, praecox (pagai), macs (skull creek), pygmeae, and sexlineata... three can be bred any time, other two are close to maturity.

I don't have herbs either, and feel jealous.... but no way I'm setting yet another large bow tank now.

As for breeding... most species are very similar in terms of what one does and learns... you know one, you know most... if you have space, nothing wrong to breed just a few more herbs for a larger shoal, whether they are hybrids or not (they are probably not, but you'll never know for sure). I.werneri's are worth breeding, because they will be dead in two years from old age... and you will feel really sorry... I did when I allowed my first shoal to die out.

 

[myrtle]

I do know one person who has aquired F2 M praecox 'Pagai' and I may be able to get some eggs when they start to breed but at the moment they are still juvies. He drove to Europe to pick them up, so kudos to him for doing that!!
I may have a go with my I werneri in the summer when I can get some green water cultures going outside.
I have posted the images of the herbies on rainbowfish.info and I'm very much looking forward to hearing what the experts think!

 

[myrtle]

The Hikari First bites, whilst not the best, have certainly improved the survival of my fry! I now have 4, one of which is almost 3 weeks old. I have upped the temperature and am waiting for my Brine Shrimp to hatch. I checked out ZM foods and it appears that they also do starter cultures of paramecium, rotifers etc so it looks like I will be able to try breeding my Threadfins sooner than I anticipated! It also helps that they are only down the road from me! Next month (once I get paid!) I am going to purchase the ZM food and place the mop back in the tank for the Celebes. Which size food do you recommend I buy? I was thinking that the smallest would possibly be too small so ws looking at the next size up, but am not sure...

 

[Sanj]

The Hikari First bites, whilst not the best, have certainly improved the survival of my fry! I now have 4, one of which is almost 3 weeks old. I have upped the temperature and am waiting for my Brine Shrimp to hatch. I checked out ZM foods and it appears that they also do starter cultures of paramecium, rotifers etc so it looks like I will be able to try breeding my Threadfins sooner than I anticipated! It also helps that they are only down the road from me! Next month (once I get paid!) I am going to purchase the ZM food and place the mop back in the tank for the Celebes. Which size food do you recommend I buy? I was thinking that the smallest would possibly be too small so ws looking at the next size up, but am not sure...

Hi Jo,

I did not see this post before. I do use the Sera micon I think I got it from Aquaessentials and i have found it to be pretty good, high algae content which is always a good thing for bows. I also culture vinegar eels. As for Goldern Pearls you can source them from here:Golden Pearls I am using the 50 micron food along with the other foods mentioned with my fry.

 

[elisew]

Glad things seem to be going ok with the Celebes Jo. I`m envious but so chuffed for you!!

 

[myrtle]

How stupid am I? That's the same place I got my Brine Shrimp cysts from and I never even saw the Golden Pearls. That's so typical of me

.

Hi Lisa! I'm really glad I've got this proof that they like my tank so you know they're well looked after! Once I get a few more feel free to have some if you ever have room!

 

[elisew]

How stupid am I? That's the same place I got my Brine Shrimp cysts from and I never even saw the Golden Pearls. That's so typical of me

.

Hi Lisa! I'm really glad I've got this proof that they like my tank so you know they're well looked after! Once I get a few more feel free to have some if you ever have room!

Jo if I ever have another community tank for tropicals I`ll be giving you a shout, don`t worry about that

I never had any doubts about them going to a good home and being looked after

 

[myrtle]

Quick question: I still have 4 fry at a month old now and I have noticed over the last couple of days that the oldest (only by a few days) is constantly chasing the others around the tank. Is this something to be expected even with such a small age gap (it is only marginally larger than the others)? They are in a 35l tank which is only half filled so there's plenty of space for them as they are still only a little over 1cm long!
Plus, any hints on hatching the brine shrimp? I don't seem to be doing so well on that front...

 

[drobbyb]

It could be a dominant fish, or one who is developing slightly faster than the others. Once you switch over to brine shrimp, the others will catch up.

It's very easy to hatch brine shrimp. They only require a few things to hatch. You need to heat their water to 80F and provide the right kind of salt, and you need a light source, an airpump, and a container.

I take a 2 liter bottle and cut it in half, insert the cap end upside down into the other end. I then take a piece of rigid airline tubing and place it inside the cap end, add 3 tablespoons of Ice Cream salt (about a dollar at the supermarket for a good sized box) and fill with warm tap water. I start the aeration and let the salt dissolve. Once it is totally dissolved, I add a light (60 watt light bulb) a few inches away (a desk lamp works well) and a measure of brine shrimp eggs (artemia cysts.)

I leave the solution bubbling for 24 hours in a warm room. After 24 hours there should be thousands of little orange spots that move around. These are the baby brine shrimp. You want to harvest them as soon as you can to make sure they they are still nutritious. Generally, I start a new culture every morning, that way I will always have freshly hatched brine shrimp to feed to my fry.

 

[mikev]

"Aggressive fry" is most likely trying to eat the smaller fry... they may do it unless fed frequently -- several times per day.
I have not seen such behavior from celebes (which proves nothing -- all of mine were fed well and are about the same size), but rainbow fry of other species can be aggressive to smaller fry even when fed well.... particularly bad are p.gertrudae and m.boesemani.. g.dorytie that I'm raising now may be the worst yet...fortunately they are all of the same size, but they already fight!

To add to Robby's instructions:

Important: alkaline water! Add 1/4 teaspoon of soda to your 1L of water *if your water is neutral to start with*. Otherwise, figure out how much to add to get pH to 7.5 or above; brine shrimp will not hatch well at lower pH.

Important: small artemia packages one buys at lfs have lousy yields to start with... see if you can find high quality cysts.

hth

 

[drobbyb]

Oh yeah! I forgot the baking soda. Thanks mike

 

[myrtle]

Thanks for the info, I didn't know about the pH or the light bulb which may be why nothing actually hatched! I've just received starter cultures of Vinegar eels and pramecium so hopefully there will be a better chance with attempting to raise the I werneri.

The 4 fry are being fed on the ZM food now and hopefully once I can actually get the hang of brine shrimp hatching they'll catch up as you say. Just had 2 more eggs hatch whist typing this rply (only picked them 3 days ago so they must have been closer than I thought to hatching! Don't worry, I won't put them in with the older fry!

 

[myrtle]

Thanks to your advice my brine shrimp have now started hatching (yay!) and the fry have had their first taste of proper live food! Of the 3 that hatched yesterday only one has survived with one dying within 2 hours of hatching even though there was food available. The other death was odd, the fry never moved from the bottom of the tank and fed on the food that had reached the bottom. That one survived 1 day which makes me think that it was a defectin the fry as opposed to lack of food etc. At least the title to this thread is correct again!

 

[drobbyb]

The hardest part I have found is getting to the bbs stage. Usually once they get large enough to eat bbs, they survive.

The last group of M. lacustris I bred, I think had 137 fry hatch (from one mop!) and I believe I raised 133 or 135 of them to juvenile size before I sold them.


Here's a few pics of the fry tanks during that period:

Tank 1 of 2

3 month old fry ready to go to the LFS for sale (this is half of a 30 gallon long, I also had a 28 gallon but I didn't take a picture at this stage of it)

Here's a few of 2 day old M. duboulayi fry:

 

[mikev]

Deaths within hours of hatching are usually not because of food. Possible causes: weak fry / bad water / temperature fluctuation.

For example, I killed three perfectly good babies a few days ago by using a new heater that turned out to be unstable so much for using cheap brands.

A fry that stays at the bottom often does not survive. Ditto for fry that spins, and often fry that swims in circles. These kinds of things are more common in some species (M.macculochi are very prone to it), and also may be indications of parents not being in the best shape.

Now that you mastered artemia, give some to the parents too... makes them happier and healthier, leading to better fry... I feed artemia to all my smaller rainbows.

.....

Robby, you don't have those dubs anymore, right?